Hunter Question

Hi all,
so I have been running my hunter with 2 warlocks, resto druid and a pally tank and I am a little frustrated with the hunter. He currently buffed has about 5500 attack power and his hit rating is over 300 but in fights he gives poor results. I am pretty much doing a cookie cutter click macro rotation taken from here with comma's optimized.
Hunter is MM spec and so I am wondering would BM spec be more consistant damage? I would think there are more issues keeping pets alive as a BM?
Anyone got any hints or help? For last week I have been dropping him out of my group in favor of my lesser geared arcane mage and I am now wondering should I drop him completely or is there something I am missing.
Btw I also use a wolf as the pet with my hunter.
Thanks all :confused:

Hi,

Having boxed 3 hunters one of each spec since release of WoTLk I have alot of feedback and info.

1st your hunter is geared/gemmed all wrong, any +hit over 263 is complete waste, you spent 500-600 gp worth of +hit gems to no use, replace with +agi/crit or anything else that is not +hit, the +hit trinket is also not doing anything good atm but keep it cause you might need it should you run into +hit issues when going below 263

2nd MM hunter is the worst to box, you say "cokkie cutter" macro, MM dont have any macro that even comes close to the dps you can do playing it SINGLE style, please post you macros.

Ive written gazillions macros for the 3 specs tried it all, only reason i still have the MM hunter spec is because trueshot aura buff it gives my 2 other hunters plus the paladin consider you run with casters it also is a waste.

I run a paly x3 hunter and a priest in my team.

dps is always as follows

BM hunter 4500dps on HC boss
SV hunter 4000 dps on HC boss
MM hunter 3500+ dps on HC boss

Reason for why BM hunter always comes out on top is cause thats where you have the most automation and cokkie cutter macros SV hunter requires carefull timing of LnL procs and thats basically impossible in 5 boxing, MM hunter is even worse when it comes to shot rotation.

I realise my post will be very long if I put all my reflections in one post but ill give you some very quick tips that I am very certain will boost your hunter dps with 1k

I would assume your current HC boss dps is like 2k, with respecing to BM getting new pet and some "cokkie cutter " ;) macros you will reach dps 3.5-4k very soon.

If you have more DPS you are doing better then I did when my MM had that lvl of gear, but I respec and rewrite macros all the time to try out new things :)

BM spec, nothing really need to be said, alot of info out there use any recomended BM spec tho i usually tailor it to the fact that i BoX and dont play single hunter.

PET - go get a Saur, Devilsaur or any saur you can find, Netherstorm has the easiest Devilsaur to tame, or ungoro crater, these can only be used with the 51 pts BM talent, this pet alone will do 1.7-2k dps, talk about automation (my assestment 3.5-4k dps is including the pet ofc)

dps Macro,

BW and KM with correct glyphs and spec are on a such quick CD that i never "save" them I just fire and forgett, Multi-Shot HM and KS i have mapped to other buttons.

With this setup DON'T glyph Serpent Sting, go för BM (ofc) Steady and KS

using Keyclone on my hunter i have Mapped E to the following macro-

/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/assist "tankname"
/petattack
/startattack
/cast !Auto-Shot
/castrandom Arcane Shot,
/castsequence reset=6 Steady Shot,
/castsequence reset=6 Arcane Shot, Serpent Sting,
/use 13
/use 14
/cast Kill Command
/cast Bestial Wrath
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()

on Q i have the following macro

/assist "tank"
/castsequence reset=target Hunter's Mark, Kill Shot, Kill Shot, Kill Shot

You will not get more then 3 KS on ANY HC boss encounter ;)

on R i have

/cast [target="TANKNAME"] Misdirect

I could go on about tips and tricks for ALL the HC instances with regards to HUNTERS but try this 1st and if you like it or not please reply :)

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PET - go get a Saur, Devilsaur or any saur you can find, Netherstorm has the easiest Devilsaur to tame, or ungoro crater, these can only be used with the 51 pts BM talent, this pet alone will do 1.7-2k dps, talk about automation (my assestment 3.5-4k dps is including the pet ofc)

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Technically your are correct - but the size of the damn dino will cause hit box problems and just be an annoyance in general. I prefer wolves myself

As far as building a MM macro - if the rotation on maxdps.com is correct, I could EASILY build that macro. The only problem with Surv. is the damn LnL proc
http://maxdps.com/hunter/marksmanship.php.

EDIT: Just removed the MM tree on wowpopular to make sure it hasn't changed.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#cxbZzeVoRhzGIsguAox00b

I don't see any proc based abilities - the only thing you'd have to manage is Rapid FIre - Readiness - Rapid Fire, the rest appears to be a static priority system.

So where are you guys having problems building a macro for MM? Seems straight forward to me.

good question (about MM macro)

The issue was never really to write the macro, my issue was always that whatever i did my BM would always have better dps and my only explanation was that the rotation was to complex to ever become better then the BM box macro.

Lets ponder some info

1 Serpent Sting, since Chimera Refresh this you dont really want to cast this more then once, the way I box dedicate one button to fire once became inefficent, ive done some workaround assuming mobs go down after a certain time

2 Silent Shot - 20 sec cooldown,

3 Chimera Shot with glyph 9 sec cooldown

4 Aimed Shot 10 sec cooldown

5 Arcane Shot 6 sec cooldown, only time you really exclude this from rotation as they have on max dps is if you are an ArP Pen MM hunter but I always got better result excluding this when i boxed the MM hunter tho still when i single play I include it.

6 Steady Shot, this should be weaved in so you max dps while all other shots are on CD

Using the principle of KISS (keep it simple stupid) ;) the BM will always win over MM in a 5 box team simply because of simplicity and automation and with todays moving like crazy encounters i like the fact that i can focus more on moving then pressing the correct macro when to max dps.

I still love my MM hunter and the role he has in my 5 box team but I have resigned to the fact that when it comes to steady and consistent DPS the BM will (gear being equal) always come out on top :)

BUT I still 1.5 years later learn new things about boxing and using ALL my hunters abilities like traps, tranq shot, scatter, viper, concussion etc etc thats where they shine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mmmbox

good question (about MM macro)

The issue was never really to write the macro, my issue was always that whatever i did my BM would always have better dps and my only explanation was that the rotation was to complex to ever become better then the BM box macro.

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Do you know what a /click macro is?

Quote:

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Lets ponder some info

1 Serpent Sting, since Chimera Refresh this you dont really want to cast this more then once, the way I box dedicate one button to fire once became inefficent, ive done some workaround assuming mobs go down after a certain time

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/castsequence reset=target/combat serpent sting,null

Quote:

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2 Silent Shot - 20 sec cooldown,

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/castsequence silent shot,,,,,,,,,,,,(tune)

Quote:

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3 Chimera Shot with glyph 9 sec cooldown

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See silent shot.

Quote:

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4 Aimed Shot 10 sec cooldown

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See silent shot

Quote:

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5 Arcane Shot 6 sec cooldown, only time you really exclude this from rotation as they have on max dps is if you are an ArP Pen MM hunter but I always got better result excluding this when i boxed the MM hunter tho still when i single play I include it.

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See silent shot - or just put it on a seperat button.

Quote:

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6 Steady Shot, this should be weaved in so you max dps while all other shots are on CD

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Put at button of click rotation.

Quote:

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Using the principle of KISS (keep it simple stupid) ;) the BM will always win over MM in a 5 box team simply because of simplicity and automation and with todays moving like crazy encounters i like the fact that i can focus more on moving then pressing the correct macro when to max dps.

I still love my MM hunter and the role he has in my 5 box team but I have resigned to the fact that when it comes to steady and consistent DPS the BM will (gear being equal) always come out on top :)

BUT I still 1.5 years later learn new things about boxing and using ALL my hunters abilities like traps, tranq shot, scatter, viper, concussion etc etc thats where they shine.

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There, now you've got some info to digest and some macros to write. :)

So as an update, I moved my BM hunter off his old realm and put him into my group, He is mostly in blues and need some work but I already think the dps looks a lot more consistant than MM.
I got a devilsaur also for this toon and am busy leveling the new pet now.
Thanks for the pointers :)

thanks for the advice, i wansnt aware of the "null" pointer in a macro.

I rewrote my MM macros compleatly

/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/assist "tankname"
/petattack
/startattack
/cast !Auto-Shot
/castrandom Chimera Shot,
/castsequence reset=target Hunter's Mark, Serpent Sting, null,
/castsequence reset=9 Chimera Shot,
/use 13
/use 14
/cast Kill Command
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()

This is now an awesome MM macro that is also very viable for Single play MM hunters also, it will MARK, STING before CS but not recast HM or SS before i switch targets.

Love this forum!!! (and the ppl in it)
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Sorry for the hijack and i realise it became a Marco theme, but the macros and class viability is very closely knitted together in this discussion :)

So last night I took two dinos (the ones from Ungoro Crater) into some dungeons, it was so fun, both dinos are not 80 yet but only got killed once. I really like the BM spec for the movement fights cause the boss AoE does not seem to hit them very hard and they continue to dps the boss while the team moves and runs.
All in all it was fun, I think over the next week or so I will duel spec both hunters and see how they do in both specs.
Currently really liking BM though, especially for off tanking larger mobs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

So as an update, I moved my BM hunter off his old realm and put him into my group, He is mostly in blues and need some work but I already think the dps looks a lot more consistant than MM.
I got a devilsaur also for this toon and am busy leveling the new pet now.
Thanks for the pointers :)

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The other day I went and got 5 devilsaurs. Trying to get them all leveled.

Well the leveling goes REALLY fast in dungeons, one of mine is already 79, I believe they also lowered the xp per level for pets. The other cool thing compared to when I leveled pets before is that they automatically level the pet to 75 from it's original level before you trained them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mmmbox

thanks for the advice, i wansnt aware of the "null" pointer in a macro.

I rewrote my MM macros compleatly

/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/assist "tankname"
/petattack
/startattack
/cast !Auto-Shot
/castrandom Chimera Shot,
/castsequence reset=target Hunter's Mark, Serpent Sting, null,
/castsequence reset=9 Chimera Shot,
/use 13
/use 14
/cast Kill Command
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()

This is now an awesome MM macro that is also very viable for Single play MM hunters also, it will MARK, STING before CS but not recast HM or SS before i switch targets.

Love this forum!!! (and the ppl in it)
---------------------------------------
Sorry for the hijack and i realise it became a Marco theme, but the macros and class viability is very closely knitted together in this discussion :)

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I believe the null in your castsequence will stop this macro from completing. You need to visit the /click macro thread to see how to get null in there. I could be wrong though!

I know nothing about hunters, but I'm guessing Chimera Shot has a cooldown. If so, then I believe the macro posted will hang on "/castrandom Chimera Shot, " if the random chooses Chimera Shot while on cooldown. It will only resume when the cooldown is up and can successfully execute the option. They changed the /castrandom functionality months ago (back then it would have worked).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

Well the leveling goes REALLY fast in dungeons, one of mine is already 79, I believe they also lowered the xp per level for pets. The other cool thing compared to when I leveled pets before is that they automatically level the pet to 75 from it's original level before you trained them.

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Per the latest patch notes:

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Pet Leveling: Hunter pets now need only 5% of the experience a player needs to level, down from 10%.

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Originally Posted by Multibocks

I believe the null in your castsequence will stop this macro from completing. You need to visit the /click macro thread to see how to get null in there. I could be wrong though!

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No thats the beauty of it, don't know if its a bug or if blizzard didnt think of that combo but once i learned to use a combo of castsequence and castrandom my macros became very powerfull

I personally dont like the klickmacros hence i use the combo i mentioned for all my hunter macros.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Owltoid

I know nothing about hunters, but I'm guessing Chimera Shot has a cooldown. If so, then I believe the macro posted will hang on "/castrandom Chimera Shot, " if the random chooses Chimera Shot while on cooldown. It will only resume when the cooldown is up and can successfully execute the option. They changed the /castrandom functionality months ago (back then it would have worked).

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the "comma" after chimera shot in the /castrandom is critical if its not there then the macro will hang.

as I said the combo is very veird but if you write it as I have it works.

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Edit

As a side note, i was running some tests to verify its functionality and it ALWAYS Casts hunter mark, serpent sting BEFORE it ever fires of Chimera Shot which is what you want as a MM hunter.

there is no delay in CS it fires the instant the CD is down.

Macro with all non-abilities deleted:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mmmbox

/cast !Auto-Shot
/castrandom Chimera Shot,
/castsequence reset=target Hunter's Mark, Serpent Sting, null,
/castsequence reset=9 Chimera Shot,
/cast Kill Command

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So you turn on Auto-Shot, pop a Hunter's Mark and Serpent Sting and then just Chimera Shot? This is good dps? What about Kill Shot, Aimed Shot, Arcane Shot, Steady Shot? You just Auto-Shot during the 10s cooldown?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thinus

Macro with all non-abilities deleted:



So you turn on Auto-Shot, pop a Hunter's Mark and Serpent Sting and then just Chimera Shot? This is good dps? What about Kill Shot, Aimed Shot, Arcane Shot, Steady Shot? You just Auto-Shot during the 10s cooldown?

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No, it was merly a sollution to a problem i have had with MM macros and a problem you have when boxing hunters as per the ORIGINAL posters question hence my recomendation to go BM since its way easier to Macro a BM hunter then a MM hunter.

It feels a bit like you jumped into the discussion without reading all posts :)

anyway, my macro had atm nothing really to do with MM dps but for the moment it was a test to solve how to weave serpent sting into a MM macro without recasting it since CS refreshes it when it is cast.

I use a variant of my previously posted BM macro for Aimed and Steady, Arcane is left out.

basically i use Q E R T and F mapped to different macros depending on situation (with keyclone)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mmmbox

No, it was merly a sollution to a problem i have had with MM macros and a problem you have when boxing hunters as per the ORIGINAL posters question hence my recomendation to go BM since its way easier to Macro a BM hunter then a MM hunter.

It feels a bit like you jumped into the discussion without reading all posts :)

anyway, my macro had atm nothing really to do with MM dps but for the moment it was a test to solve how to weave serpent sting into a MM macro without recasting it since CS refreshes it when it is cast.

I use a variant of my previously posted BM macro for Aimed and Steady, Arcane is left out.

basically i use Q E R T and F mapped to different macros depending on situation (with keyclone)

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Are you running a mixed group? How are you pressing multiple buttons for dps and monitoring cooldowns? The whole beauty of the /click approach is a 1-button priority system that overcomes cooldown hell.

With /click Macros, MM should always be the top DPS. BM just doesn't have what it takes to keep up in terms of raw DPS output. With /click Macros, I wasn't doing my max DPS against a Target Dummy, but it wasn't so far off that I'd go spec something else.

So I ran both hunters as BM with their lvl 80 pets and I took a BM click macro from here and I am still not too sure which to stay with.
So as a follow up question, if I go back to MM should I respec my pets in any way or does the spec not matter unless you wanted to tank with the pets? Currently I turn off all the taunts for my pets so that they do not create any aggro except from pute dps.

i just did a Heroic PoS and one of the worst fight in there is Ick (for me) crazy movement constant interupts due to movement etc, just before the end the BM pet died

But the pulled a 1600 dps doing 130k dmg the other 2 hunterpets did 40k dmg 500 dps each

as i said before my BM hunter is atm the worst geared (still pretty good 232 overall) but when it really counts you cant neglect the efficiency of the BM pet.

Foregemaster garon was shredded unfortunately i did not have the numbers from that fight.

I will never argue that one on one the BM does best dps, but from a purely boxing perspective you cant neglect the efficiency of the BM on the most painfull of HC bosses which for me atm is PoS and endboss in FoS, i still manage them but íts a rare occation that all come out alive.

I run a paladin 3 hunters (BM SV MM) and a priest healer.

I run a mix of click and pure macros for tranq shots and kill shots, also you cant /click the SV hunter due to LnL so i combine tranq shot and Expl shot in a ordinary macro.

I really love my hunters and the things i have tuned them for to get me throu all the instances, like when i did UP HC and the gaunlet, i got 3 apes just to manage all the adds back when i was all in blue and whiped like crazy due to not being able tank all adds and kill them fast enough (this was before thunderstomp became mandatory tenacity ability)

anyway best of luck :)

So I am still not really happy with my hunters but have a question on the hunter himself. After a fear or where my toons are following the tank my hunter ends up just doing dps with his two hand weapon due to being too close to the target. How is this being handled by other boxers?
Also in the pet builds, are people using the talent which keeps the pet happy when killing stuff? Or using food to keep the pet happy?
Thanks for all the help

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

So I am still not really happy with my hunters but have a question on the hunter himself. After a fear or where my toons are following the tank my hunter ends up just doing dps with his two hand weapon due to being too close to the target. How is this being handled by other boxers?
Also in the pet builds, are people using the talent which keeps the pet happy when killing stuff? Or using food to keep the pet happy?
Thanks for all the help

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What is this "food" of which you speak?

[edit] Obvious rationale: the +happiness pet talent is bundled with healing abilities on ferocity/tenacity pets, so you'd be rather silly not to take that talent, IMO.

The happiness talent is not in many cookie cutter pet builds due to trying to get max pts into dps pet talents and this is only possible by not putting points into this talent.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

Also in the pet builds, are people using the talent which keeps the pet happy when killing stuff? Or using food to keep the pet happy?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

The happiness talent is not in many cookie cutter pet builds due to trying to get max pts into dps pet talents and this is only possible by not putting points into this talent.

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So your question was rhetorical?

No I was wondering what multiboxers were doing, i.e. were they using that talent or feeding pets to keep them happy. Currently I am feeding my pets but it can mean a loss of 50% dps if a pet becomes unhappy and does not get fed.
Just trying to see what others are doing, not rhetorical. in fact I am wondering what talent trees people are using for their hunter pets in general when boxing.
Sorry for any confusion in my question

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crowdx

So I am still not really happy with my hunters but have a question on the hunter himself. After a fear or where my toons are following the tank my hunter ends up just doing dps with his two hand weapon due to being too close to the target. How is this being handled by other boxers?
Also in the pet builds, are people using the talent which keeps the pet happy when killing stuff? Or using food to keep the pet happy?
Thanks for all the help

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Hunters should swap between ranged and melee depending on distance. I know it used to be an option, but it should be the default action now. Strafe or back arrow is usually enough to separate a cluster. After fearbombs, I tend to use a focusing lens to get her facing the right direction.

My Spirit Beast has 1/2 in Bloodthirsty {happiness + heal}, which I'm probably going to swap around to Great Stamina. Glyph of Mend Pet is a Minor Glyph and should be enough to keep your pet at full happiness, unless you refuse to ever heal your pet.

In any case, I don't carry food to keep my pet happy. I just make it a point to buy food for my hunter that my pet can eat, so if I ever really, really need to feed my pet, he can just have what I'm already carrying.