The grass is always greener...Originally Posted by nodoze
Pally would make for a good tank, but then I hear issues with mitigation on larger pulls. Makes me wonder, since I know the AOE threat from a paladin can't be matched. And having his blessings would be awesome.
Hopefully the pre-raid BIS make it a buzz-saw.
On the other hand, not having no aoe heal is quite a pain in my team and my pally healer so far does negligible damage too in between slow heals (but then she is only level 37 so maybe stuff changes once she gets holy shock?)
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You can spec into reckoning and put blessing of sacrifice on your tank, every time a tank gets crit it is transfered to your pally and she gets a reckoning charge, so you could heal and every few seconds land 6 attacks with seal of righteousness
Holy shock is really weak
You no doubt benefited from having a paladin to heal, so you could pop salvation. None of the fights you listed are easy for a priest. Spin to win? WW hits 4 targets, each bat does 110ish damage to all targets, there are like 10-12 if not more bats that come out, that's a lot of aoe damage that a priest has no way to deal with in terms of threat mitigation. By level 57-58, it was trivial, trying to do it at 52-55 was a bad joke. Likewise with Bael Gar, with 4 warriors running every flame strike, you're dumping your DPS into the dumpster. Yea, I'm sure it's a joke at 60, I haven't gone back since like level 55, but, at level 55 or so, it was NOT easy, let alone safely clearing through all of the 5x elite packs. Yes, it's doable, unless you're massively overgeared, I wouldn't exactly call it "easy". The point was, a ranged team would find it trivial, an all melee team is going to lose a lot of DPS jumping in and out of the flame strike. In the end, when I was doing Bael Gar, I had to settle on eating about half of the flamestrikes. If I ran out of all of them, my DPS loss was too great, and too many slimes spawned. If I tried to brute force, I'd fall short just outside execute range. Each persons mileage may vary on that due to DPS, if my characters were using 50+ DPS weapons and not 43 DPS weapons when I was attempting it, maybe I would have gotten through with the brute force approach.
I went back to do Princess at level 58 to get Thrash Blades, and I fretted over how to best approach it before I said "fuckit" let's see how it goes and adapt if something goes wrong. Turned out, what was basically an instant wipe at 52 with fear + dust push back, was trivial at 58. On my attempts at 52, the group got split up off of the fear, and there was no way to run the warriors out of the push back, and healing pretty much instantly pulled threat onto priest. At 58, when I got feared and the push back hit I thought "great" and then I saw that my HP was barely moving, so I said "aiiiiiiieeeee" popped reck and yolo'd in for the win. Blew her up in like 30s.
Golem Lord, again, maybe with a paladin it's different, but with a priest, with all the AOE damage that is coming in, it's very easy for the priest to pull threat and then you're boned. Like I said, I ran 4x DPS warriors, maybe running a tank would be different in this case, but, you have to weigh that lag time before your DPS ramps up, with the extra aoe dps that is incoming on the team, and the fact that you have to heal it somewhere. My mentality on the group changed in the 40's when the Ravager Axe started to fall off. I no longer really considered the team capable of AoE, and rather just a single target + cleave team, and figured that 4x DPS warriors doing individual packs would be more effective that running a tank, building threat, and then trying to aoe down 8+ mobs with a 10s CD 4 target max WW ability. Just didn't seem or feel efficient to me. That said, it wouldn't shock me at all if a paladin healer or tank, could make 3 ravager warriors work for real AoE warrior grinding.
As I said, and as another poster said, yea, Paladins are almost certainly the superior choice in this case due to their toolkit, but if you're not using a paladin with the team, it's very rough. Nodoze, you're using a paladin healer, if I am not mistaken, if you're not noticing this issue with healer pulling threat early and often, then you probably won't notice it at 60 as much either. This was an issue I've had all the way through while leveling. Priest is a threat magnet due to 4 melees eating all of the aoe/cleave/mechanics.
Last edited by Mercbeast : 09-30-2019 at 10:41 PM
I haven't had much issues with my 2 Paladins taking aggro. Note that my healing threat is split relatively evenly across 2 characters but even then I don't think a single Paladin would take threat either.
I start off most fights with all 3 Warriors charging in and the 2 Paladins are following in after and both Judge as soon as they get into range (and I often round-robin hammer stun on cool-down) which sometimes causes them to briefly get aggro but being they are mainly wearing mail (later Plate) it actually helps a little as it spreads out the initial damage. Even when they do get aggro it is fairly brief and the 3 Warriors easily take it back. In large packs where the Warriors aren't damaging some mobs or when there are ranged mobs hitting from afar the Paladins do get some focus but again it isn't usually a problem as they can tank the incoming fire due to their high mitigation.
Note that is even with me currently running -30% Threat on both Arms Warriors from level ~32-36 because via Blessing of Salvation I have been trying to feed Aggro to my single Fury Warrior. I have been doing that for some testing between Arms/Fury and there really isn't an opportunity cost for me at these levels as don't have a 2nd Blessing that helps Melee anyway yet (I likely won't get Kings until level 51 as both of my Paladins are going 31 Holy first before branching out).
I don't know what faction you rolled but 4x warrior feels like it's made for Horde. WF totem and Chain Heal+Healing totem should completely change the dynamic of this comp. I know priest is the best healer in a vacuum but so far I hate them in comps that have a tank or access to a shaman.
I haven't run every possible comp obviously but my mental model looks like:
Alliance - Team has a tank -> paladin
Team has no tank -> priest
Horde - Team isn't melee -> priest
Team is melee -> shaman
I hit 60 this morning on my 3x war 1x pally 1x priest. I agree some bosses are aids for a melee time (Bael'gar is especially rough), but for the most part my guys slice through mobs like butter. If any boss is hard I pop reck and just nuke it before it has the chance to be difficult. Pally always puts salv on my priest for hard boss fights for that exact reason. I'm really excited to get some good weapons on my melee now as well, since I imagine that will make dungeon running for gear/money ezpz.
My team of Pala tank, priest heal, 2 mages and a lock is now 60 by doing dungeons farming.
During the lvling Pala tank is the best, just pull big and AOE all down without any one pulling aggro. Pala needs the drink just as much as the mages so they sinc well and you can loot with the warlock.
But now I started doing the end game dungeons to farm my teams pre raid BiS and i find that paladin lacks a bit of tanking capabilities for certain mechanics both on trash and bosses,
If i had to do it again I would change the paladin to holy and change the priest out for a warrior tank.
Actually:
Alliance:
Team has a non-Paladin Tank -> Paladin Healer;
Team has a Paladin Tank -> Priest Healer;
Team has no Tank -> Priest Healer;
Finally hit lv 60 on my 4x lock 1x disc. Last 10 levels were purely thru BRD Bael Gar gauntlent (not a single quest was done) trash mob farming.
Average time per level around 2.5 hours to 57- then 3.5 hours to 60.
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