Alliance win percentages this AV weekend

[Ualaa]

Played 20+ games to farm the 5 war mounts and to gear up a lock and a mage, so 3 boxing here. About 70% win rate as Alliance.

Ran into few hordes boxing teams. Took the Alliance PUG team great efforts to overcome the boxing teams, and slowly grind to Drek.

Only 2 encounters with horde teams playing the Rath Strat. The first encounter was with, The Zerg, with 25 members, and Alliance won, a big surprise. I was smiling to myself when I engaged battle with Ualaa, Cloverine, Kakuzu, and Tiny.

http://i.imgur.com/ykNaU.jpg

The second encounter was, hmm..... educational. I am no AV BG expert but this was what happened. The horde team was very organized, whereas the alliance team consists of 50% 'no brain' toons. Those alliance with at least half the brain decided to regroup at the bridge near stormspike graveyard and used it to our full advantage. It actually works. We drove back few waves of horde attacks, and see the horde reinforcement count reduces faster. Needless to say we lost eventually, thanks to the impatient alliance toons. It will be fun if both teams are premade.

Regardless, it was a fun weekend for me.

Your encounter with <The Zerg> was five boxers, but unfortunately we had 15 pugs, so wasn't really a RathStrat game.
We wanted to do RathStrat, but the pugs were not onboard.

We decided to stay in the base, and use that as a choke... but again the pugs were not cooperating.
Still was a fun game.



The Preform AV Enabler wasn't working terribly well, during AV weekend.
But Tiny's addon Oqueue, is really neat.
Similar idea, but instead of each player queuing as a solo, the group leaders each queue at once.
If you use real-id, so each of the leaders is on the same realm... that overcomes the one server that queues faster than the others, which is very common in PreForm games.

[JohnGabriel]

[..snip..]
But Tiny's addon Oqueue, is really neat.
[..snip..]

I searched Curse and WoWInterface for this but couldn't find it. Can you post the exact name?

[Invisahealz]

But Tiny's addon Oqueue, is really neat.
Similar idea, but instead of each player queuing as a solo, the group leaders each queue at once.
If you use real-id, so each of the leaders is on the same realm... that overcomes the one server that queues faster than the others, which is very common in PreForm games.

here is the addon
http://www.solidice.com/oqueue/

[valkry]

Didn't lose a game on my 65-68 hunter team :P

As for overall, I think I have a win ratio of 60% on my shammy team. Over 1000 games or so. 90% on my ex-twink priest team (but that was because at 60 5x devouring plague would 1 shot anything and was almost no skill involved)

[zenga]

I really hope they remove the ability for a raid leader to queue up individual people. It has no longer anything to do with random battlegrounds. I know that I advertised as well in the past to form premades, but I changed my opinion totally after seeing some people I introduced to battlegrounds quitting after meeting those groups who's only goal is to farm HK on the gy. A big part of random bg's is the fact they are not organized, Blizzard removed the ability to queue up with more than 5 people for a reason. As well did they introduce rated bg's for a reason. I'm totally convinced that all those premade groups have a negative impact for wow pvp in the long run. Besides, what's the fucking point of gy camping right from the start ... a good battle where you actually have to play good is much more satisfying. But apparently I'm one of the very few who think like that about it. Not because I'm butt-hurt cause I met a premade (like many others who QQ about the addons), it actually doesn't impact me at all. But more from a gameplay perspective.

[EaTCarbS]

I really hope they remove the ability for a raid leader to queue up individual people. It has no longer anything to do with random battlegrounds. I know that I advertised as well in the past to form premades, but I changed my opinion totally after seeing some people I introduced to battlegrounds quitting after meeting those groups who's only goal is to farm HK on the gy. A big part of random bg's is the fact they are not organized, Blizzard removed the ability to queue up with more than 5 people for a reason. As well did they introduce rated bg's for a reason. I'm totally convinced that all those premade groups have a negative impact for wow pvp in the long run. Besides, what's the fucking point of gy camping right from the start ... a good battle where you actually have to play good is much more satisfying. But apparently I'm one of the very few who think like that about it. Not because I'm butt-hurt cause I met a premade (like many others who QQ about the addons), it actually doesn't impact me at all. But more from a gameplay perspective.

The only thing "Random" about random BGs is the actual BG you are going to play in. Blizzard is fine with people queueing together (and they encourage it). I don't understand why people get their panties in a bunch when someone queues as a group in a MULTIPLAYER game. Multiboxers are technically premades themselves. Why should people who are willing to put the work and effort into creating something like a 40 premade be drug down to the bottom level to the people who are to lazy to put any effort into anything?

[JohnGabriel]

I wouldnt say people are too lazy if they dont like joining premades. Most of the reason I multibox is I dont like having to group with and depend on other people.

I dont really care much one way or the other about allowing premades, but it doesnt make me lazy that I dont like too.

[zenga]

The only thing "Random" about random BGs is the actual BG you are going to play in. Blizzard is fine with people queueing together (and they encourage it). I don't understand why people get their panties in a bunch when someone queues as a group in a MULTIPLAYER game. Multiboxers are technically premades themselves. Why should people who are willing to put the work and effort into creating something like a 40 premade be drug down to the bottom level to the people who are to lazy to put any effort into anything?

The other random factors are your teammates and classroles. The argument that blizzard is fine with people queuing with more than 5 is bullshit. They have said that themselves and they have put in a queue limit of 5 people, on purpose. If you want to ignore that argument by saying that the api allows it to circumvent it: then the api is conflicting with what they have stated and with the limit they put in. What you are basically doing is tricking the system by mass queuing at the same millisecond. If you don't have enough people for who the BG pops, you leave the BG. That is another unintended behavior, as it has repercussions for other people in the queue and in the actual BG (they might start with 5-7 active people). Yes it's perfectly legal to leave the queue, the difference is that with the addon it's being done on a much larger scale, and you are not gonna tell me this was intended when they designed the system. It's very simple: if they wanted us to be able to queue up with 10 man, they would increase the limit. But they actually did the opposite, shrink it down from 10 to 5.

If you don't understand the impact these organized full premades have for the average player, then there is something wrong with your understanding of the game in my book. Imagine that as of tomorrow, all current players would queue up for a random dungeon with a full premade, and the same for LFR. Then the newer players (which the game really needs to stay healthy) will never experience good play nor be able to steal with their eyes. And big part of this mmo is that knowledge/experience is being transmitted from one player to another as the game progresses. The same is true for aspiring pvp'rs. If they experience the ganking from the first minute on a GY, by people who game the mechanics to increase the level of organisation a random bg should have, then what's the point for them to even queue up.

It's not the occasional premade that is wrong, it's the development of a whole community around it, i.e. the scale on which it happens. There are now everyday a couple of pugs that just queue up in AV with 40 people where the intend is max 5, with the only goal to just farm the GY, avoiding pretty much every bg objective. And if the outcome beats the intent, then something is wrong in my opinion, something that needs to be fixed.

About your argument that multiboxers are technically premades themselves: up to 5 people - as intended - there is nothing wrong with that. Nor will it have deciding impact on every bg you play. Whereas - definitely in the 40m maps where the level of organisation is much harder - with a full premade you have a guaranteed outcome. It has simply nothing to do with pvp in my opinion.

[EaTCarbS]

The other random factors are your teammates and classroles. The argument that blizzard is fine with people queuing with more than 5 is bullshit. They have said that themselves and they have put in a queue limit of 5 people, on purpose. If you want to ignore that argument by saying that the api allows it to circumvent it: then the api is conflicting with what they have stated and with the limit they put in. What you are basically doing is tricking the system by mass queuing at the same millisecond. If you don't have enough people for who the BG pops, you leave the BG. That is another unintended behavior, as it has repercussions for other people in the queue and in the actual BG (they might start with 5-7 active people). Yes it's perfectly legal to leave the queue, the difference is that with the addon it's being done on a much larger scale, and you are not gonna tell me this was intended when they designed the system. It's very simple: if they wanted us to be able to queue up with 10 man, they would increase the limit. But they actually did the opposite, shrink it down from 10 to 5.

If Blizzard was not ok with addons like Preform AV Enabler, they would have broken them long ago. There is a blue post saying that premades are a-ok, but my google skills fail me today.

If you don't understand the impact these organized full premades have for the average player, then there is something wrong with your understanding of the game in my book. Imagine that as of tomorrow, all current players would queue up for a random dungeon with a full premade, and the same for LFR. Then the newer players (which the game really needs to stay healthy) will never experience good play nor be able to steal with their eyes.And big part of this mmo is that knowledge/experience is being transmitted from one player to another as the game progresses. The same is true for aspiring pvp'rs. If they experience the ganking from the first minute on a GY, by people who game the mechanics to increase the level of organisation a random bg should have, then what's the point for them to even queue up.

Your reliance on a hypothetical is ridiculous because the situation you describe will never happen. Therefore, it is illogical to form an argument based upon it. Graveyard camping happens all the time in 10-15 mans when a 5 man group queues up (or one team happens to be terrible/undergeared). People seem to get along fine, even with all of the shenanigans of low level pvp.

It's not the occasional premade that is wrong, it's the development of a whole community around it, i.e. the scale on which it happens. There are now everyday a couple of pugs that just queue up in AV with 40 people where the intend is max 5, with the only goal to just farm the GY, avoiding pretty much every bg objective. And if the outcome beats the intent, then something is wrong in my opinion, something that needs to be fixed.

Intent is completely reliant on the players, not the developers. If all a player want to do is run around and pad kills, then they should be allowed to do so. The game wouldn't be much fun it it was "you must do x, y, and z in this order in order to experience the game." Those kind of games give you about 8 hours of gameplay, and WoW is not that kind of game. It thrives on giving players options and restricting them as little as possible.

About your argument that multiboxers are technically premades themselves: up to 5 people - as intended - there is nothing wrong with that. Nor will it have deciding impact on every bg you play.

So you're ok with premades, but you're not. I just don't understand how a multiboxer can be against premades when they ARE a premade. It just seems like a double standard to me, since you're ok with premades in one context, but not in another.

Whereas - definitely in the 40m maps where the level of organisation is much harder - with a full premade you have a guaranteed outcome. It has simply nothing to do with pvp in my opinion.

Bold text is false. Outcomes are never guaranteed, just likely to go according to plans.

[MiRai]

If Blizzard was not ok with addons like Preform AV Enabler, they would have broken them long ago. There is a blue post saying that premades are a-ok, but my google skills fail me today.

There is actually a blue post saying the opposite about the add-on assisted queueing:
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...3390?page=5#94

However, I'll agree with this...

Graveyard camping happens all the time in 10-15 mans when a 5 man group queues up (or one team happens to be terrible/undergeared). People seem to get along fine, even with all of the shenanigans of low level pvp.

While graveyard camping can end up being lame if you're on the receiving end... at least in AV you can actually go to another graveyard and can never truly be camped unless your team controls no graveyards and you're stuck in the starting tunnel (although I highly doubt that would ever be the situation).