ruh roh

[zenga]

The random bg gear gap is not a big problem during the start of an expansion, much more after a patch. If you are a freshly dinged lvl 85 with 320 item level, you'll meet people in 400+ gear who can do 3,4 & 5x your damage, and have much more durability. If I ding an alt I want to learn how to play it in random bg's once I have all my spells available. Now you just need to eat shit for 2 weeks till you are geared, and then you can start to farm. There is no scaling.

A separate queue for lower geared people is a bad idea. It will be twinked, just like anything in the game.

A much better solution is an ilvl scaling buff like they do with dungeons on the ptr. If 371 is the ilvl from last season honor gear, 390 is the honor ilvl from the current season, and 403 the ilvl for the current conquest gear, make it so that if a quest green geared player joins a random bg he/she will have 371 stats. The player can actually start immediately to play/learn his character, and if someone takes a break for a patch he/she isn't way behind.

[MiRai]

The random bg gear gap is not a big problem during the start of an expansion, much more after a patch. If you are a freshly dinged lvl 85 with 320 item level, you'll meet people in 400+ gear who can do 3,4 & 5x your damage, and have much more durability. If I ding an alt I want to learn how to play it in random bg's once I have all my spells available. Now you just need to eat shit for 2 weeks till you are geared, and then you can start to farm. There is no scaling.

A separate queue for lower geared people is a bad idea. It will be twinked, just like anything in the game.

A much better solution is an ilvl scaling buff like they do with dungeons on the ptr. If 371 is the ilvl from last season honor gear, 390 is the honor ilvl from the current season, and 403 the ilvl for the current conquest gear, make it so that if a quest green geared player joins a random bg he/she will have 371 stats. The player can actually start immediately to play/learn his character, and if someone takes a break for a patch he/she isn't way behind.

Is it too much to ask someone who wants to PvP to get the crafted set?

[Peli]

Is it too much to ask someone who wants to PvP to get the crafted set?

On my server, crafted pieces sell on the AH for 1k+ gold per piece (when they're even available). What do you think a freshly dinged player would rather spend their gold on, 300 and 325% flying skill or gear that will get replaced in 2 weeks' worth of losing battlegrounds?

[Shodokan]

On my server, crafted pieces sell on the AH for 1k+ gold per piece. What do you think a freshly dinged player would rather spend their gold on, 300 and 325% flying skill or gear that will get replaced in 2 weeks' worth of losing battlegrounds?

* 2 nights of losing AV or IoC in BG weekends. :P

[Peli]

* 2 nights of losing AV or IoC in BG weekends. :P

Exactly.

The PvP blues are a sick joke from Blizzard. You can either farm for weeks to get the recipes yourself or pay through the nose for someone else to make them for you. Why they don't think that they shouldn't be standard recipes available to everyone (like the 333 tank/dps/healing PvE sets) is beyond me.

[MiRai]

On my server, crafted pieces sell on the AH for 1k+ gold per piece (when they're even available). What do you think a freshly dinged player would rather spend their gold on, 300 and 325% flying skill or gear that will get replaced in 2 weeks' worth of losing battlegrounds?

Kind of how an addict would rather spend the little money they have on drugs, as opposed to something useful like the rent or groceries?

You mention freshly dinged but, how freshly dinged? Someone that just started playing a week ago with no friends and no money or someone who is on their third, or fourth, or fifth level 85 character of the expansion? There's quite a difference.

Exactly.

The PvP blues are a sick joke from Blizzard. You can either farm for weeks to get the recipes yourself or pay through the nose for someone else to make them for you. Why they don't think that they shouldn't be standard recipes available to everyone (like the 333 tank/dps/healing PvE sets) is beyond me.

I don't find what you've stated as a valid argument because you're saying people don't have a gateway into battlegrounds to slightly even the playing field, when they clearly do (the Vicious crafted set gave over 3,000 Resilience). Then the argument turns into, "That's stupid. Does Blizzard really expect people to pay money for that equipment?"

If you have limited money you obviously need to weigh your priorities -- Would you rather fly around at the speed of light and get your ass handed to you for a few weeks while you build up Honor Points to purchase gear or would you rather start off with over 3,000 Resilience by paying a few thousand gold and fly around a little slower?

My Blacksmith/Miner was able to buy every single one of those Vicious patterns in a single week of casual mining on a high population PvP server with plenty of competition from players and bots; and from there on forward, she supplied the equipment needed to both my Paladin and Death Knight before they ever stepped foot into any level 85 battleground.

An alternative route from that would be to, I don't know, maybe find a guild with other people in it and try to meet someone who might happen to know the patterns... I'm just throwing things out here.

I mean... just because your neighbor owns a BMW doesn't mean that you deserve a BMW as well. If you were a carpenter/plumber/whatever, you wouldn't have to pay someone else to fix your house when it breaks. If you were a <insert profession here>, you wouldn't have to pay someone else to craft the gear for you.

Pay the market price, level the profession, or suck it up and take the cheap route.

(In before, it's just a game and it shouldn't be hard like real life.)

[Peli]

Kind of how an addict would rather spend the little money they have on drugs, as opposed to something useful like the rent or groceries?

You mention freshly dinged but, how freshly dinged? Someone that just started playing a week ago with no friends and no money or someone who is on their third, or fourth, or fifth level 85 character of the expansion? There's quite a difference.


I don't find what you've stated as a valid argument because you're saying people don't have a gateway into battlegrounds to slightly even the playing field, when they clearly do (the Vicious crafted set gave over 3,000 Resilience). Then the argument turns into, "That's stupid. Does Blizzard really expect people to pay money for that equipment?"

If you have limited money you obviously need to weigh your priorities -- Would you rather fly around at the speed of light and get your ass handed to you for a few weeks while you build up Honor Points to purchase gear or would you rather start off with over 3,000 Resilience by paying a few thousand gold and fly around a little slower?

My Blacksmith/Miner was able to buy every single one of those Vicious patterns in a single week of casual mining on a high population PvP server with plenty of competition from players and bots; and from there on forward, she supplied the equipment needed to both my Paladin and Death Knight before they ever stepped foot into any level 85 battleground.

An alternative route from that would be to, I don't know, maybe find a guild with other people in it and try to meet someone who might happen to know the patterns... I'm just throwing things out here.

I mean... just because your neighbor owns a BMW doesn't mean that you deserve a BMW as well. If you were a carpenter/plumber/whatever, you wouldn't have to pay someone else to fix your house when it breaks. If you were a <insert profession here>, you wouldn't have to pay someone else to craft the gear for you.

Pay the market price, level the profession, or suck it up and take the cheap route.

(In before, it's just a game and it shouldn't be hard like real life.)

Flying is helpful forever. The crafted set is helpful for a weekend. That's my point. Either the sets need to have a lower barrier of entry to bring down the cost or Blizzard and players need to accept that they're a waste of time and gold.

[Fat Tire]

With 40% baseline resilience the starter set is irrelevant now.

[MiRai]

Flying is helpful forever. The crafted set is helpful for a weekend. That's my point. Either the sets need to have a lower barrier of entry to bring down the cost or Blizzard and players need to accept that they're a waste of time and gold.

It's usefulness really comes down to how much the individual PvPs and how fast they can farm whatever gear they're after. For someone that doesn't play very often and it's going to take them an entire month to acquire a handful of pieces, the set is phenomenal. For an avid BG'er like yourself (I'm assuming here), you should have everything you need within 48 hours after hitting top level so, the crafted set really doesn't apply to you and you shouldn't be concerned with it. No?

And for the record, I don't find 310% flying worth it as I'd rather spend the money on something else, but I have been known to be a pretty unique flower.

[Peli]

It's usefulness really comes down to how much the individual PvPs and how fast they can farm whatever gear they're after. For someone that doesn't play very often and it's going to take them an entire month to acquire a handful of pieces, the set is phenomenal. For an avid BG'er like yourself (I'm assuming here), you should have everything you need within 48 hours after hitting top level so, the crafted set really doesn't apply to you and you shouldn't be concerned with it. No?

And for the record, I don't find 310% flying worth it as I'd rather spend the money on something else, but I have been known to be a pretty unique flower.

The upgrade for 280% -> 310% is pretty lackluster, but the upgrade from 150% -> 280% is almost a requirement and is a pretty big gold sink at 4-5k gold.