A Question for Those in the Industry

[boxer]

While browsing the forums, I see that a lot of you work for hardware companies, or know someone that does.

Im a high school senior, and i have decided to look into what kind of major would get me going in that type of direction. There are a bunch of computer majors at Ohio State (where im going), like Computer Science & Engineering and Computer & Information Science, but it doesnt seem clear which one would point me in the direction that would eventually get me a job with a hardware company, probably as a developer.

Any information on your experiences would be great! Thanks.

[wallshot]

degree doesn't "really" matter. It was only a few years ago when there was Electrical Engineering(EE) and Computer Science(CS). Companies had it easy, if you want a coder then grab a CS, if you want a hardware person, go EE. Unfortunately in the HW realm, a person that can't code is useless.

I would *guess* that CSE is more geared towards what you want to do as engineering usually indicates some sort of HW and circuits classes where Information usually indicates mostly coding.

I would recommend looking up the career services department for your school and ask them what percent of the majors that you are interested in have jobs before they graduated for each of the last few years, as well as salaries. That info should give you an idea for the general demand for the degrees at your school. I would also recommend cruising the career fairs as a freshman to talk to companies that you are interested in, the people their may be able to help you as well just by telling them that you are interested in their company and what kind of classes/degrees they look for in students from your school.

Ultimately, it's *you* that will end up getting you a job. Everything you do along the way, like your major, internships, clubs, etc. only help you get more interviews.

[boxer]

thanks for the info bud

[Boylston]

As an engineering manager for the last decade, what I'll tell you is this:

Your exact degree doesn't matter as much (to me) as long as it fits in the "family" of degrees that is appropriate for the job. What matters more (again, to me) is the caliber of school and the history of your grades. I really shy away from folks who do badly in their last year or 18 months of school, even if their overall GPA is fine. I also don't penalize folks for having a Freshman-Ooops as they made the transition from high school to college.

Like I said, the school matters more to me than the exact degree. College is about learning how to learn, and engineering degrees are about learning how to learn technical things. You will learn more things relevant in your job in the first 6 weeks of that job than the 4-5 years prior.

Some other things I tend to believe are true now:

If you are a science or engineering degree type person, an MBA is probably not worth it unless you can do a very top-tier school. Doing an executive MBA or nights/weekends type thing is only worth it if you REALLY want to learn more about business. You would probably do as well (or better) to focus on your career for the same amount of time it would take to get said MBA. Additionally, getting an MBA with less than 3-5 years work experience is nearly totally useless (and most of the top-tier programs won't take you, anyway).

Technical masters CAN be more useful, especially if you can study something you want to work on later. You can command more salary and have a huge leg up if a company looking for Widget Design sees that you did a thesis in Widget Design. PhD is a whole other ballgame that opens other career doors (and closes almost as many).


Anyhow, take some of that for what it's worth. It's one guy's opinion. (Just so happen that one guy has hired nearly 100 engineers in the last 10 years for a major semiconductor company).

[Vyndree]

I dated an EE major while I was doing my CS major in college. You WILL still learn coding techniques with a degree in EE, and neither will prevent you from "jumping" between disciples. A CS major can still get a hardware-related job, and a EE can still get a software-related job, but it's generally easier to get your application/resume through the door if you're the right kind of major.

If you're only interested in hardware, stick with EE. CS will drive you nuts. Having to explain data structures to my EE friends, they looked at me like I was nuts when I told them about the things I enjoyed. Likewise, I couldn't understand their fun in the EE courses that I took with them either (though I did enjoy learning assembly).

They're sister majors, really -- very closely related. But since it sounds like you know what you want to do (hardware), I'd stick with EE. You'll take the courses that interest you more, and you'll be in the right place for relevant internships and starting your career.

[Boylston]

It's worth noting that CS and EE have overlap, and the degree of said overlap varies wildly by institution. Also, all this advice about "getting a job" should really be "getting your first (maybe second) job". 5 years after your first job, your resume will look very different and the education section will not at all resemble what you will be putting on it pre-1st-job.

[boxer]

Being an engineering manager, is there a point (after Xish many years of working in the industry) that which college I got the degree from becomes eclipsed by my actual experience and what companies I have worked for?

And kind of rough idea would be great (because ohio state used to suck ass but now its very selective, and unfortunately carries the older stigma to a lot of older employers as i have been told)

[Zuxto]

I believe so boxer.

I'm a software engineer and database administrator for a major institution. All I have is a degree in Economics. When I applied for the position the college and degree seemed like a minor footnote in my resume compared to my prior work experience. It was challenging getting into the field without a CS degree but not impossible. The college and degree help you get your foot in the door but won't dictate your position.

[Ripper]

I have a Computer & Electrical Engineering degree from Carnegie Mellon. Worked for the government and Lockheed before I got into something else a while back. If you like working with hardware, then go ahead and pursue a Comp/EE degree. Once you get past the shock of freedom, girls, parties, etc, you really need to ask yourself if you still want to go all the way with engineering, or switch into something like IS, Business, etc. Talk with juniors/seniors at the college. Check out their textbooks at the store, see if that's something you can dig. College is filled with people who don't know wtf they want to do in life, and end up graduating in 5-6 years. Don't be one of those people.

When you graduate, have a plan to get an master's degree, an MBA, CCIE, or something. An undergraduate degree will get you in the door, and that's about it. When I was at Lockheed, everyone on my floor had a Master's or PhD in math/engineering/compsci. The managers usually had a master's and MBA, or a PhD. If your grades are decent, you can get into a lot of graduate schools(Master's degree) for free if you agree to teach/research while you're there. Make yourself valuable. Just something to consider.

Best of luck

[keyclone]

i have degrees and mathematics and compsci... i have been everything from coder to architect to cto. but if i were 4-6 years before hitting the industry right now, and i liked noodling with hardware, i could consider embedded devices and wireless tech. these 2 will be hot for the next 10+ years.

in order to do these, consider compsci and/or EE. you should also consider doing some work on your own (co-op works). anything to get yourself more experience for when you are sitting in the interview room next to a bunch of guys from your graduating class. what sets you apart? grades? sounds good.. but grades won't help me deliver a product. i'd take a C student whose hobbies include the field and is a complete nerd about it over the well-rounded A student any day.

at the end of the day, schedules are always absurd. there is never enough people. and the customers/investors expect miracles. in that situation, i cannot afford any fat. i don't need someone that can identify a certain artist or ski down moguls like nothing... if they can, that's fine... but it's secondary. what i need is someone that isn't going to bite off more then they can chew, while delivering a top notch job well within the absurd deadlines. (well.. that's the view from this side of the desk )

another bonus would be combining 2 degrees with varying directions.. EE and marketing or CompSci and graphic arts. anything that might give you a different, useful, perspective on the market and/or help you deliver a quality product.