oFollow Discussion

[MiRai]

Those two don't really sound the same -- Pre-determined versus not pre-determined.

Botting programs have pre-determined waypoints that they run through and then cause your character to move through them like wickets. This program does the same thing except it dynamically generates the waypoints. Pre-determined is not the crux of the issue--it's having a program that automatically moves you through wickets. You're being disingenuous.

The problem is that you're making a baseless claim (my sentence is their example of usage!) and just throwing around words as if they're facts. You make it sound as if you've been using the program for awhile now and know exactly how it works. Have you used it? Do you own a licensed copy?

If so, then I will acknowledge your claims; but if not, then please stop making things up.

1) Botting is against the TOS of any MMO.
2) We don't want dual-boxing.com showing up in search engines associated with bot programs.
3) There's no reason to mention bot programs by name because... well, see #1.

My point is that given how strict the site is about botting the mods would set the bar a little higher.

How high would you like the bar to be set?

It sounds like you're asking for this thread to be deleted and for all future threads to be immediately locked or deleted because the content within them might fall under the 'fishy' category.

Where does one draw the line?

When talk about botting gets censored around here, it's most likely because it was used in a similar context to one of the following examples:
"My friend uses <insert name of bot> and says he's never been banned."
"I used to use <insert name of bot> back in the day, but blah blah blah..."
"If you check the <insert name of bot> forums you'll see that there was a recent ban wave."

As for bots... There is no discussion to be had about bots -- They're against the TOS of every single game. At this point in time it's unknown how oFollow operates, although you seem to be extremely adamant that it is a bot, regardless of the fact that you have never actually used the program.

Maybe we should also start deleting threads that mention the use of IWT with mounts because this also circumvents the same feature that was intentionally removed from certain aspects of the game. Unless, of course, you can get a public response from a blue stating that this is okay and acceptable use of game mechanics.

Actually, I think you should. Heyaz was given a 72 hour suspension on all ten of his accounts for doing this in BGs and the GM stated in no uncertain terms that it was a violation of the ToS.

Incorrect. He received a suspension for using IWT with both the mount vendors and the Ethereal Soul Trader pet. No one, as of yet, has received a suspension for using IWT with mounts while in a battleground.

Also, the thread I linked stays open and available to the public regardless of the fact that it lists possible ways to exploit and circumvent /follow in battlegrounds. That thread, like this one, is informative to the community.

The same could be said about oQueue. Blizzard broke its functionality back in 5.1 and publicly released a statement about why such add-ons are not allowed. However, a workaround was eventually released and the add-on is still being hosted on an official site.

So, you're saying that despite Blizzard explicitly stating that they removed the functionality intentionally and disapprove of its use... it's still ok to do it? We should support it? Also, Curse is not an official website.

I never said it was an official Blizzard site, but Curse abides by Blizzard's TOS. Is Curse in the wrong for hosting oQueue? If you believe so, feel free to submit your feedback to them, but oQueue gets installed into your AddOns folder and runs off of legitimate Lua code approved by Blizzard -- No external programs.

Really? You're appalled that d-b, a site aimed at multiboxing video games, would attempt to have an educated discussion about a tool which was just released and is designed for multiboxers?

Fact of the matter is... There's a new program named oFollow which is less than 24 hours old and was just released to the public. oFollow was created by Keyclone (author of another software for multiboxing with the same name) and is marketed as a tool that will allow you to use the /follow command (or similar function) in areas where /follow doesn't currently work.

If anything, this thread should stay open and active because if oFollow is truly deemed to be against the TOS, then this thread will help educate those who are tempted to use it.

This program obviously violates the ToS. It's not even close. It automates behavior, let alone behavior that was intentionally and willfully removed from the game. We shouldn't be discussing it on this web-site. oFollow further strengthens the "Multiboxing=botting" thought process, one which could eventually lead to multi-boxing itself being outside the ToS. I feel strongly that we should be conservative on this topic.

Again, you're just tossing out words as if they're facts and you've never even used the program. If people weren't being conservative about this topic then there would be members chiming in about how they've already purchased the program and how legitimately legit it is.

However, I see the complete opposite happening in this thread -- No one seems interested enough to want to purchase it and try it out.

What I don't understand is that you're attacking this site and its moderation, rules, and the way it operates. You're saying that because this particular thread exists, our overall integrity as multiboxers is currently at stake and it should be immediately removed, when the only justification you have for any of these claims is that you can't explain how the program itself works, so it must be a bot, and therefore, must be immediately censored on this site. It would be appalling to think that this site would immediately and completely censor a multiboxing-related program without even knowing how it works.

It's great that you feel so strongly about protecting the members of this community from things that may endanger their accounts, but no one who has posted in this thread, not even yourself, knows how this tool truly operates. So far, everyone is in agreement that it is "fishy", but this is a discussion board where we can discuss these things. People use this site to discuss all kinds of multiboxing-related material, and right now, oFollow is currently being discussed in this thread and on this site until further notice.

With all of this being said, it should be clear from my prior posts that I'm not defending the use of oFollow as a program, I'm defending the ability to hold an open discussion on this site without expecting the mods to swoop in and lock it for absolutely no reason; because at this point, there's no reason to stop the discussion of oFollow.