WotLK - Trial of the Champion - (ToC)

[Whowantstoknow]

3rd phase of the black knight is very easy if you are using a pally tank and got talent points in Divine Sacrifice/Divine Guardian. Just hit Divine Sacrifice and burn him down (don't forget to switch to Shadow Protection Aura, this one helps too).

It's one of the few heroic bosses that is a true gear check- yes with certain class combinations it is easier but due to the nature of the stacking debuff it is considerably harder in worse gear. First time I did it my tank soled him the last few % but now he is trivial. My dps did not have the superior achievement the first few attempts though.

[pinotnoir]

I hope you do realize that gear makes very little difference in most of boxing content, take naxx for example, when i 2x5 boxed naxx it was all about execution and in the end dps/tank gear did not matter at all. Gear at least when 5 boxing doesn't make as much of a difference as people think, there is a point when at least for heroics life is a lot easier when tank is above 28-29k hp but that's it.
I guess i should had said that I'm disappointed with design of the encounters(ie. its too simple) not difficulty of the actual instance.
MGT back in the day was harder, more interesting and more fun.
People talking about gear....shouldn't most of you be in 2/5 t8 and 2/5 t7 already? o.o

Gear makes a huge difference in boxing. The obvious reasons are, your tank takes less damage, dps does more damage, and healer is more efficient. To say it makes very little difference is not true. How much faster can bosses be killed if your dps does 1000 more dps because of gear? How much cushion do you have to heal when your tank is not getting wtf pwnd by the bosses? How much more efficient is it when your healer does not run oom and has better heals? Gear makes a huge difference when boxing.

I remember when I started doing heroics coming in with some crafted gear and quest/instance blues. My guys took a beating and it took every ounce of concentration to down the content. As they started getting heroic and badge gear the instances became much easier. The amount of focus I had to put in for a boss became less and less. Right now my group is in heroic gear and some badge items lvl 200. The heroic TOC instance is a challenge for my group. I run a pally, 3 mages and a druid. I am sure my shaman group would do better with tremor's and grounding totems.

You have always been super geared out because of your guild. Not everyone has the time to accomplish what you have done. I know I have little time to play now and I can never do raids. Any gear I have is something from my heroic grind. I can't wait to get the new badge gear but with my busy schedule it will take awhile. I understand the instance may be very easy for you to steam roll through. However, just because you can roll through the instance wearing uber gear, it doesn't mean the instance is a cake walk. I agree that once you reach a certain level of gear the instance becomes much easier. On the other hand, for people working up the gear ladder the instance will provide a difficult challenge.

[Niley]

edit, actually nvm, no matter what i say will change your mind, from other posts I can see that some find this easier than others. Its all about having fun and not who has the biggest penis in the end. I <3 You all!!

[puppychow]

the more shamans you have the more of a joke the instance is, since stuff like grounding and chain heals is almost tailor made for this place. if you run for example a druid tank + 4 mage team, the heroic is a LOT harder.

it was a lot harder the first few times too just learning the fights, nowadays i 1 shot the whole place in 15 mins and dont even have to zone out between mount/ground fights. pretty much done running the place in fact, since I think i've gotten every piece of loot I can use.

[Malekyth]

By default, I'm going to start assuming that anyone who says, "this is so easy" or "I'm underwhelmed by the difficulty level here" or "this boss is a joke" is always running shamans. :P

I can't win any fight with the initial three champions, if it includes Colosos. I've got four arcane torrents on round robin now but it's still not enough to keep ahead of his heals while trying to keep all my dps and healer alive. I haven't fought the much lamer of the two second bosses in heroic yet, and expect he'll be doable, but Paletress is way, way too hard just yet.

Buuuut ... not gonna complain, 'cause it's been awhile since I had to learn or re-gear a new fight. The last heroic stumbling block was Loken, whom I one-shot with impunity now, so it's nice to no longer be on top of the heap. I've got about half the badges I need for some gear upgrades, soooo ... coming soon.

[Greythan]

Gear makes a huge difference. I stopped paying attention to Niley's posts in this thread after he asserted otherwise.

This is far from trivial for any team. I don't run a shaman team so I can only speak to my fivesome, but its tough.

By comparison, I ran Gundrak today after gearing up my team on the normal ToC and the handful of heroic drops I've picked up from killing the first set of bosses and Eadric (the one time I drew him). Gundrak was on farm mode for me before, but after upgrading a bunch of lvl 200 purples from ToC normal, I didn't even blow bloodlust. Was in and out of Gundrak in 45 minutes and barely had to med.

I've run that instance probably 40 times so my "skill" was no different. However, my tank is now 31k HP buffed compared to 25k prior to gearing up in ToC.

Yeah, gear makes no difference. /cough

[Prega]

In heroic mode this instance is a real nightmare for my main team (5x pallys).
Normal is trivial but heroic...really hard.
Last night tryed it again. In my previous attempts i wiped always vs 3 champions.
But this time (hehe) no rogue around.
Got warrior+caster belf+hunter.
It was hard but finally doable.
2nd boss(got female) is hard but doable too (a couple of wipes).
DK is really harder in heroic. but again doable.
What i cant understand : the huge difference (at least for me) between 3 champions WITH rogue and 3 champions WITHOUT him.
Balance
cost = 600g in repair (total in 3 days)
gain =good polearm weapon x1

[king.pa]

What i cant understand : the huge difference (at least for me) between 3 champions WITH rogue and 3 champions WITHOUT him.

Same thing here !!!

When I'm in front of the rogue AND the chaman healer... the only possible choise is ti burn ALL my CDs ... Earth elem + trinkets along with Heroism ... and burst the heal first...

I just down'em ... heal + mage + hunt that was very nice & easy ...

[Greythan]

That rogues melee AE is unreal.

Its funny how the different fights seem to test the different set ups. The 3 champion combo has never been a problem for my team. However, I have yet to get Paletress.

Its a fun test. Grats on polearm!

[Greythan]

Niley,

If you'd limited your comments to design concerns, that would have been received well. I happen to agree. Its a straight forward vanilla set of boss fights. That said, expecting something else from an arena-based instance is probably silly.

So, You've cleared instance before and after upgrades eh?
so the end result is identical other than you clearing it 4 minutes faster.

No, the end result isn't identical. I had some encounters that I didn't clear until hitting a certain gear threshold. Also, I had some fights that I'd win 1 out of 2 or 3 tries that after getting geared I one shotted there after.

Just in case you dont remember some of us cleared everything but one instance about 2 or 3 weeks after wotlk was released, and even then when NO ONE had gear it wasn't that hard.
Ss2 was the first one to clear all heroics, within a week of wotlk release iirc.

So, you cleared Oculus 2 or 3 weeks after WotLK in blue/green gear? Old Kingdom was cake then too huh?

Look, if you're that skilled a player then hats off to you. I happen to think you're blowing a bunch of arrogant smoke in this thread. Gear of course makes a difference. The entire game is based on scaling gear to take on the next challenge.