I have to say, I do agree with the point Vyn is making. If we want to be able to appear to be making solid arguments and points against QQ'ers on the forums regarding multiboxing then we shouldn't be quite willing to go and use their arguments for our own purposes against something we don't like.

Yes, Blizzard have stated that win-trading is against the rules, and multiboxing isn't and no-one is disputing that...what is the issue is when someone here quite freely states "I don't care what Blizzard say, it's immoral/against the spirit" when it comes to points-trading. That argument is used against us time and again on the forums and we always have the correct reply to it so how can it make the community look anything but hypocritical when we start using it about something that is not against the rules but we disagree with? It only takes one smart troll on the forums to work out how to use that against us in a multi-boxing thread and that entire line of reasoning goes down the tubes.

In regards to points-trading, I'm not sure where I sit yet. I know it's annoying as hell lately to be trying to get my 10 games run each week with ~1100 rating and coming up against teams rocking 16k tanks, mages that can blizzard my entire team down to 0 in two casts, lots of s3 gear etc BUT it's also not against the rules so I deal with it and don't take it too seriously. Personally I think that the guys selling the points could be doing more productive things in game to be raising cash (since they are going to gain pretty much the same ammount of points whether they are rated 2000 or 2100 in the week) but that's their choice, and it's the choice of the buyer what they want to spend their money on...neither of which really affect me overall. Yes there is a distinct affect on me for those 10 games, but after that I am not bothered by them again so why should I want to try to regulate the way someone spends their time in game. If we compare this to real sports, in things like Formula 1 (or other motor racing leagues) it's quite common for a driver to actually get their seat in the team not through their ability but because they being with them sponsors...for example, Shinji Nakano replaced a driver in the Super Aguri team last year because the team were having financial difficulties and he brought sponsors with him worth over $10m that would only sign-up if he were driving.

Win-trading however was never going to be let fly by Blizzard and I don't see why people would be so short-sighted as to think it would. Blizzard are trying to position arena's as a competitive and exciting e-sport (never mind they still don't have good spectator functionality in the client to allow people to watch the top matches remotely) and the whole concept of win-trading is analagous to match-fixing in regular sports. I don't know about anyone else, but match-fixing has never gone down well in any sport and I can't see how anyone with an ounce of common sense could not see that the banhammer would be dropped hard on anyone doing it in the arenas...the same as athlete's being suspended or banned for it in real sports.

To me, this revolves around Blizzard wanting arenas to be able to be presented as an e-sport and bring them in another revenue stream without a hint of impropriety around it and they are doing what they have to to get rid of any perceived taint and I agree with them on that, but I don't think they should be classing points-traders with win-traders given the comparisons between the two that can be made with real sports.

OT: How can someone use S3 weapons/shoulders if they form a new team and start at 1500 PR? And if my ratings are at 1100 as they are now can I just fold my team and restart it each week, drop from 1500 to ~1400 points, get points based on that rating rather than just staying as I am and making points on a constantly lowering rating?