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  1. #1

    Default Really need help with group comp and few other questions

    I have read just about every thread on 2 sites about group comp (this and isboxer) and really most info relevant to my play style is from few years ago... and as I am sure in this game, much has changed. So need to ask again.

    I am a very experienced boxer (EQ2 and EQ). Boxed 24 in EQ2 and 36 in EQ and did raid stuff that other ppl said can't be done. NMever once used a bot... that was part of the fun is spending days figuring out how to kill raid targets by myself and developing starts etc.

    Over the last 12 years I have played WoW maybe a total of 20 hours. I ran a box crew like 9 years ago and then just couldn't get into it and went back to EQ2.

    I am committed to stick with WoW now and level a 5 team first, and then potentially build a raid force if it is possible down the road.

    So my questions are this and please understand I am still REALLY new to WoW but I am a very skilled mult-boxer:

    1. I haven't seen any posts in forum, but are there people successfully raiding with their own crew? And if so, how many toons do you need to do some raid instances? Or are there far too many mechanics involved to be able to solo multibox raid instances?

    2. I need advice on current state of game for the best 5 man group to be able to do the most end game stuff and get the most dungeons. Don't really care about gold farming or PvP. Just simply PvE and getting the best loot for my team(s) and being able to do the most end game and see the most of the game. I have read a lot of posts that running the trinity (Tank/Heal/Ranged DPSX3)) is too hard at later level dungeons and just to go with like 5 Prot Pallys or 5 BM Hunters or whatever..... I get that it may be a littler harder, but for an experienced boxer is it really? I also get 5 of one class is basically pushing like 3 buttons or whatever and trinity would be a lot more....but with all the addons and macros, is it really that hard to do end game stuff with a trinity comp -vs- an all 5 comp?

    3. I never really used any add-ons so this is all new to me.... but if you could suggest a few MUST HAVES for add-ons in the beginning for me to help me along the way I would appreciate it.

    4. When I did solo I played a Rogue and actually really enjoyed it. I have never seen like Tank/Heals/3XRogues or even 5 rogues. Would this be possible? I get that they need positioning but are there add-ons or macros that can do it?

    As I said, I am committed to running WoW and doing it successfully as I have EQ and EQ2 for 10+ years. If a 5 same class team is just hands down better than a trinity then so be it...I don't want to get super discouraged once I max level and not be able to do fun stuff and then quit the game.

    Thanks in advance and look forward to becoming part of the WoW forums moving forward!
    Last edited by StephenMB : 02-23-2020 at 10:55 AM

  2. #2
    Multiboxologist MiRai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    1. I haven't seen any posts in forum, but are there people successfully raiding with their own crew? And if so, how many toons do you need to do some raid instances? Or are there far too many mechanics involved to be able to solo multibox raid instances?
    SerScruffington is the only multiboxer I know of in BFA who has cleared numerous raid encounters with ten characters, and all of his kills are on his YouTube page.

    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    2. I need advice on current state of game for the best 5 man group to be able to do the most end game stuff and get the most dungeons. Don't really care about gold farming or PvP. Just simply PvE and getting the best loot for my team(s) and being able to do the most end game and see the most of the game.
    If there was a single right answer, then everyone would be playing it, but instead you have several threads (right on the first page of this sub-forum) asking about different comps, as well as which tank and healer are best for high-end content. However, the general consensus is a ranged class with high mobility, since most encounters have movement, some much more so than others.

    Overall, it's just a difficult question to answer when someone is looking to go from zero to one-hundred immediately upon jumping into a game that they have almost no experience with, and I just don't think people can tell you what's going to be valuable, to you, unless you get some hands-on experience with end-game content. You may have someone say they had a good experience with using a Shaman healer, whereas the next reply will say that they hated Shaman, and they prefer a Druid. Then, a third person says that Shaman and Druid healers are lackluster, and that Monk is what they like. In a situation like that, is that useful information? I'm not sure, unless they're all willing to give a full write-up of their experience, with added team comp and dungeon/encounter breakdowns, so that you can attempt to make a more-educated choice, but there's just so much information that may or may not be useful.

    However, if you want a safe guess, then I would say to use the same composition that Scruffington used (Paladin, Hunter, Hunter, Hunter, Monk), but, ultimately, a proper answer to this question is likely going to require that you have some hands-on experience with the game, its classes, and end-game content. Although, even armed with all of that information, you should still be prepared to level (or boost) new classes for if/when your first choice(s) don't work out.

    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    I have read a lot of posts that running the trinity (Tank/Heal/Ranged DPSX3)) is too hard at later level dungeons and just to go with like 5 Prot Pallys or 5 BM Hunters or whatever..... I get that it may be a littler harder, but for an experienced boxer is it really? I also get 5 of one class is basically pushing like 3 buttons or whatever and trinity would be a lot more....but with all the addons and macros, is it really that hard to do end game stuff with a trinity comp -vs- an all 5 comp?
    If this were back in Legion, then I might've agreed, but the only people pushing high-end content, currently, are those running mixed-class/role teams. Especially if you're interested in raiding as a multiboxer, as it's highly unlikely you'll accomplish anything by walking into a raid environment with ten tanks.

    Also, macros and add-ons can only take you so far. Add-ons themselves are generally used for displaying information, and macros are used for consolidating class rotations and/or expanding some abilities (e.g. mouseover).

    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    3. I never really used any add-ons so this is all new to me.... but if you could suggest a few MUST HAVES for add-ons in the beginning for me to help me along the way I would appreciate it.
    Deadly Boss Mods or Big Wigs, and then probably Weak Auras, but WA is going to take a lot of configuration on your part to make work correctly.

    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    4. When I did solo I played a Rogue and actually really enjoyed it. I have never seen like Tank/Heals/3XRogues or even 5 rogues. Would this be possible? I get that they need positioning but are there add-ons or macros that can do it?
    You don't see Rogue teams because Rogues have been, historically, quite disappointing to multibox. The core mechanics of the class require more micromanagement than multiboxers are able to give them, and, in turn, they lose a ton of efficiency because of that.

    Quote Originally Posted by blazicks View Post
    As I said, I am committed to running WoW and doing it successfully as I have EQ and EQ2 for 10+ years. If a 5 same class team is just hands down better than a trinity then so be it...I don't want to get super discouraged once I max level and not be able to do fun stuff and then quit the game.
    I would enjoy seeing others complete, or attempt to complete more high-end content in WoW, but I think anyone in your situation has a long journey ahead of them before they're there, especially with the gear, legendary cloak, and essence grind that comes along with it. I would certainly only focus on five characters until you get a better feel for what current end-game in WoW is all about, and if I were in your position I'd be watching videos from those pushing difficult content to maybe get a better understanding of what you're getting into.
    Do not send me a PM if what you want to talk about isn't absolutely private.
    Ask your questions on the forum where others can also benefit from the information.

    Author of the almost unknown and heavily neglected blog: Multiboxology

  3. #3

    Default

    I would say you definitly want to learn how to play in current and hard 5man contents first, before you venture into current hard raids.

    Reason being you need to practice and finetune your movements, interupts, remove curses, clense magic etc etc.

    For raids, you will also need atleast 2 tanks (ability to have 3 if need be is a pluss, to smoothen out those debuffs: holy cow the trash can be brutal btw) and the ability to cover most abilities.

    You can fidle around using this tool, to find out which classes and specs cover certain abilities: https://www.wowhead.com/raid-composition The abilities are shown to the right and below, as you click and drag a class into theraidgroup, it will show what you then will get, abilitywise. *If you hover your cursor over a ability you have, it will even show the spell used, in case you dont remeber which class / specc could use what.

    You will also want to find out which classes which classifies as a "melee", during certain encounters... (suddenly you might have one or more standing there among the ranged healing , lets just say it will not turn out positivly).

    I would highly recommend something like a http://www.stinkyboard.com/products/stinkyboard, its awesome when it comes to move the slaves around in a clump, to avoid certain abilities. You can ofcourse also use modifiers to increase the number of possible keypresses. Like, no modifers moves all slaves, with 1 modifier it moves characters within melee range etc etc etc etc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co9IubSWWNI

    I also have good experience from using: http://www.scythe-eu.com/uploads/tx_...2-View2_03.jpg Its decent enough if all you want is to use the left pedal to move them left...and right one to move them right, then you have 1 in the center leftover for what keypress you want. They also sell 1 pedal and 2 pedal varients.
    *though these pedals are for casual play (or could be an addition, if you use it with one foot, then the stinkyboard with the other)

    Sidenote: some raid encounters can force you to go to two different areas at the same time and fight stuff (could be different directions or even to a different phase/world= very difficult / "impossible" when current content.

    Im able to farm the trash with 20 characters on mythic and heroic mode in the current raid, thru getting raid saves from some friends. Its brutal: one single error on the mobs or too late movement = easily could lead to a wipe. I also had to create multiple custum keybinds to CC certain mobs. Just learning to kill these trashpacks is quite a feat in itself imho :P My characters are around 445 ilvl currently.
    Last edited by WOWBOX40 : 02-24-2020 at 12:55 AM

  4. #4

    Default

    Wow, where do I start. Incredible answers from both you guys.

    @MiRai - All of your points make sense and you really made me re-think how I am going to attack this game. Thanks for the brain juice. I was going to go balls out on one set and do as much as possible, but that just isn't realistic. I literally know nothing about what I need. Like you mentioned cloak and essence grind... literally ZERO idea what either of those are. I also see things like "I am ilvl 445" and no idea what that means either. No idea where to go for drops for gear etc... So I have decided to make a very mixed team. I did 5 new accounts, All RaF'd. Since i basically know nothing about any of the classes, I am going to make my 5 box 5 different classes. That will force me to learn a lot while I level and understand how each class functions and the intricacies of the game. I won't look at this group as my be-all-end-all, just my practice and learning group. Thanks for all your tips and input...

    @WOWBOX40 - Amazing input for raiding. Since I am new I am not even going to focus on it for quite some time, though I will definitely come back to this post once I do...I appreciate all the great tips. The stinkyboard! I have never seen it and just ordered one... worst name ever for marketing but looks liek it could make a big dif in my playing. Thank you.

    Again you two... thank you for taking the time to answer. I will keep you updated how it goes. I decided on War/Cler/Lock/Mage/Hunter - Even if I don't get far, that should be a good starting point to keep me going and learning and evolving. I know that will take a lot of work to be effective, but I feel that is the best way to learn, thrown to the fire. You guys are the best!

    One last thing before I dig in tomorrow - Is there a guide or video or link you can share that can give me a basic overview of what I should be focusing on in today's game? Like something that explains all the important quests I need to do, items I need to quest or farm for, other things I need to do to get to end game stuff?
    Last edited by StephenMB : 02-24-2020 at 08:26 AM

  5. #5

    Default

    Your best bet is to just play the game as normally, enjoy it, and get to level 120.
    The addon named "world quest list" is handy when doing quests.

    Then finish the questline to get the legendary cloak and any follow-up quest there are to get some essences for the neck (named the "heart of azeroth").

    Then do the new assaults (in uldum and Vale of... daily quests i usually dont bother with, but since you only will be running with one 5-man, it should be fine + you get rep, to buy some essences down the line) + do a couple laps around and kill any rares thats up. This way you will get some juicy 400 ilvl gear and slowly but surely get better and getter gear.

    The rare mobs can only be looted once per day, so get the "handy notes" addon with the N'zoth addition, which will show you on the map which mobs you have killed (the skull icon goes away), when they are back = means they can be looted again. Also pick up the chests lying around in these new zones, as they also can contain gear. Get the addon named "RareScanner".

    Then ofcourse you will be doing the "horrific visions", when you are able. Just kill the last boss asap "solo" the first few runs, to not waste time, you will understand later on. By doing these you upgrade your cloak, but also get more gear later on. Find some youtube guides on these visions to understand what its like and what to do.
    (if you happen to get lots of gold, you can buy certain spesific bind on eqiup items (BOE's) with corruption from the auctionhouse, that provide extra dps as they have special "procs", but this will just be a bonus and for a bit of fun).
    Check your spesific class/specc to find out which will work the best for you.

    The 2 x rings slots and also trinkets in your gear can be hard to get, (300-310 ilvl rings sells cheap on the auctionhouse, 400ish ilvl trinkets for a bit more) and farming mobs to get rings crafted in the zone "Mechagon" is not worth your time imho in the start, as you will be getting these rings instead from the 5-mans you will be focusing on

    Thats mostly it, as soon as you gain around 400 ilvl or so, you are set to jump into normal mode 5man dungens, progress from there and have fun :P And since you also will run a full 5man, you can queue up to automatically teleport to different content/places, without actually having to travel to the place/dungeon (except for the hardest 5mans, called "mythic +"(same 5mans usually, but harder + that that mobs have various new abilities, which rotate weekly). *sometimes certain 5mans can be mythic+ exclusive.


    Be aware that you usually will loose /follow and some characters will "phase out" when moving from one zone to another, this is normal...(just move the slaves forward untill you see them again on your main), but remember that if you happen to complete or is on certain quest, but a slave isnt.., you will not be able to see eachother sometimes: so the golden rule is that you always complete similarly far into quest / questchains on all characters, to avoid this).


    As content gets harder and harder, you would want to try min max stuff, by using various addons (some, like weak auras 2, can also track which character can interupt next, which cooldowns you have available at all times and much much more).



    https://www.wowhead.com/ = your main home
    (go to "patch 8.3" at the top, lots of guides in there on what there are to do).


    Personally i prefere to use https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/class-guides to get to learn how a class work, the rotations etc.
    Last edited by WOWBOX40 : 02-24-2020 at 01:45 PM

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WOWBOX40 View Post
    Your best bet is to just play the game as normally, enjoy it, and get to level 120.
    The addon named "world quest list" is handy when doing quests.

    Then finish the questline to get the legendary cloak and any follow-up quest there are to get some essences for the neck (named the "heart of azeroth").

    Then do the new assaults (in uldum and Vale of... daily quests i usually dont bother with, but since you only will be running with one 5-man, it should be fine + you get rep, to buy some essences down the line) + do a couple laps around and kill any rares thats up. This way you will get some juicy 400 ilvl gear and slowly but surely get better and getter gear.

    The rare mobs can only be looted once per day, so get the "handy notes" addon with the N'zoth addition, which will show you on the map which mobs you have killed (the skull icon goes away), when they are back = means they can be looted again. Also pick up the chests lying around in these new zones, as they also can contain gear. Get the addon named "RareScanner".

    Then ofcourse you will be doing the "horrific visions", when you are able. Just kill the last boss asap "solo" the first few runs, to not waste time, you will understand later on. By doing these you upgrade your cloak, but also get more gear later on. Find some youtube guides on these visions to understand what its like and what to do.
    (if you happen to get lots of gold, you can buy certain spesific bind on eqiup items (BOE's) with corruption from the auctionhouse, that provide extra dps as they have special "procs", but this will just be a bonus and for a bit of fun).
    Check your spesific class/specc to find out which will work the best for you.

    The 2 x rings slots and also trinkets in your gear can be hard to get, (300-310 ilvl rings sells cheap on the auctionhouse, 400ish ilvl trinkets for a bit more) and farming mobs to get rings crafted in the zone "Mechagon" is not worth your time imho in the start, as you will be getting these rings instead from the 5-mans you will be focusing on

    Thats mostly it, as soon as you gain around 400 ilvl or so, you are set to jump into normal mode 5man dungens, progress from there and have fun :P And since you also will run a full 5man, you can queue up to automatically teleport to different content/places, without actually having to travel to the place/dungeon (except for the hardest 5mans, called "mythic +"(same 5mans usually, but harder + that that mobs have various new abilities, which rotate weekly). *sometimes certain 5mans can be mythic+ exclusive.


    Be aware that you usually will loose /follow and some characters will "phase out" when moving from one zone to another, this is normal...(just move the slaves forward untill you see them again on your main), but remember that if you happen to complete or is on certain quest, but a slave isnt.., you will not be able to see eachother sometimes: so the golden rule is that you always complete similarly far into quest / questchains on all characters, to avoid this).


    As content gets harder and harder, you would want to try min max stuff, by using various addons (some, like weak auras 2, can also track which character can interupt next, which cooldowns you have available at all times and much much more).



    https://www.wowhead.com/ = your main home
    (go to "patch 8.3" at the top, lots of guides in there on what there are to do).


    Personally i prefere to use https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/class-guides to get to learn how a class work, the rotations etc.
    Awesome, will use all your advice, thanks again! Wowhead is impressive, sheesh.

    One question - I just watched a video on a multiboxer and they were skinning each kill and harvesting where they could. Is that essential and should I just do it while I am learning? Or do I need to be a certain level before I can do any of that stuff? Or should I just stick to killing stuff? If that will benefit me in the long run (skinning, harvesting etc) then I am all for it. Thanks amigo!

  7. #7

    Default

    I think you will get most of your income (gold, to pay for repairs etc) by just doing the daily quests, killing the odd rare mob and such, in the new assualt zones. Dont have to worry about getting any professions like skinning to begin with. You will have enough to think about hehe, since you are new to the game. When you are ready to and started to do dungeons for fun and gear, then you can start to think about other stuff. If you arent too skilled at economics at the auctionhouse, i would suggest getting 5 x druids and fly them in the zone named "Nazjatar", farming herbs, to gain gold.

    *note, you will need to gain flying skill first, for BFA, if so, which you will get from just playing the game casually on your main 5man team, doing quests in each zones as needed + the some dailies, to get "rep" with the different factions. The "turtles" rep is a pain in the A... but ohwell, just have to do those dailies aaaargh).

  8. #8

    Default

    I also noticed your focused on a setup similar to EQ (I also played it quite a bit and even in the past 2 years with the progression servers). The good news is that it isn't as hard coded as it is there. Where if you didn't have a Pure Tank and Pure Healer you couldn't accomplish anything. I was surprised that even in EQ a decently geared paladin or SK prior to Kunark and even into Kunark just couldn't tank as well.
    In Wow, you get a lot more options, and there is 6 tanks which are all more than capable of getting the job done, on top of that you can swap them to DPS or Healing if they have those roles.
    Additionally stacking the same character has its benefits, similar to EQ where if you stacked Wizards or Mages - it just makes it easier on your gameplay as the pacing is much faster and fluid in Wow.

    As you venture into higher level content and raiding - the most important thing is to maintain optimal DPS while handling the mechanics thrown at you. When you have a truly mixed group - their spell and dps rotations are all different. It can be a good and bad thing.

    End result, there is a lot to take in - and it's not a bad thing if you hit lvl 120 and realize you want a completely different team or you want to mix it up. Everyone has tons of alts and likes to mix and match. The next expansion (unsure on the time but probably Late fall this year) is cleaning up the leveling process. It should be 50%~ faster than how long it will take right now to get to the same spot. So sticking with it, and not rushing so you don't get burned out. It'll be even easier.

  9. #9

    Default

    Holy cow, very difficult running 5 different classes lol... and I am only on lvl 14. So I just deleted those 5 and created 5 Druids. I figure that gives me a lot of flexibility... I an go all DPS, I can go tank healer and DPS and so on and not really need to do much more than click a button it seems. I am sure there is a lot more to it but seems the easiest way to "learn" the game so my next teams aren't such a steep learning curve.

    oh, and what is the MOD that tells me what heroic dungeons I can hit and when? Like my druids are almost 14, when can I start doing instances and where? Is there an app that tells me that?
    Last edited by StephenMB : 02-24-2020 at 11:23 PM

  10. #10

    Default

    You'll be able to open your dungeon and raids with the letter "I" unless you remapped the key, and you can queue up as a group. Druids are one of the nice combos that it works for because in order to queue up from anywhere you need a tank/dps/healer and they fill all the roles for the group.

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