Holy crap -- PvP changes

[smokebum]

I think the thing that bothers me the most about this is it feels like they are taking skill out of the equation and replacing it with time. No matter how screwed up ur comp or skill lvl is, u will get the item u want in time. Ofcourse minus the super cool color.

[Alemi]

I agree with the lack of incentive, my biggest gripe since I've been doing arenas the past 2 months is the lack of diversity in teams we get matched up against. Seems like any given night there is only a handful of teams playing.

Same thing for me. I played, probably 50 games last night (nothing else to do) and probably faced 15 teams. Of those 15 teams, a number of full wrathful rerolls or MMRs that were SO out of line with mine it was insane. (ex: 1600 MMR vs. 2100 MMR).

When the gates open and I see 2 warriors with 40k health and an ele shaman with 34k, I just fetal position.

[Svpernova09]

Same thing for me. I played, probably 50 games last night (nothing else to do) and probably faced 15 teams. Of those 15 teams, a number of full wrathful rerolls or MMRs that were SO out of line with mine it was insane. (ex: 1600 MMR vs. 2100 MMR).

When the gates open and I see 2 warriors with 40k health and an ele shaman with 34k, I just fetal position.

rofl! I can definetely relate. It never fails, we can tell in the first 20 seconds what the teams MMR is and be pretty accurate. The game for us then is to see how well we do against them.

[Mosg2]

@smokebum:

I disagree. I don't see this as taking skill out of the equation--Rather, it puts everyone on the same gear level initially and says "Go forth and kill each other." Then the most skilled people get to the top and get the unique colored armor, titles, and the best weapons.

[smokebum]

@smokebum:

I disagree. I don't see this as taking skill out of the equation--Rather, it puts everyone on the same gear level initially and says "Go forth and kill each other." Then the most skilled people get to the top and get the unique colored armor, titles, and the best weapons.

Hmm.. In some ways u may be right but from what I can see in this post, the people who are for the change are the ones who are basically saying "I cannot get to 1800 to get my weapon so it'll be better if we get rid of the req.". no?

Edit: I think I have gotten myself into one of those never ending forum battles. I'll concede before this thread goes to 100 pages.

[Kicksome]

I think a BIG motivation, if not the main reason, a lot of people do arena is for gear.

So if you can't get special gear by doing arena, I think arenas are going to be "less full".

I doubt I'd do arena just for fun. I've always done it for the gear. And I enjoy using that gear in BGs to pwn noobs.

[Fat Tire]

unique colored armor.

I lol'd.


/old man voice

Back in my day.....

We pvp'd for the fun of it, we didnt care about titles,gear or anything. It was all about defending Southshore and Tauren Mill.....for weeks on end.

Damn Hippies!



Edit: Arena =/-= skill. I have boosted people to 1800 in 2s this season. I have wintraded up to glad on nightfall bg 2700ish(3s) also this season (I think at the time it was 2680 /shrug). The people running around with arena gear and rating doesnt always mean skill, proven by having 1800 weapon and I could beat them naked(lock ;p). I hate using the word skill in conjuctiction with a video game but whatever. People play for their own personal reasons. Personally, I am happy to see the changes and yet sad to see my gold making venture crushed. If anything the ladder is broke and you can bet the rated bg ladder will be broke also, play for yourself not for standing in org/dal/if hoping people inspect you because you think youre something special.

[Alemi]

rofl! I can definetely relate. It never fails, we can tell in the first 20 seconds what the teams MMR is and be pretty accurate. The game for us then is to see how well we do against them.

Exactly. Some games last night, I just knew from their positioning and such that it was going to be rough. Gates open, 3 in stealth - how many boomkins will I have to deal with and will they typhoon me as I heal over their lolstarfalls.

So if you can't get special gear by doing arena, I think arenas are going to be "less full".

This will probably be true if they still keep arenas BG specific as they had planned. I suspect they will eventually take them, like battlegrounds, to continent battlegroups.

Hmm.. In some ways u may be right but from what I can see in this post, the people who are for the change are the ones who are basically saying "I cannot get to 1800 to get my weapon so it'll be better if we get rid of the req.". no?

You know I've been 2k+ before my absence, so you know that's not true. Fat cow (not an insult, btw, he and I are friends since we play on the same server - so he knows that's a term of endearment)

What I think needs to be said, this "gear equality" isn't going to come overnight, guys. You will only get blue quality gear from honor points (battlegrounds) and the epic stuff from conquest points (rated battlegrounds/arena). Scrubs - and I hate the term - will still not get their gear in the same fashion as before, but slower. This creates an equal footing for people who A) don't level as fast, or B) start cataclysm late. This'll prevent them from being cock blocked by teams that greatly outgear them or teams that refuse to queue.

What I see, are a lot of people who think that their PVP skill comes from them outgearing their opponents and are afraid to have them in equal (NOT BETTER) gear. Correct me if I'm wrong...

Keep in mind too, that Cata is shaping up to take PVP back to TBC days. Slower, more calculated damage, and FAR less crit (<10%). Adding in the fact that there won't be a 30% buff in raid instances that allow every casual joe schmo to obtain 25 man ICC gear and the fact that raid instances will, hopefully, again be difficult (how many people really saw pugs for SSC back in the day?).

If you look at one change - without looking at the big picture - I can see Chicken Little syndrome, for sure. When you compile all the changes together? Not a big deal. Really.

Just be thankful we're not going back to honor decay days to get PVP gear. Then I'd chime in with some qq.

Edit: Forgot to say - rated battlegrounds? NOT EVEN on beta yet. We don't know the scoring system; I'm going to wager that it's a 0 net point gain for a loss. So until these are out and that's confirmed, the only way to get conquest points is by the daily random which give you ~20 conquest points (iirc). So, after 80 days of doing the daily you can get 2 pieces of gear at current pricing.

[Whowantstoknow]

IMO blizz could just go ; ok, pve gear is obtained throug daily emblems, when you complete raids and hardmodes you can change colour on the gear. Yep that sounds realy fun don't it? No to me blizz is heading down the wrong road tbh. Yeah I'm not a casual, but I'm not a hardcore player either.

Thats what they do now. Good players get frost badges and frost badge level gear much faster than the bad players. The goal is everyone gets the gear its just gonna take the bad players a lot longer in both pvp and pve. I almost guarantee come 4.0 everyone will be able to faceroll even heroic modes.

[Mosg2]

@smokebum:
Not trying to start a war Just sharings points of view.

@all:
I think Alemi makes some good points. The one big thing I'll add is that Blizz stated they were going to merge the Arena and BG ques so that every single person in a particular server type (IE, North America, China, Oceanic, and Euro) will be playing against each other. If this goes through then things are going to be much better--Even if only 10% of the people that do arenas now do arenas post Cata you'll still have instant ques AND you'll probably never face teams more than 5 MMR off of you. I assume the same will be true for rated BG's.

Overall I like it.