5s Arena and opening wave

So Pinot brought this up in guild today. It seems that if you don't ride the initial PvP wave in an expansion you are forever behind the curve. DKs in particular are outstanding, but if you are constantly fighting teams fully geared in epic they feel very weak. How many of you out there think you could hit your current high rating starting over right now?

I now know that come next expansion I need to have a ton of honor ready to spend and start arenas immediately. It's frustrating when you run into all dps 5s and get your ass handed to you because you just cant hang with the damage. Had a group that put out 2 rings of frost and almost insta gibbed one of my dps.

I cry to much I know ;)

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Originally Posted by Multibocks

So Pinot brought this up in guild today. It seems that if you don't ride the initial PvP wave in an expansion you are forever behind the curve. DKs in particular are outstanding, but if you are constantly fighting teams fully geared in epic they feel very weak. How many of you out there think you could hit your current high rating starting over right now?

I now know that come next expansion I need to have a ton of honor ready to spend and start arenas immediately. It's frustrating when you run into all dps 5s and get your ass handed to you because you just cant hang with the damage. Had a group that put out 2 rings of frost and almost insta gibbed one of my dps.

I cry to much I know ;)

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this is fully correct :)
at beginning of the expansion I needed a few more lvls, but I cought up on some pvpers.. so gear was fine, could still faceroll some teams

however, 2 weeks ago, I had a break of 2 weeks, its just crazy atm..
I should be happy with 1 win on 5 right now..
So again, i'm trying to catch up with gear.

I completly know how you feel right now!

greetingz
tank

Yeah,

I dinged 85 with my dk's ago like 4 weeks ago (got epic 2h from conquest, rest blue in mix of BoE and honor blues).

Also i noticed that fighting 1600+ the whole team has full epics and 15k+ health then me.

And i dinged 85 AFTER Tol Barad got nerfed. So keep in mind that people might have been getting 2 parts of PvP per day while bridge camping while it was still doable.

Same I never got to take advantage of the TB 1000 honor win system. =/

Best bet is to do the honor grind.
As much as you can stand doing.

That puts you a full season behind the curve, towards the end of a season.
But as the arena season changes, Conquest points reset and become Honor points.
And all the previous conquest stuff is bought with honor.
That will be the best chance to catch up.

This is part true.

But its not connected to each expansion, its connected to each season.

I bet most of you that enjoy pvp and are active will in good time before the new season have full epics. Meens that you will start with fresh teams with exactly the same gear as everyone else that day. Then its just to hack and slash your way up :P

im with tobben, yes it REALLY sucks to start behind, but once you've geared up to 3k ish resil, you can "re-make" your team, start fresh, and pretty much faceroll up to 1500 with a good win/loss ratio.

Plus, if you find pvp fun... more of it cant hurt :) lol personally i'm having a BLAST doing some arenas and when i find arena to be a chore(mostly when 400+ points higher rating teams are queuing against me) i just hop over and get some honor or go gank in tol barad doing dailies and farming herbs. PvE is pretty meh for me lately, so i've just been having a blast ganking all over :)

Actually Im surprised how many good 5s teams I face below 1500. I havent had ANY faceroll teams yet. All have been a good struggle and thats with 3k resilience DKs. =(

I agree with what many have said.

If its any consolation, S10 wont start until Firelands comes out and its not coming until 4.2 so these extra 3-4 months should allow everyone to catch up. ;p

Plus I wouldnt be surprised to see blizz nerf the living shit out of heroics and raids.

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Originally Posted by Fat Tire

I agree with what many have said.

If its any consolation, S10 wont start until Firelands comes out and its not coming until 4.2 so these extra 3-4 months should allow everyone to catch up. ;p

Plus I wouldnt be surprised to see blizz nerf the living shit out of heroics and raids.

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I hope not. I already aoe tank all trash in blues and 5 epics and we pug all raids on our server. It's not hard once you learn the strat, unless you can't follow directions.

But yea, on topic, if you miss the opening wave of each season, prepare to struggle. One of the reasons I don't do arena for the fun/challenge, only for the points.

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Originally Posted by valkry

I hope not. I already aoe tank all trash in blues and 5 epics and we pug all raids on our server. It's not hard once you learn the strat, unless you can't follow directions.

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I am only following their past decisions regarding the timing of nerfing previous content prior to release of new content. Not to mention the fact that this expansion only the hardcore are seeing the endgame. Heroics are not end game but they are a stepping stone for the most part.

Multi... don't you remember people getting furious while both relent and wrathful were the main pieces...and people STILL got 1800 with just that stuff. Albeit wrath had different mechanics in pvp this might pose more of a problem now. But with there basically being a 32.5% resil cap put into place (diminishing returns after that) it shouldn't put you are TOO great of a disadvantage.

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Originally Posted by Fat Tire

I am only following their past decisions regarding the timing of nerfing previous content prior to release of new content. Not to mention the fact that this expansion only the hardcore are seeing the endgame. Heroics are not end game but they are a stepping stone for the most part.

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"pug all raids"

Only th eharcore are seeing the heroic versions, as it should be.

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Originally Posted by valkry

Only th eharcore are seeing the heroic versions, as it should be.

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That is your opinion and blizzards apparently(for now). I disagree, but opinions are like assholes, everyone has got one. I have 3.

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Originally Posted by Shodokan

Multi... don't you remember people getting furious while both relent and wrathful were the main pieces...and people STILL got 1800 with just that stuff. Albeit wrath had different mechanics in pvp this might pose more of a problem now. But with there basically being a 32.5% resil cap put into place (diminishing returns after that) it shouldn't put you are TOO great of a disadvantage.

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This means that teams will start gemming for dps and blow you up even faster :)

So after 32.5% Resiliency, gem Stamina if you want to have increased survivability.
Or for DPS, if you want to kill faster.

Ideally a mix, so you can blow anyone and everyone up, fairly instantly with 4x DPS.
But have enough defenses that your healer (or you) can react and save your toons when less coordinated DPS hit you.
At least in an ideal world.

We (and probably Blizzard) don't want to go back to first hit = wins.
Like in pre-BC battlegrounds.
But doubt it will ever get that bad again.

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Originally Posted by Ualaa

So after 32.5% Resiliency, gem Stamina if you want to have increased survivability.
Or for DPS, if you want to kill faster.

Ideally a mix, so you can blow anyone and everyone up, fairly instantly with 4x DPS.
But have enough defenses that your healer (or you) can react and save your toons when less coordinated DPS hit you.
At least in an ideal world.

We (and probably Blizzard) don't want to go back to first hit = wins.
Like in pre-BC battlegrounds.
But doubt it will ever get that bad again.

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I wouldnt be so sure on that-

32.5% being the soft cap in 4.1 before new/higher resil gear is released in 4.2 pretty much guarantees huge higher burst potential. Most pvpers run 40% dmg reduction at the moment and druid/priest and shamans are running 2/3 for 4300+ resilience.

People will hit the 32.5% cap in just mostly pvp set gear, this will bring back using pve gear in some classes. Warriors atm can 2 shot people in a throwdown. Also people have to remember that in Woltk resilience also affected crit chance which it no longer affects.

I wanted to add that I think this change is an attempt to curtail the current melee pain train.

Im not sure its going to work. Warriors are already a class I have to watch out for...

Well... pre-BC, right at the end of Classic Warcraft.
Every class could either one-shot or two-shot any other class.

I don't think we will again get to the point where any geared toon will automatically win against any other geared toon (every time), because they pushed their initial attack key first.
Sure a given class might have an overpowered ability, which makes them a threat to drop someone fast.
But I don't see <insert weakest pvp class in the game> automatically winning against <insert the class hardest for them to drop> because they pushed "1" first... which is how late classic wow was for anyone with raid gear and a decent weapon.

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Originally Posted by Multibocks

Im not sure its going to work. Warriors are already a class I have to watch out for...

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They are pretty insane atm.

Ualaa- I think everyone is in agreement with your statement and its the main reason resilience was implemented. However, I think there needs to be more burst capability, especially with certain classes. Otherwise you have what we have now, long drawn out games that are tedious sometimes.

Agreed.
Some kind of a happy medium.

Hopefully, where coordinated burst (boxing) has a significant enough advantage to compensate for reduced independent actions (individual play).