Anybody tried an all-cleric team?

[Zub]

I think you both have a different definition of FTL

[MiRai]

FTL is a type of targeting system and has nothing to do with spec or anything like that. As Ugh stated it stands
for Focusless, Targetless, Leaderless.

http://isboxer.com/wiki/WoW:FTL

I realize the URL has "WoW" in it but the page itself has general FTL information.

[Apatheist]

Gotta disagree with you, but in a nice way

I have 5-man and 10-man cleric teams. Nobody main heals, but all have 12 points in either Justicar, Warden or Senticar. I then go 12-14 into Cab on everyone and the rest in Inq. 12 gets you all the basic tools in cab. For a single toon, 12 points in cab would be a waste, but time x toons, the AoE potential is huge. Even with x toons though, your single target burst is awful with cab.

Don't short-change stacked CoB's and Soul Drains. Add those 12 in cab to that and an Inquistor heavy spec still has huge AoE and much much better single target burst, much better survivablity and cc. Round robin Excommunicate into your dps spam and melee will never touch you. Those knockbacks also interupt casting. Multiple Inq. gives you an always available AoE fear and more importantly, fear protection from Perseverance. Also, Tyranny + Bound fate pretty much drops any group. A couple LaDA proc'd BoD's will pretty much drop anyone single target.

I'm still undecided, but I feel like Cabalist has more reliable burst and doesn't rely on either GTAE or PBAE spells to AoE nuke. That's my biggest gripe with Inquisitor. I try to go at least 20 points into Cab if I'm sub-speccing. You knock the cooldown off tyranny and you get an instant full mana heal, plus all the passive buffs.

Also, something I've noticed, I much prefer 12 points into Warden for heal stacking. Justicar is great in PvE, but in PvP it has a lot of flaws. First, you have to nuke to build convictions before you can heal. Not a huge deal for Inq, but for Cabalist it's a pain sometimes. Second, I've found reparation not to be that great. Targets tend to die so fast when I single target them (Cabalist, ST+Obliterate pretty much globals anyone) that I don't really have a chance to passive heal all that much. Also, it's very easily purged out. A well placed AoE purge can really ruin your ability to heal until you rebuff, if you even notice to rebuff in the middle of a fight. With Warden, my flood is ticking for around ~150-200 (x5) and it's consistent, no cooldown and available when you need it. Plus you can single HoT stack ontop of that with spray. It's much more reliable healing than the reactive effects from Justicar.

There are good and bad points to both Inq and Cab. At the moment I'm leaning towards, http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10...V0VVx.Exobxx0q

Most of the best parts of Inq. Solid ranged AoE, passive buffs and an extra mana cooldown from cabalist. AoE HoT, extra knockback, 10% extra instant damage and a trinket from Warden.

With Corporeal Punishment up (which it always is, when you're spamming tyranny) you actually get 40% bonus damage with tyranny using this spec. 40% is higher than you would get going furhter into Cabalist for Negation of Life, which is where most of Cabalists burst comes from. If you pop off a few tyranny's first, then use Bound Fate, I've seen some pretty crazy numbers. Enough to rival soul drain, and BF is ranged.

[Apatheist]

Double post :P

PS,

Starting my rogue group now to compare their mobility. The only issue I have with clerics is their lack of ability to DPS effectively while running around.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

With Warden, my flood is ticking for around ~150-200 (x5) and it's consistent, no cooldown and available when you need it. Plus you can single HoT stack ontop of that with spray. It's much more reliable healing than the reactive effects from Justicar.

Hmm...I may have to give that spec a try when I get bored with my rogues. The AoE healing (especially during elite invasion boss fights) was my biggest gripe about my justicar builds. This might be enough to keep me happy.

[Smedbox]

That looks very interesting, Apatheist. Looks like 5 of those should be great for questing and PvP. Then for expert rifts and dungeons, I could switch out one of them to a Justicar role and possibly another one for main heals and support?

[Smedbox]

One thing though: It seems like it could be useful to have the cabalist "Dark Harbor" resistance buff. If the justicar tank has 20 points in shaman, he could get "Heart of the Frozen Sea" for a stacking resistance buff, and "Courage of the Eagle" for a wisdom buff for everyone. It seems like that wisdom buff could be really neat for an all-cleric group.

[jca]

I tried having all my toons spec'd 12 into Warden, but my experience was that those stacked Healing Floods simply weren't as good in practice as they seemed on paper and they suck up mana like nobody's business. Keeping the single-target HoT's up on everyone just isn't practical unless you're using a designated heal-only toon. I now keep a 4/4/2 mix of Ward/Just/Sent as my healing sub-specs.

I do like the build above. I've played with the idea of going a few more points into Cab. but so far I haven't been able to justify the lost points in Inq. I still want to play with a bit more in Cab., but my gut tells me that 20 in cab. gimps your Inq. too much w/o enough payoff. I'm always open to be wrong though.

LaDA is easy to use by adding a jump to your key-down and making sure your BoD macro has all the other instants following it. I'll wait until I have at least 2 procs and then use this.

Regarding Justicar though, I think everyone is grossly underestimating the power of DoL. This is the best AoE heal in the game. Period. Building convictions is a non-issue as your justicars are offensive toons and build them quickly as a normal part of their play, especially if BoL and SH from Inq. is part of their spec. With 4 Inquisicars in my 10-man team, a single DoL x 4 will bring any toon from almost dead to full health and top everyone else off in the process. That's one GCD and instant.

Btw, all this is from a pvp perspective.

[Apatheist]

With 4 Inquisicars in my 10-man team, a single DoL x 4 will bring any toon from almost dead to full health and top everyone else off in the process. That's one GCD and instant..

Warden and Justicar are roughly interchangeable (12 into Warden or 11 into Just). In my experience, the healing output is fairly similar. Justicars burst more healing, Warden has more reliable top-up healing. I keep flood up almost constantly while I'm actually fighting and if someone gets focused enough to outdamage the flood ticks, I'll toss a spray on that target with click healing.

Justicar can be good, I just get really irritated with having to rebuff constantly in PvP before I can heal, with people always purging me.

With primary Inquisitor and 20 subbed into Cabalist, I never have mana issues. Aggressive renewal and vile power are both on 60 second cooldowns and give close enough to full mana.

The only thing you're really losing from Inq by putting 20 into Cab is the passive bonus to vex and sanction heretic. It doesn't effect your primary damage abilities at all. Trading circle of oblivion for no cooldown tyranny and bound fate is a good deal.

By the way, is it just me, or does bound fate hit ridiculously hard? My gear is terrible (I've just hit 50, still in mostly level ~40 blues and a few quest items). I've seen crits up to like 2200-2300+ with corporal punishment up. That's more than my BoD hits for, and it's AoE.

[jca]

You're right about being susceptible to purges. That's probably the only big drawback of Justicar sub-specs. At the same time, to really make a significant different, everyone has to be purging your toons and that means they're not doing damage. Most things just don't live long enough to purge enough off enough toons to be that effective with it. Especially if you stack junk buffs as well.

Don't get me wrong. I love Healing Flood. It's a great, low-maintenance way to keep everyone topped off. The big problem though is burst. PvP is all about burst damage and to counter that you need burst healing. Healing Flood, even stacked and with Healing Spray, won't save a toon that's getting focused and in immediate danger of dying in the next 2 gcd's. Combine them though with an instant bit of burst healing to let the toon live at least a couple more ticks and it's incredibly effective. A big drawback of Healing Flood though is that it only effects up to 5 toons. That means that while you can keep it up on your own group it contributes nothing to the rest of your team in WF's. Both the Sentinel and Justicar AoE heals can hit up to 10 toons.

I do find the points to get the vex and sanction bonuses to be absolutely worth it. Maybe having a larger team makes a difference here, but spreading stacked vex around is not trivial damage. I've had people dies from just that if they're not getting heals. That also provides a low-grade HoT as well. Sanction though is a beast + a DoT + Instant. I place a lot of value on instant casts and sanction is pretty important to be effective there.

The problem with instant Tyranny is that it really isn't instant. You still have to wait for decays to build. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm under the impression that the talent for reducing Tyranny's CD doesn't effect Bound Fate?



And yeah, stacked Bound Fate's always make me giggle like a little girl. It hits incredibly hard.