The Banned thread

[MiRai]

You can't explain to me how you're swapping window focus - that is an action that must be taken by a vanilla user, and using round robin completely circumvents it.

I would never consider changing window focus to be an in-game action since it's a function of the operating system, but if what you say is true, then...

Two Mapped Keys:
Pressing F1, from Slot 1, sends F1 to Slot 1
Pressing F2, from Slot 1, sends F1 to Slot 2

Those are two completely separate Mapped Keys not using round-robin, but they can both function just fine w/o having to change window focus, so... Where (or when) is the window focus change happening in my example?

[LordsServant]

I would never consider changing window focus to be an in-game action since it's a function of the operating system, but if what you say is true, then...

Two Mapped Keys:
Pressing F1, from Slot 1, sends F1 to Slot 1
Pressing F2, from Slot 1, sends F1 to Slot 2

Those are two completely separate Mapped Keys not using round-robin, but they can both function just fine w/o having to change window focus, so... Where (or when) is the window focus change happening in my example?

It's happening when you press f2. You instantly swap focus to slot 2 and send the f1 there. If you say "but I'm still focused on window 1" then it's even worse - you're swapping focus to window 2, activating a command, then swapping back to window 1 all in one go.

Even if you want to argue that it's not for arguments sake - vanilla players cannot do the same thing no matter what.

It's been well established for a very long time (see: Bacon back in 2007 or something, along with many others) that using a program that specifically gives you the ability to do something impossible to do as a player in the vanilla game is a big "NOAP."

Isboxer entirely aside, throwing commands out to various clients without having to swap windows/window focus is entirely against the EULA for that reason.

I'm happy to casually debate in a friendly manner, but the evidence speaks for itself - I'm not banned, despite CCP having an EXTREMELY close look at my actions and accounts, while everyone who we know for a FACT has been petitioned that uses round robin/rollover - has been banned.

Looks pretty cut and dry to me.

[bugme143]

Getting a statement out of CCP is like squeezing blood out of a rock. CCP gave us said guideline and then went and banned people for crossing over it. GG.

[shadowandlight]

Here is the real issue for me ATM.

Input Duplication - Considered now against the EULA. Ok Fine.

Video FX - No explanation
Round-Robin - No explanation
Rollover - No Explanation

Each one of these can be used to emulate someone using Input Duplication (but make no mistake to those who don't use these tools, they are NOT sending more then 1 command to more then 1 client at a time in their basic usage).

Someone please try to explain why they can call out Input Duplication but not provide any clarity for ANYTHING else.

What I assume is happening is CCP has decided they can't really figure out if someone is using any of the above, they just say "hey this guy is **TOO** good, so lets just ban him".

Here is the MAJOR issue with Versimilli.

We dont know what is or is not allowed aside from ID, but in CCP's extremely vague definition he was banned per his words. All his isk was confiscated as well (that is so far over the line I can't even put it into words with getting seriously angry).

He had a ticket into CCP asking if there was any issues with what he was doing, their response? Banned without any answer.
Here is the video he submitted - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFdYO9h0H3Y

Wanna know the WORST part about this?

CCP Falcon stated on 2 podcast's that the best solution was to send in a petition to start a dialogue with CCP. He stated their would be no repercussions and made comments that CCP is looking to help, not ban, its players.

Listen for yourself

http://t.co/Tzs4NYanpu @ 1:14
and
http://show.gamingradio.net/podpress...Show250115.mp3 @ 2:07

The OPPOSITE reaction occurred. He gets BANNED and ALL his isk confiscated. Really? REALLY??

[thedevilyouknow]

Here is the real issue for me ATM.

Input Duplication - Considered now against the EULA. Ok Fine.

Video FX - No explanation
Round-Robin - No explanation
Rollover - No Explanation

Each one of these can be used to emulate someone using Input Duplication (but make no mistake to those who don't use these tools, they are NOT sending more then 1 command to more then 1 client at a time in their basic usage).

Okay im just going to come out and say it

Page 7, legit.

If ccp is going to give copy paste answers in petitions im allowed to recognize things for what they are

Edit: With Lords on the window focus swapping, is that why to use Vidfx you have to click once first to 'focus' the window on the videofx tile, or am i doing something wrong?

but I'd also ask that you provide a link to CCP giving an unofficial statement about how being too efficient when multiboxing will land you a ban, because if you don't have a link then it's based purely upon the speculation in this thread.

You want my petition response? its near identical to the one on page 7
have at it

[Lax]

on the window focus swapping, is that why to use Vidfx you have to click once first to 'focus' the window on the videofx tile, or am i doing something wrong?

No. It sounds like you're using DxNothing and putting your Video FX Viewers in that, right? You have to click to first focus the DxNothing window because in your Window Layout you have not ticked the "Focus follows mouse" box

... now back to your regularly scheduled riff raff.

[LordsServant]

No. It sounds like you're using DxNothing and putting your Video FX Viewers in that, right? You have to click to first focus the DxNothing window because in your Window Layout you have not ticked the "Focus follows mouse" box

... now back to your regularly scheduled riff raff.

I have videoFX viewers in both a dxnothing and a non dxnothing window.

You'll notice that I mentioned that I click a lot - if you have 4 eve windows in 4 different monitors, you can move your mouse over that eve client, and then click once and it will activate a module. Go ahead and try it right now if you want.

With isboxer, if that "swap focus" is NOT checked, you have to click once to focus the window, then click a SECOND time to activate a module. I'm only trying to make my experience as close to vanilla as possible.

We had this discussion iirc several months ago when I was building my setup.

[thedevilyouknow]

No. It sounds like you're using DxNothing and putting your Video FX Viewers in that, right? You have to click to first focus the DxNothing window because in your Window Layout you have not ticked the "Focus follows mouse" box

... now back to your regularly scheduled riff raff.

Riff raffing away o7

Thanks for the DX and VFX help lax, i havent opened isboxer and eve together for a while now, will look into it

Going to stick my head into the cockfight

It has gone way past the merits of isboxer, but i think what Lord is trying to say is the act of swapping focus is also construed as an action, as it is not something we are able to do without the use of isboxer

I.e. there is no ingame keybind to send commands to other clients

So if i was to focus on client X, and press f1,f2,f3, and have each of those keys, send f1 - to clients 1, client 2, client 3...etc, while i am focused on window X, this is the order of events

Press F1 > focus to client 1 (since otherwise you cannot send clients there) > send f1 to client 1 > Have client X as the focus without technically swapping positions

[mbox_bob]

Just like you can move your mouse between windows with a certain isboxer setup that's legal?

Umm it's built into Windows......

Control Panel->Ease of Access->Change How Your Mouse Works->Activate a window by hovering over it with the mouse

Have client X as the focus without technically swapping positions

Actually you can do this in Windows too with a couple of registry settings. It is Focus Follows Mouse (like the activate a window by hovering), but without bringing the window to the front.

You need to set the bitmask for Active Window Tracking and Active Window Tracking Z Order as detailed here https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/.../cc957204.aspx
If you want to speed up the Active Window Tracking to be faster, you can set the ActiveWndTrkTimeout https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/.../cc957203.aspx

You end up with the ability to have a window receive input without it being the "active" or topmost window as per the usual setup in Windows.

This would allow you to arrange your windows in such a way that you could simply roll your mouse around over the windows pressing the F1 key, all without changing the layout. Not quite as fancy as Video FX, but it's pretty damn close, and if you have 6 screens and 6 clients (or just a 4K screen) you could be quite effective with nothing but Windows and EVE, and be much faster than an ALT+TABer.


Also, I recommend you press ALT+ESC rather than ALT+TAB, as it will cycle through Windows in the order they were opened, whereas ALT+TAB uses a MRU order. Cycling through in a known order is much more useful than in the MRU order

[Stevo_]

still glad I left EVE.... seems ccp went full retarded and is punishing it's playerbase that has gone with the "forced" game changes and evolution that require you to have alts...

"just don't do it to efficient, we dont want you to get better at our game otherwise we have to actualy balance our broken game features"