MASSIVE changes incoming to ALL talent trees!

[Teal]

You can like the new system, you can think these are great change, but I don't see how you think this isn't more cookie cutter.

Where were we forced to pick one tree in the past? How can having LESS options not lead to more uniformity? Again, I don't care if anyone says cookie cutter is the best way to go or simplification is ideal, but I truly don't understand how anyone can argue this isn't at least slightly more cookie cutter than the current system.

If you are a disc priest and you want penance you have to max out the tree... if you are BM hunter and you want the spirit beast you have to max out the tree... The reality is that if you want to be a viable tank you have to cookie cut your talents to a certain point anyway... what is the difference? I can see how it would hose up some of your 5 man teams... but the game is not designed for your 5 man team.

Rolls are already uniform, they are already cookie cutter. For a enhancement shaman to have to use a 2hd weapon until he can get DW is retarded. Why is it better to wait for spec defining abilities? Why should a Tank druid have to put points into resto to be able to get tank talents? Why should a resto shaman have to wait to get earth shield if it is a class defining talent? It is not like they were not going to take that talent anyway....

[Owltoid]

If you are a disc priest and you want penance you have to max out the tree... if you are BM hunter and you want the spirit beast you have to max out the tree... The reality is that if you want to be a viable tank you have to cookie cut your talents to a certain point anyway... what is the difference? I can see how it would hose up some of your 5 man teams... but the game is not designed for your 5 man team team.

Rolls are already uniform, they are already cookie cutter. For a enhancement shaman to have to use a 2hd weapon until he can get DW is retarded. Why is it better to wait for spec defining abilities? Why should a Tank druid have to put points into resto to be able to get tank talents? Why should a resto shaman have to wait to get earth shield if it is a class defining talent? It is not like they were not going to take that talent anyway....

That's the point, I don't want penance. I have little use for a channeled spell given my playstyle. Before, I had that option. (based on assumption) Now I don't.

What's wrong with having retarded specs if that's more fun? Why does everything have to be cookie cutter or else fail?

This is Blizzards copout way of not being able to have good abilities that would overlap. Just giving the example of warriors, I remember long ago they were worried that bloodthirst and mortal strike would eventually be available given enough leveling and talent points. There are tons of other examples. Blizzard decided to reduce options so they wouldn't have to worry about the crazy combinations people could come up with.

I enjoyed the crazy combinations the most. Most others just want a cookie cutter build. Blizzard is doing the right thing by catering to the masses, but if this is truly limiting then those who enjoy trying creative builds will walk away.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

Some of the new talent trees look interesting but some of it is completely retarded. Bestial Discipline (focus regen for hunter pets) is a 5 point tier 1 talent, but you won't be able to take that and then go up the MM tree. Sucks balls, IMO.

And while it isn't cookie cutter for end-game, it enforces cookie-cutter playstyle while leveling, which would piss me off badly. That is, unless they're going to change how much it costs to respec to some stupidly low amount.

[Drizhal]

That's the point, I don't want penance. I have little use for a channeled spell given my playstyle. Before, I had that option. (based on assumption) Now I don't.

What's wrong with having retarded specs if that's more fun? Why does everything have to be cookie cutter or else fail?

This is Blizzards copout way of not being able to have good abilities that would overlap. Just giving the example of warriors, I remember long ago they were worried that bloodthirst and mortal strike would eventually be available given enough leveling and talent points. There are tons of other examples. Blizzard decided to reduce options so they wouldn't have to worry about the crazy combinations people could come up with.

I enjoyed the crazy combinations the most. Most others just want a cookie cutter build. Blizzard is doing the right thing by catering to the masses, but if this is truly limiting then those who enjoy trying creative builds will walk away.

Perhaps it is a cop out but as the game progresses and talent trees grow eventually and levels go even higher, let's theorycraft here for a bit and say they do another expansion after this one, however they follow the model of this xpac as well with only 5 levels...

That means I add 1 more row to each talent tree, I add 5 more talent points and I attempt to add even more spells to an already bloated spellbook of stuff.

At level 90 now, I am looking at 81 total talent points, a new row of talents possibly and a the ability to now take all those old specs and attempt to combine abilities... That's way to much bloat, to much confusion and to much possibility that my end talent point that I want gets nerfed due to it being buffed by some 20 pt talent that crossed with a 41 and another 20 that made it awesome....

Natural progression would be to remove the bloat, and give you options still (Same number just less chaos) and therefore less random OMFG PVP NEEDS PVE ABILITY NERF NAOW crap...

[Duane]

I don't like the change that makes you put 31pts first. Some of my favorite leveling builds are mixed tree. For example on my DKs I like going up in Unholy to get the ghoul then putting the rest in Blood. Sure it's not optimal for DPS but it fun to solo and it suits my pre 80 play style to a T. As it looks now I'll have to go all the way to gargoyle before I'll be able to try and get something like Rune Tap.

[Bot]

you guys act like you just know you wont like the new way at all. what if turns out its sweet and totally playable. what if it turns out that you CAN find a new spec that fits you well. i have to channel svper and say i dont much like this sky is falling stuff. you havent even seen the new stuff yet. just relax.

edit: missed owltoids other post

[Slats]

I love these changes.

You think you have choice now but you dont. Whats a ret paladin without divine storm and crusader strike? What makes an ele shaman all that different from resto other than a slight change in cast time and thunderstorm / earth shield?

To be Prot - truely be a prot pally you need to go all the way up and get holy shield and hammer of the righteous. Now you can feel like the class you are at level 10 and not at level SEVENTY or SIXTY.

This means they can REALLY balance a specialization and not balance TALENTS. Its their game design, they WANT disc priests using penance as part of their playstyle. They expect enhance to Dual Wield etc.

You see so many shit players who have no fucking clue what they are doing with their talents. I bet 80% of players goto Elitist Jerks and use the first talent build for raiding they can find. I would rather have a more empowered lower common player who is given more hints and clues on what Blizzard envisioned the playstyle of that class to be than some hunter running around wearing spell power gear or thinking he is a melee character.

I am very very keen on these changes and the reduction in boring talents. WHy do I want to spend 5 levels getting 5% to hit at level 35 or something. These changes plus quest changes will probably see me rolling new teams again and enjoying the game afresh.