Dont race change to undead

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Originally Posted by Fursphere

Your arguement is that WotF was unjustifiably nerfed because Shaman have tremor totems (that can be stacked with multiple Shaman in a group/raid)? (Since you specifically attacked an alliance player that may or may not play multiple Shaman)

1) Both Races have Shaman. So that has nothing to do with Alliance/Horde
2) Undead cannot be Shaman. So who cares about Shaman. Humans have "every man for himself" and you aren't bitching about them. (and they can't be Shaman either)

So... what are you talking about again?

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My arguement is that he doesn't care because he has his fear immunity in pvp already and that being alliance he has a natural dislike for horde, hence his typical WoW forum troll comments.


Face it, fear bombs are a bane to multiboxer pvp and a huge reason why shaman are one of the few successful comps. WotF was a very slight work around to try and counter fear bombs and play different comps, but that'll be gone soon.

From a solo perspective, undead is a horrible race choice for pvp now, they will be picked as rarely as trolls were from now on. Blood elf population is about to get even higher, and when comparing horde racials to the alliance racials will make any serious pvper laugh. It's not even close at all anymore.

Though, like someone already mentioned, this could be just the first step to nerfing all racials to uselessness, which is a good thing if that's what it's really about.

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Originally Posted by TheBigBB

How can you blame the entire alliance faction for causing this change? That makes about as much sense as blaming undead players who gloated about how good their racial was. We have no idea what the discussion at Blizzard headquarters really was, so don't go flaming others just because you're upset. I'd like to imagine that Blizzard had some statistics that showed undead players were winning disproportionately often.

I do think that Blizzard ought to compensate this change by giving undead some other benefit...

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I never said "entire" alliance. It would be a bit silly to accuse me of and assume i meant every single alliance player, wouldn't it? The answer you're looking for is YES.

And it's not that wotf got nerfed to the point that if you use it after this patch you're basically killing yourself by putting your trinket on cd. It's a wasted racial spot. It's the fact that undead have absolutely nothing good racial-wise now. Horrible race choice. They could have just mirrored it to the human racial EMfH, and that'd have been great. Would make sense since they are basically former humans, but no they just trashed the race all together and now we have a bunch of Dbags taunting us about it as if they haven't had amazing racials on the alliance side since BC started.

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Originally Posted by Naysayer

I never said "entire" alliance. It would be a bit silly to accuse me of and assume i meant every single alliance player, wouldn't it? The answer you're looking for is YES.

And it's not that wotf got nerfed to the point that if you use it after this patch you're basically killing yourself by putting your trinket on cd. It's a wasted racial spot. It's the fact that undead have absolutely nothing good racial-wise now. Horrible race choice. They could have just mirrored it to the human racial EMfH, and that'd have been great. Would make sense since they are basically former humans, but no they just trashed the race all together and now we have a bunch of Dbags taunting us about it as if they haven't had amazing racials on the alliance side since BC started.

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It's not silly to accuse you of something that you clearly said:

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Originally Posted by Naysayer

Could tell you to get a backbone so that you would not have whined so much that wotf got nerfed in the first place, right? It was alliance whining that got it changed"

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If this is not supposed to be hostile towards pretty much all alliance players, then you need to pay attention to what you're saying, because I don't see how else it can be taken. People playing alliance has nothing to do with it. Blizzard made the call. Even to walk up to a person whining about it and blame them doesn't make any sense.

Overall I see what you're saying, but the general trend has been to reduce the usefulness of racials to eliminate any major advantages, so anyone who thinks they're so overpowered is going to get nerfed sooner or later. In this case, I do think they ought to consider reworking the ability instead of doing what they're doing. I suspect that the outcry against this will cause some more changes.

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Originally Posted by Fursphere

So.. having an extra trinket spot free to put a non-pvp based trinket in the spot is worthless? Really?

Technically, instead of a fixed racial, you get a PvP trinket built in, and then get to CHOOSE something else. (whatever you like!)
All other races ('cept humans) have to choose PvP trinket + "x" trinket. Then they get a fixed racial that has probably changed since they first rolled the character.

Undead and Humans really have the upper hand here in flexibility. You're just looking at the little picture, completely oblivious to the big picture.

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Yeah, come to think of it, this is a pretty good tradeoff, but maybe it's just because I'm totally obsessive about min-maxing. The thing is, most people aren't very good at noticing the difference a few stat points can make, but if you ever won by a slight margin, just a small stat decrease could have made it a loss. For any fight where you wouldn't have needed the extra trinket, you'll be stronger...

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Originally Posted by Fursphere

When I remember to equip my pvp trinket I have very few fear bomb problems. Even without tremors.

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i'm sure you do well in arena and/or non-casual pvp situations as well.



/sarcasm

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Originally Posted by Fursphere

So.. having an extra trinket spot free to put a non-pvp based trinket in the spot is worthless? Really?

Technically, instead of a fixed racial, you get a PvP trinket built in, and then get to CHOOSE something else. (whatever you like!)
All other races ('cept humans) have to choose PvP trinket + "x" trinket. Then they get a fixed racial that has probably changed since they first rolled the character.

Undead and Humans really have the upper hand here in flexibility. You're just looking at the little picture, completely oblivious to the big picture.

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So if i don't use the pvp trinket because i have wotf then what do I do when a rogue stuns/saps/blinds me? What about all of the other cc that isn't a charm lol, sleep lol, or fear? It's not like we had

Every Man for HimselfRacialInstant2 min cooldownRemoves all movement impairing effects and all effects which cause loss of control of your character. This effect shares a cooldown with other similar effects.


I don't think you even know what wotf does.

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Originally Posted by TheBigBB

Yeah, come to think of it, this is a pretty good tradeoff, but maybe it's just because I'm totally obsessive about min-maxing. The thing is, most people aren't very good at noticing the difference a few stat points can make, but if you ever won by a slight margin, just a small stat decrease could have made it a loss. For any fight where you wouldn't have needed the extra trinket, you'll be stronger...

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Yah, it's pretty smart for undead to fill those trinket spots with stat trinkets.

/sapped

/blinded

/sheeped

/snared

ect ect

/partners are dead lol

Why did I sit in crowd control the whole fight? Um, because I have wotf and dont need a pvp trinket.
/kicked

OMG W(o)TF is Blizzard smoking? I leave for a few months, come back and they have given humans a racial every other race needs to spend a trinket slot on (on top of perception) and they keep nerfing WoTF into uselessness. And my poor troll rogue got a 15% decrease in the duration of movement impairing effects...

I wonder if they looked at the racial percentages and decided there are not enough humans on Alliance side and too many Undead on Horde side. So we screw with the racials and give people the ability to race change. And they pay us for it!!!! Someone in the Blizzard team got a promotion.

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Originally Posted by Multibocks

Your tears, I feed on them. QQ moar peeps, seriously it was one of the most OP racials for FIVE years, it's about time it got nerfed. This is coming from someone who was long time horde too.

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I don't know why you think I'm QQ'ing...I was just stating what will happen if this change goes through.

I'm not saying "change it back NAO dammit!!!"

Orcs (blood fury), Taurens (warstomp) and Blood Elves (arcane torrent) will still have strong racials post patch. And with faction & race changes now available, I can pick whatever race I want, provided its available to that class.

However if you want to talk about OP racials, what makes the human racial the best racial for PvP is this reason - it continues to get more powerful as new trinkets are released. Just compare the Titan Forged trinkets to some of the other trinkets available now:

www.wowhead.com/?item=Titan-Forged Rune of Audacity
vs
www.wowhead.com/?item=Reign of the Dead
Difference: 57 SP and 150 to 370 DPS depending on crit rate

vs
www.wowhead.com/?item=Battlemaster's Ruination
Difference: 39 SP and 4.6K health when used

Humans can also use any combination of trinkets up to ilvl 258 including combinations like:

www.wowhead.com/?item=Shiny Shard of the Flame
www.wowhead.com/?item=Shiny Shard of the Scale

www.wowhead.com/?item=Reign of the Dead
[item=47316]Reign of the Dead[/item] (non-heroic, and yes they stack).

www.wowhead.com/?item=Flare of the Heavens
www.wowhead.com/?item=Eye of the Broodmother

And this gap is likely to become wider with the release of the next patch when better trinkets become available:

Cheers,
S.

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Originally Posted by Naysayer

Yah, it's pretty smart for undead to fill those trinket spots with stat trinkets.

/sapped

/blinded

/sheeped

/snared

ect ect

/partners are dead lol

Why did I sit in crowd control the whole fight? Um, because I have wotf and dont need a pvp trinket.
/kicked

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Yeah, I was thinking that most CC can be dispelled and fear was the most significant reason to use a PVP trinket, but I don't know what class you're PVPing with on undead.