Best 5 man comp for endgame BiS gearing

(Horde)
I am relatively new to multi boxing as I have not done it since BC and I had two different computers to play/follow on.

I want to main a warrior for endgame raiding, but I don't want to go through the hassle of pugging groups all the time. I wanted to know what would be the best team comp that can quickly dungeon level while still being viable for farming endgame 5 mans over and over.

So far I have seen most posts talk about the following:

1xWarrior 4xShamans,
4xWarriors 1xShaman
1xWarrior 1xPriest 3xMage,
1xWarrior 1xPriest 2xMage 1xWarlock

I want to focus on melee cleave as I know multiboxing spellcleave can be difficult. My ideal scenario would be:

2xWarrior (1 Tank, 1 DPS), 1xRogue, 1xShaman, 1xPriest

This comp would give me the classes that I would enjoy playing endgame, but I am aware of the added difficulty between different classes as well as rogues being difficult for multiboxing.

I would be fine with 3xWarrior, Shaman, Priest, or even 4xWarrior, Shaman.

I am not opposed to 1 Warrior 4xShamans, I just don't know how well it would do in end game dungeon farming.

Please let me know what you think. I wont be immediately multiboxing at classic launch, but I dont think it will take too long to get a hunter or mage high enough level to pump out bags for everyone.

P.S. On a side note I am very interested in Talioring/Alchemy/Leathworking for the cooldowns as passive gold. Would 5 shamans be good or 5 druids for dungeon or quest leveling to 35?

The bottom line for standard dungeon clearing is that Warrior DPS really outshines other options by a significant amount. A general rule of thumb in multiboxing team composition is that each Cleave Warrior is like 1.5-2 Mages, between 2-4 Shaman, and like 3 DPS Paladins or Druid Bears and Warriors are more survivable than most options and don't need mana. Note that Warriors are more gear dependent than some other options and in later phases the balance can shift toward magic users (plus DPSing from range has it's benefits). Group Warriors with Paladins and you get very survivable healers with the most mana efficient healing in the game and great buffs, auras, and judgements. Note that I can't take credit for those relative DPS benchmarks as those came from Apathiest:

https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/...l=1#post420038

If your Main is a Warrior the the primary & overriding goal is most efficient feeding of BiS gear and gold to your main then 4Warriors+1 Shaman (Windfury+Chain Heals+much more) is likely the most efficient... If you were Alliance then a Paladin or Priest would be some next best options.

If you plan to be on a PVP server and take that 5box group into WPVP you will likely regret not having 2 healers...

If you know you want other classes at cap up front then you have to decide if you want to sacrifice some optimal dungeon grinding efficiency from the start through the life of the game for not having to level 1 or more toons up to 60 again...

I started with 3 Warriors+2 Paladins but then, after knowing I want a Druid Flag Runner for BGs, I had decided to swap a Warrior for a Druid just so I wouldn't have to run another character (or group) to 60 again... Lately I have been thinking I don't want to lose any dungeon grinding efficiency in my main group because I swapped a Warrior for a Druid as it will add up over time... Also factoring in that I don't really need a Druid until WSG is out in Phase 3 I am leaning back toward 3 Warriors+2 Paladins in my initial group to focus on efficiency...

Ultimately you have to prioritize your goals and if you know you want to main multiple classes in early phases it can make sense to lose some grinding efficiency... If you really want to have a Rogue option at cap generally folk have agreed that having up-to 1 rogue in a group can be fine if you drive from the rogue.

Regarding leveling up extra alts for passive gold via cool-down crafting my plan is to do Warlocks in general for that as with pets they should level easy and I want to have Warlocks at some key places to be able to summon my group around. If I do main 3 Warriors+2 Paladins my 2nd group may be 1 Druid+4 Warlocks to give me my Flag Carrier and then my 3rd group (and later groups for crafting cool-downs) may be 5 Warlocks...

Anyway you have lots to think about and decide upon. I hope the above info helps. Good Luck!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nodoze

If your Main is a Warrior the the primary & overriding goal is most efficient feeding of BiS gear and gold to your main then 4Warriors+1 Shaman (Windfury+Chain Heals+much more) is likely the most efficient...

---

Thank you for your input. I don't want to be too distracted during the early phases as Ill have plenty of time to level every class eventually. I will go with the idea of having 4 Warriors and 1 Shaman and feeding my main Warrior as much gear as possible. Im just need a comp that will be efficient in endgame dungeons.

This decision has been pretty difficult since my main has been a Blood Elf Paladin ever since the start of BC. I know very little of the Alliance quests and dungeons so I have had to choose a new main.

My plan for classic would be to speed level a hunter to get ahead of the launch pack and focus on tailoring to get decent bags before I try to multi-box. After that I will get a total of 6 accounts so I can rely on myself to farm and reset instances quickly while being able to add a 6th person to early raid groups if my warriors are very well geared.

Again I thank you for your knowledge.

If you think you may want to main a Paladin for anything at any point I would not be concerned about not knowing the Alliance side quests. They are extremely well documented and a FedEx approach is fully mapped out which helps you avoid bottleknecks. The following link includes info on the FedEx approach to save time as well as a detailed Planning spreadsheet with tabs for Best in Slot gear by phase for Warriors (both Horde & Alliance) & Paladins (Alliance only):

https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/...l=1#post421226

A 3 Warrior+2 Paladin group is one of the most stable melee platforms for WPVP and gives one of the best duos for Battlegrounds (assuming a real person behind a single Warrior & a single Paladin). It isn't quite as efficient for clearing dungeons as 4 Warriors but it is what I am going with as my highest priority is having both Paladin and a Warrior main option for both my brother and I (this way we each can have a Paladin & a Warrior main) and we will be duoing both Paladin+Warrior & Paladin+Paladin in BattleGrounds to contrast/compare. In the end I think we will prefer Warrior+Paladin over Paladin+Paladin... Regardless, when either of us queue solo for BGs, we will likely be on a Paladin (unless we know we have a pocket healer).

EDIT: Replaced the above link with the correct one. Had the wrong one initially (sorry).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nodoze

each Cleave Warrior is like 1.5-2 Mages, between 2-4 Shaman, and like 3 DPS Paladins or Druid Bears

---

Is there actual evidence of some of these numbers, or do they just get repeated over and over again?

1 warrior is worth 4 shaman? I'm sorry, but there's no way that's true. If I could pick between (17 shaman) or (4 warrior and 1 shaman), I'm picking 17 shaman.

I am going Warrior/Warrior/Warrior/BearTank + either a Pally or a Priest healer. I'm will be on a pvp server, but don't plan on playing a ton of WPVP. My goal is similar - dungeon cleave-grinding and BIS gathering for a main dps warrior. I want to be able to BRD farm comfortably.

I'm really struggling with the healer question. I like the tankiness/buffs from the pally, but worry a bit about healing throughput (i.e., am I going to have to have 50% of my brain act like a manual HoT by continually spamming FoL?). The shields/renew/AoE healing from the priest might allow me to dedicate more mental bandwidth to dps. But, then I think about Judgment of Light and the work it could do. I've been playing with talent trees and am 60/40 in favor of the priest. I'd love input on this question: say you're alliance doing melee cleave, not worried about WPVP, and only get one healer. What do you bring?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zipzip

Is there actual evidence of some of these numbers, or do they just get repeated over and over again?

1 warrior is worth 4 shaman? I'm sorry, but there's no way that's true. If I could pick between (17 shaman) or (4 warrior and 1 shaman), I'm picking 17 shaman.

---

We are talking about 5man dungeon grinding efficiency. Those are general relative benchmarks given by a player who has actually tried various class combinations for extended multi-boxed grinding of dungeons over time. If you go read the actual posts linked he provided actual DPS numbers for those he had measured and gave relative DPS estimates for the others he didn't actually measure but played extensively.

My understanding is that it is based on standard dungeon pulls of 6-7 mobs max leveraging Cleave mechanics and is from a sustain perspective over the course of a extended grinding session leveraging an relatively unlimited resource (rage) and not having to stop to drink/etc assuming it is paired with healer(s) that can keep up.

One way of looking at it would be if you could line up 100+ groups of 6 Elite mobs in row what 5 man team would get to the end the fastest (including any time spent drinking).

The best way to contrast/compare from a live environment would be to compare the total time of 2 different multi-boxed teams running a given instance multiple times (with similar gear levels and no major aberrations in the sample runs).

If you have other relative numbers or general rules of thumb that differ for max efficiency of multi-boxing extended grinding of dungeons please post them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nodoze

Those are general relative benchmarks given by a player of various combos in multiboxing.

My understanding is that it is based on standard dungeon pulls of 6-7 mobs max leveraging Cleave mechanics and is from a sustain perspective over the course of a extended grinding session leveraging rage and not having to stop to drink/etc as it is based on a relatively unlimited resource (Rage) with healer(s) that can keep up.

If you have other relative numbers that differ for max efficiency over time of extended grinding of dungeons please post them.

---

Do you happen to have a talent build for the warrior tank and warrior dps? Im sure Ill be fine going resto on the shaman, but Im not sure how to spec for maximum aoe damage. I have seen posts stating that there is no need to be protection warrior while leveling. Would it be better for my tank to be spec'd similarly as the dps or actually tank? I have also seen the same thing regarding tanking with 1h/shield vs 2h.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Compton

I am going Warrior/Warrior/Warrior/BearTank + either a Pally or a Priest healer. I'm will be on a pvp server, but don't plan on playing a ton of WPVP. My goal is similar - dungeon cleave-grinding and BIS gathering for a main dps warrior. I want to be able to BRD farm comfortably.

I'm really struggling with the healer question. I like the tankiness/buffs from the pally, but worry a bit about healing throughput (i.e., am I going to have to have 50% of my brain act like a manual HoT by continually spamming FoL?). The shields/renew/AoE healing from the priest might allow me to dedicate more mental bandwidth to dps. But, then I think about Judgment of Light and the work it could do. I've been playing with talent trees and am 60/40 in favor of the priest. I'd love input on this question: say you're alliance doing melee cleave, not worried about WPVP, and only get one healer. What do you bring?

---

If I was PVE and maining a Warrior & not doing WPVP I would definitely try to go 4 Warrior + Healer. I main Paladins but find Shaman pretty darn compelling (I did them in BC+) and likely WindFury will give the most DPS and Chain Heals pretty easy healing. It would be non-stop buzz-sawing if you can get by without drinking with mainly Rank 1 Chain-Heals and mana totems. Maybe someone who has run that team makeup can chime in on how viable that should be for non-stop grinding in Classic WoW.

On the Alliance side Paladins are the most efficient healers mana-wise but your point is valid that it would be quite a bit of quick casts for healing... If it were me I would likely push aggro on 1 melee (Warrior or Bear) and go Paladin Healer (but that is at least in part because I am most comfortable with Paladins) and I would try to setup at least hot keys to heal the one pushing aggro (so no clicking the mouse). That being said Priests are considered the best overall healers in Classic Warcraft (though they are more squishy than Paladins if teamed up on in PVP). My only concern with a Priest is that whether you will need to stop often to drink due to not having Illumination nor Blessing of Wisdom nor Judgement/Seal of Wisdom but maybe there is a PVE Priest build heavy in Spirit that can keep from drinking often. If stopping to drink isn't a concern for you and/or someone who knows Classic Priests can chime in to indicate that there is a Classic Priest build that can keep 4 Warriors going without stopping to drink then Priest may indeed be better.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Th3unN4m3d1

Do you happen to have a talent build for the warrior tank and warrior dps? Im sure Ill be fine going resto on the shaman, but Im not sure how to spec for maximum aoe damage. I have seen posts stating that there is no need to be protection warrior while leveling. Would it be better for my tank to be spec'd similarly as the dps or actually tank? I have also seen the same thing regarding tanking with 1h/shield vs 2h.

---

I am having trouble finding the build I remember seeing posted...

This was the closest discussion I can find for now:

https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/55637-1-druid-tank-1-druid-heal-and-3-rogue-Viable-for-dungeon-and-wpvp?p=419511&viewfull=1#post419511

I don't believe the recommendation is for 2 separate builds for Warriors. All are speced the same for max DPS and the general recommendation was for them all to have decent amounts of armor & stamina. Each should have macro to swap to 1H+shield & defensive stance when necessary. I think you start in 2H Fury at low levels before you get enough hit rating to go Dual-Wield Fury at higher levels.

If I was running 4 Warriors+1 Healer I likely would prioritize the more Tanky drops to 1 main warrior and try to push aggro on him to make my aggro & incoming damage more controlled at least until I was more comfortable (and then maybe have all 4 go max DPS with no one in particular pushing aggro). For example, for any given slot while leveling, if I came across pieces that were simiar DPSwise except one was Plate and the others Mail or Leather, I personally would prioritize the Plate to my "main" Warrior and push aggro on him until I was more comfortable with the team in the given content... The other 3 Warriors would still have strong armor just not as strong.

I will keep looking for any actual recommended builds and try to circle back here to post them...

EDIT: Did some more digging and found at least one build for the 4 Warriors while leveling to cap:

https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/...l=1#post418944

Bear Druids are the best dungeon tank. They scale the best, they require less specific gearing, and some high tier end game raiders (skarmtank) are even starting to consider that the massive armor and health that bear druids get in can offset their ability to be crit/crushed, and they generate much higher threat then warrior tanks at all tiers. We might actually see early end game progression guilds using bear druids as their main tanks abusing crowd pummelers to outstrip what warriors can do in in pre BIS MC raiding.

If you are going to run a tank for your group, seriously, run a bear druid. It generates the most threat. You can literally throw any piece of garbage at level leather armor on it, and get enormous raw mitigation and hp. Since you don't need to worry about crushing blows in dungeons, the big draw back for druids post BIS MC raiding doesn't exist, so you have all the upside of enormous HP pool, superior damage and threat generation to a prot warrior, and superior raw armor mitigation.

I'm going to either run 4 fury warriors and a priest, or 1 druid 3 fury warriors and a priest. I'm undecided atm.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mercbeast

Bear Druids are the best dungeon tank. They scale the best, they require less specific gearing, and some high tier end game raiders (skarmtank) are even starting to consider that the massive armor and health that bear druids get in can offset their ability to be crit/crushed, and they generate much higher threat then warrior tanks at all tiers. We might actually see early end game progression guilds using bear druids as their main tanks abusing crowd pummelers to outstrip what warriors can do in in pre BIS MC raiding.

If you are going to run a tank for your group, seriously, run a bear druid. It generates the most threat. You can literally throw any piece of garbage at level leather armor on it, and get enormous raw mitigation and hp. Since you don't need to worry about crushing blows in dungeons, the big draw back for druids post BIS MC raiding doesn't exist, so you have all the upside of enormous HP pool, superior damage and threat generation to a prot warrior, and superior raw armor mitigation.

I'm going to either run 4 fury warriors and a priest, or 1 druid 3 fury warriors and a priest. I'm undecided atm.

---

I love Hybrids & Druids in particular but I don't think it is as clear cut as that. Here are some detailed comparisons by Skarm with the pros/cons:

Man vs Bear! Comparing feral druid & fury/prot warrior tanking:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNGo5SMeqgo

Main Tank Discussion:
https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/...nk_discussion/

I was considering going swapping a Druid for 1 Warrior in my Melee-Cleave team for dungeons as it seems like a conservative approach with the least amount of buttons/cool-downs for a boxer but my concern is that over the long run the Warrior is significantly better for faster clears due to having MOAR DPS. As your gear improves and you get to where you have the dungeons on farm & know all the fights a warrior can switch to dual wield more and more often and push more and more DPS for faster clears. He indicates that Warrior's have better burst threat and I don't want any delays... Also Druid's AoE threat starts to fall off on 4+ targets and I want to push more & more with a buzzsaw cleave approach. In the end I may want to be ping-ponging aggro once I am very comfortable and that pushes me toward Warriors.

At this point I am planning on dropping my Druid from my main/initial team and going to try to make a go of an all Warrior Cleave front line. Additionally I plan to try my group in WPVP and I want to be able to use full consumables and Engineering items without having to drop out of Bear form...

For Classic Warcraft optimal PVP is really 'World of Gadgets' with Engineering & Bears don't have thumbs...

How about something like..

Warrior / Priest (healer) / Shaman (Ele) / Mage / Warlock?

That was my comp for original release, of course without the MB aspect. Shaman was enhance back then but with MB i think ranged DPS will be easier to manage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by evilution

How about something like..

Warrior / Priest (healer) / Shaman (Ele) / Mage / Warlock?

That was my comp for original release, of course without the MB aspect. Shaman was enhance back then but with MB i think ranged DPS will be easier to manage.

---

Pretty much any team built on a proper Trinity with 3 DPS should be able to clear the Classic instances. Some will be more optimal than others depending on what you deem most important. With that mind your team posted should be doable.

Any true Tank class (Warrior, Paladin, Bear) geared appropriately with proper specs should be viable for clearing all content.

Any true Healer class should be fine though generally speaking Priests are proto-typical (with Dwarfs having the best racials).

3 Mages are probably the best all around choice for the 3 DPS for most boxer's first trinity based team unless of course you have other overriding goals (like want to main a different class than your tank, healer, or mage). Adding in a Warlock can give some extra utility and an off tank. A shaman can also work but note that you are adding some complexity for each additional class instead of just focusing on optimizing 3 Mages so you should take that into consideration.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nodoze

Pretty much any team built on a proper Trinity with 3 DPS should be able to clear the Classic instances. Some will be more optimal than others depending on what you deem most important. With that mind your team posted should be doable.

Any true Tank class (Warrior, Paladin, Bear) geared appropriately with proper specs should be viable for clearing all content.

Any true Healer class should be fine though generally speaking Priests are proto-typical (with Dwarfs having the best racials).

3 Mages are probably the best all around choice for the 3 DPS for most boxer's first trinity based team unless of course you have other overriding goals (like want to main a different class than your tank, healer, or mage). Adding in a Warlock can give some extra utility and an off tank. A shaman can also work but note that you are adding some complexity for each additional class instead of just focusing on optimizing 3 Mages so you should take that into consideration.

---

Thank you for the feedback! I realize the additional complexity that comes with having so many different classes. When I MB Anarchy Online (a much easier game by far since you can get 90% of effectiveness with 1 button DPSing) the setup/tweaking was the best part of the game for me :) Hoping it is something similar here since vanilla really was pretty vanilla.

Curious was there a work around to the no follow in battlegrounds for multiboxers? I read someone talking about having a druid flag runner.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pinotnoir

Curious was there a work around to the no follow in battlegrounds for multiboxers? I read someone talking about having a druid flag runner.

---

That may have been me as having at least one Druid Flag Carrier is a priority for me for Phase 3 but it should be noted that I was/am under the assumption that I will not be boxing in BGs.

At launch, since I really only want the Druid in phase 3, instead starting with Druid+2 Warriors+2 Paladins to just go 3 Warriors+2Paladins for my first main team.

Since I did not include a Druid in my main group I may actually include 2 or even more if I level up a team for this goal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pinotnoir

Curious was there a work around to the no follow in battlegrounds for multiboxers?

---

I don't remember where I read it, but someone claims to use clock-to-move for BG's. I imagine it being difficult and cluky as heck. I also recall reading Blizzard kinda frowning upon it, but not banning/punishing it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skullmonkey

I don't remember where I read it, but someone claims to use clock-to-move for BG's. I imagine it being difficult and cluky as heck. I also recall reading Blizzard kinda frowning upon it, but not banning/punishing it.

---

The only way I see that semi-working is for a dot class team or maybe a chain lighting team...

Though follow may be broken in BGs is IWT available at all as that could maybe fill some gaps?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nodoze

The bottom line for standard dungeon clearing is that Warrior DPS really outshines other options by a significant amount.

---

Are there any videos / reports of someone multiboxing the end-game 5-man instances with 4 warriors + healer? I'm thinking BRS/BRD/Scholo?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fuzzyboy

Are there any videos / reports of someone multiboxing the end-game 5-man instances with 4 warriors + healer? I'm thinking BRS/BRD/Scholo?

---

https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/...l=1#post423980

My bear tank for aoe threat management and i mean above 8-9 mobs is subpar, but for anything else the armor, health, threat, pre-hotting, offloading the pressure from my priest healer, battle res and so on is OP.
Very easy rotation for multiboxers... spam Maul and Swipe

Current team: bear tank/2 x mages/warlock/priest @lvl 44

if you want massive aoe pulls for a spell cleave group maybe another tank is better...
But for reasonable pulls, and bosses, bear tanks are excellent and very easy to handle.

I think that bear is a great choice if you are playing with 3 mages, with Improved Thorns and Demo Roar your bear will generate aggro faster then a warrior on melee mobs and your mages with Ice Barrier will soak up spell damage from casters while spamming arcane explosion which counteracts the lack of mitigation compared to a warrior and spreads out damage making your Prayer of Healing even better.

If you have a paladin healer warlocks work too, since you can start pulling with Retribution aura and switch to Concentration aura when you use Hellfire.