Camelot Unchained (aka DAoC 2)

[Mosg2]

It's really awesome that they reversed decision on this. I was originally looking forward to the game a great deal, but I dropped the idea when they said no multiboxing.

[Mercbeast]

It's really awesome that they reversed decision on this. I was originally looking forward to the game a great deal, but I dropped the idea when they said no multiboxing.

It's actually hilarious they are saying multiboxing is forbidden in PvP.

Multiboxers in PvP will be basically free kills. Yea, your full group will bully a couple of guys alone. However, if Camelot Unchained retains any of the PvP elements of DAOC, a multiboxer is going to be a free kill against any competent group. Now, I don't think DAOC had particularly high skill based PvP on the individual level, but for the tab target style/EQ combat clone style MMO's no game has come close to it in terms of inter-group dynamics and intricacies. I was one of the guys who got the whole 8 man roaming gank groups off the ground early on in DAOC in early 2002 after being one of the co-leaders of the top zerg guild in the game, Angry Elves on Merlin.

I can say flat out, that the coordination of a good roaming 8 man group would be absolutely impossible to achieve with a boxing setup, and would get run over by any other even remotely coordinated group. Depending on realm, you had between 4 and 6 specific roles per group where independent action, and good choices had to be made. From your actual DPS kill train, to your suppresser who was chain interrupting their casters, to your CC'r who was locking down large numbers of baddies, prioritized by threat, to your healer(s) who had to both heal, and CC, and pre-kite. For Midgard these tasks were covered by 4 covered by classes, whereas the Albs had those key abilities spread out between 5 or 6 classes. In anycase. If Camelot Unchained strives for any of this kind of group dynamic and class specialization, then why boxers will never be more than just more meat in a zerg, unable to really affect anything on their own, other than in very niche roles.

Boxers will be relegated to really two roles. Supplementing existing raid forces with coordinated (massive overkill) critical mass DPS, and or the very niche all stealth roaming group, where they would be committing a full group to picking off a couple stragglers here or there, and running like a hunted rabbit from any dedicated roaming groups, or full sized raid groups.

I hope its more like DAOC, and less like WOW. If it's like WOW but with PvP, the game is going to flop hard, again. These guys at Mythic have been making the same basic game over and over and they still haven't figured it out. DaoC was in its time, a marginal success, dwarfed by EQ. Warhammer Online was an unmitigated disaster, getting rid of virtually everything good about DaoC in favor of WoW mechanics nobody really wanted. These guys also played a large role in SWTOR, and we all know how that turned out.

Come on Mark, get your shit together

[Ughmahedhurtz]

It's actually hilarious they are saying multiboxing is forbidden in PvP.

Multiboxers in PvP will be basically free kills. Yea, your full group will bully a couple of guys alone. However, if Camelot Unchained retains any of the PvP elements of DAOC, a multiboxer is going to be a free kill against any competent group. Now, I don't think DAOC had particularly high skill based PvP on the individual level, but for the tab target style/EQ combat clone style MMO's no game has come close to it in terms of inter-group dynamics and intricacies. I was one of the guys who got the whole 8 man roaming gank groups off the ground early on in DAOC in early 2002 after being one of the co-leaders of the top zerg guild in the game, Angry Elves on Merlin.

I can say flat out, that the coordination of a good roaming 8 man group would be absolutely impossible to achieve with a boxing setup, and would get run over by any other even remotely coordinated group. Depending on realm, you had between 4 and 6 specific roles per group where independent action, and good choices had to be made. From your actual DPS kill train, to your suppresser who was chain interrupting their casters, to your CC'r who was locking down large numbers of baddies, prioritized by threat, to your healer(s) who had to both heal, and CC, and pre-kite. For Midgard these tasks were covered by 4 covered by classes, whereas the Albs had those key abilities spread out between 5 or 6 classes. In anycase. If Camelot Unchained strives for any of this kind of group dynamic and class specialization, then why boxers will never be more than just more meat in a zerg, unable to really affect anything on their own, other than in very niche roles.

Boxers will be relegated to really two roles. Supplementing existing raid forces with coordinated (massive overkill) critical mass DPS, and or the very niche all stealth roaming group, where they would be committing a full group to picking off a couple stragglers here or there, and running like a hunted rabbit from any dedicated roaming groups, or full sized raid groups.

I hope its more like DAOC, and less like WOW. If it's like WOW but with PvP, the game is going to flop hard, again. These guys at Mythic have been making the same basic game over and over and they still haven't figured it out. DaoC was in its time, a marginal success, dwarfed by EQ. Warhammer Online was an unmitigated disaster, getting rid of virtually everything good about DaoC in favor of WoW mechanics nobody really wanted. These guys also played a large role in SWTOR, and we all know how that turned out.

Come on Mark, get your shit together

8v8 drama, we meet again! One would hope that the game design isn't the same old morass of 8v8 RP farmers looking down their noses at everyone else while whining about realm imbalances, strategic territory control groups getting impacted by nerfs targeted at the 8v8/gear exploiters, and PvE guys wondering WTF is going to get nerfed next patch day because the PvP guys and gear farmers can never find a forum-gripe balance between exploits and the ever-whimsical notion of "fair play." The best thing that ever happened in these games (IMO) were the splits between PvP mechanics and PvE mechanics, which at least afforded most of the playerbase some semblance of stability.

[Mercbeast]

8v8 drama, we meet again! One would hope that the game design isn't the same old morass of 8v8 RP farmers looking down their noses at everyone else while whining about realm imbalances, strategic territory control groups getting impacted by nerfs targeted at the 8v8/gear exploiters, and PvE guys wondering WTF is going to get nerfed next patch day because the PvP guys and gear farmers can never find a forum-gripe balance between exploits and the ever-whimsical notion of "fair play." The best thing that ever happened in these games (IMO) were the splits between PvP mechanics and PvE mechanics, which at least afforded most of the playerbase some semblance of stability.

I would like to apologize then, because me and my crew were responsible for a afair few of the major mega nerfs at certain points early on in the games life cycle

We were, for example, the first group on any server to level 2handed savages to 50 (everyone else leveled them hth when that expac first came out!), when they could push the slowest swinging weapons down to the haste cap of 1.5s I think it was. One of us basically insta-gibbed the druid TL, who threw an epic hissy fit and a few days later, Mythic nerfed 2h savages into the ground. Granted, they were basically the most OP class ever to exist in the game, capable of perma stam regen, beyond plate levels of mitigation, and with a healer buffbot, fully capable of soloing 8 man groups, by themselves. Fair and balanced if I do say so myself!

From my perspective, DAOC was never designed with the intention of 8 man groups. It's just a playstyle that evolved, because the massive 50 on 50+ low skill zerg fests were a travesty of boredom. Now, I get that a lot of people like that. I don't. So when we all quit Merlin because playing virtual reality security guards protecting the hiberian relics from Midgard that outnumbered us about 6:1 wasn't fun, nor was rolling the giant zergs they roamed with with our own giant zerg. The 8 man group farming the 40-50 man raid forces, that was much more enjoyable. Of course, Midgard had a massive advantage in that regard because well, everything they needed to do it was consolidated into 4 classes. Zerkers, Skalds, Runemasters and Healers. Zerkers ran a kill train. Skalds joined the zerkers and gave the group speed. Runemasters nearsighted, provided utility buffs, and bubble if I recall that correctly, and healers, well, healers spammed insta stuns and insta mezzes to T up that poor 50 man Albion raid we'd then buzzsaw through with our zerker pain train, and then later savages Good times.