5 Boxing DK's - hit a wall in UK

[Souca]

So I take it that without the ! in front of Rune Strike, it will be using up RP if Rune Strike procs a 2nd time before I actually swing - becuase of the bug with it where it consumes RP upon activation and not on the actual swing? Woudn't it be better to have it before the castsequence in the macro though? Otherwise you need to go through the whole macro before it will activate?

I was deliberately only using 1 blood rune becuase I wanted to have 1 blood available in case I need to Rune Tap in a hurry - but upon reflection, I'm missing out on the extra 10% parry from Blade Barrier, so this is probably not a good idea...will have another play with the macros tonight...

Hmm, didn't know about the double usage bug. I have the ! in there because the second button mash would end up turning Rune Strike off and if I had a swing before I mashed again I wouldn't use the Rune Strike.

I put it after the castsequence out of habit. It will still execute it even if their is a GCD since Rune Strike doesn't trigger the GCD. I don't know if it will activate Rune Strike if the cast you are doing is the one that gives you the RP, so I put it after just in case that cast gives me enough.

Hmm, I hear you on the Rune Tap, but it's just a lot of dps to be losing. One thing you might want to look at is picking up some of the Death Rune talents. They let you get more multi rune abilities off in a 20 second rotation. I usually get two death strikes and a obliterate before I refresh diseaeses.

If I come up with something I like tonight I'll be sure to post it.

- Souca -

[Stealthy]

Most bosses in Nexus are easier than UK. That 4 pull in front of prince is BRUTAL and will most likely wipe you. Remember to move around a lot as they drop grenades on the ground and try (heh) to take out the Runecasters first as they drop shields on everyone. I havent tried this instance on heroic since a few weeks ago, but that *(&;(*& prince kept tombing my healer and it wiped my group. I didnt even get him to 50% so I figured he was probably more work than hes worth. Also this instance has WAY too much trash. I mean like double some other instances. What I do to alleviate the low RP /castsequence is I split my macro (thanks to Fury I believe... or was it Zerocool?) I do all the RP generating stuff first i.e. IT, PS, Blood strike (?) and then have a second button I mash for RP abilities and then I just watch my RP and switch back and forth. It's not the best solution, but eh it works.

Maybe someday I will start testing what would be best for DKs being MB'd, but for now I can't be axed.

Yeah I definitely take out the Runcecasters first...those sheilds are f**king annoying. The 4 pull is random too - sometimes you get 2 Runecasters which really sucks. I like the idea of splitting RP generating and consuming abilites - I think the setup will be one button for the strikes, another for pestilence / blood boil, and the 3rd for the abilities that cost RP.

Another issue is - at level 70 you're 1 talent point short of Vampiric Blood if you go Unholy to get your permanent ghoul. Worst case scenario, I come back and do it at 71...but Zero managed to pull it off at 70, so it definitely can be done.

Cheers,

S.

[Souca]

Ugg.

So I threw myself against UK last night and the results were disappointing. In all fairness though, I didn't have any where near the proper gear for it. I did learn some things that I will need to factor in to my next attempts at instances or when I hit 80.

• Positioning. I have a pretty dumb macro to handle follow for questing, I simply refollow after every melee ability. This works fine for single or small packs that die in a few GCDs, but fails against 3-4 pulls of elites. I always end up with a mob behind me and end up taking way to much damage. I'll have to play around with a secondary movement and folow for the non lead characters to let me position better.
• Aggro. It was just all over the place. In theory, it shouldn't matter much, but combined with the positioning problem, I would have characters that had aggro on mobs standing behind them. I need a better way to control this so I know where to expect the damage.
• Survivability. This is mostly a gear thing, but I also think having more talent points would help on this front.

All in all I know it's doable; Zero, Fury and Multibocks are doing it. I just don't want to spend too much time figuring it out at this point. I'm going shelve the idea of all DK instancing until I get them higher level, likely 80, and can start building a proper gear set. These are currently my highest alliance characters at 71 and I'd prefer to get them to 80 before I stop to work on professions and crafting gear.

Much like MacArthur, I shall return.

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

First off, sorry that I haven�t caught this earlier, I usually just come here and get what I need and leave.

Looking at your spec, (nothing wrong with it, but, I didn�t use that spec to clear it.
As far as I know, Fury (ghoul speced, but did it at a higher level, I think it was 72, but also, he had a harder time with the last boss and never cleared it *Not poking fun or pointing fingers*.)

I had Vampiric Blood. Also, I didn�t use Blood Strike, or if I did, I got rid of it. I used Obliterate. And I might have used Death, but, honestly, I�m not sure. Also, the problem with your spec is that there is no way of doing AOE damage with attacks other than DnD.

I had Heart Strike. Which with 5 toons hitting Heart Strike at the same time, all the little skellies would die pretty easy. I can�t remember when the patch came out that gave Heart Strike AOE damage, but I was using it before they made it better.

You also have better gear than I did at that time. I had half cobalt on main, and the rest of my toons had 1 or 2 pieces of Cobalt.

Not saying my spec is perfect, but specs at certain levels make or break the Dungeon. My Blood/Frost made everything and anything within my grasp.

It might be your CD timing, your maneuvering, something that is stopping you from clearing it� Wait till you get to the 2nd bosse(s), lol, I liked that fight.

I�m not sure if Nexus was easier than UK. The last boss in Nexus was A LOT harder, than the boss in UK, but I also cleared both Nexus and UK at same levels.

I can�t 100% say how to do the bosses. But I can watch my movies again and I will be able to explain it in more detail, but as far as I can remember, that boss was easy, (not boasting), I mean to say, it wasn�t a run around the room and get thrown up in the air or anything like the caster boss in Nexus. It was just a stand there and keep attacking till she is dead. I�m at work and my video card is being stupid and not letting me watch it, so as best as I can tell you is, watch the movie and take notes, or something just to get an idea. 95% of my fights went that way with her. But then again, my spec is different.

[Stealthy]

Thanks for the feedback Zero...I've watched your UK movie a few times - whats the spell that makes the screen shake and go all blue (usually just before you cast D&D) - is that howing blast?

I'm gonna play around with my spec tonight and see how I go...I can see a few areas where I can improve, so hopefully better results from tonight's efforts.

Cheers,

S

[Zerocool2024]

Nope, no Howling blast, because if I had Howling blast, I would have had Improved Icy Talons. And the Screen/blue shake is me editing the video.

[Stealthy]

Ok, did some research about speccing further into blood, mainly to get Heart Strike for the ability to DPS more than one target, and found out some interesting info:

Hysteria (31 point talent) - stacks multiplicatively - i.e. with one Hysteria, you do 20% more damage, with two, you do 44% more damage and so on. With 5, you will do 249% more damage. The 1% life drain per sec also stacks, but you are also getting much more back from Blood Aura - assuming you're running 5 Blood spec DK's.

Dancing Rune Weapong (51 point talent) - If you are out of combat, and pop dancing rune weapon (DRW), and then target yourself and use hysteria you will get the buff twice.

If you pop DRW and then Rune Tap (glyphed) it seems that your DRW also casts Rune Tap, and everyone in the party benefits twice from it (i.e. 20% heal instead of 10%).


*EDIT* - looks like the DRW abilities are being nerfed in 3.1...so this won't be viable for much longer.


Brings up some interesting possibilities...

Cheers,

S.

[Zerocool2024]

[quote='Stealthy',index.php?page=Thread&postID=1809 93#post180993]Ok, did some research about speccing further into blood, mainly to get Heart Strike for the ability to DPS more than one target, and found out some interesting info:

Hysteria (31 point talent) - stacks multiplicatively - i.e. with one Hysteria, you do 20% more damage, with two, you do 44% more damage and so on. With 5, you will do 249% more damage. The 1% life drain per sec also stacks, but you are also getting much more back from Blood Aura - assuming you're running 5 Blood spec DK's.

Dancing Rune Weapong (51 point talent) - If you are out of combat, and pop dancing rune weapon (DRW), and then target yourself and use hysteria you will get the buff twice.

If you pop DRW and then Rune Tap (glyphed) it seems that your DRW also casts Rune Tap, and everyone in the party benefits twice from it (i.e. 20% heal instead of 10%).


*EDIT* - looks like the DRW abilities are being nerfed in 3.1...so this won't be viable for much longer.


Brings up some interesting possibilities...

Cheers,

S.[/quote]Lol, there is a post somewhere in the video section where me and a few others went into much debate/data crunching over this... Lol
It's a good, but the risk it to great, and most of the bosses have a way of making it even more risky do to teleporting, stuns, AOE stuns, transformations, and just random odds and ends that make it very situational (low, that is).

Some more food for thought:

[url='http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/deathknight/talents.html?tal=005502153300331323020101300305050 11000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00']46/15/0[/url]

/castsequence reset=target Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Obliterate, Heart Strike, Heart Strike
/cast !runestrike
/cast !Death Coil

Then IT and PS come back, they will be ready for round two, and the one that Obliterate used can be used for 4 heart Strikes. So you can setup a second sequence or just keep the first one going. There is a lot of playing around I did to get the perfect one for my group to do the best damage, I did a very good amount of spec dancing and combo dancing to get what I wanted.

41/20/0

Same deal, only, no Heart Strike, and you are subbing it for Blood strike. Also, now you are going to being death/obliterate and both of those make the Icy/Plague Death Runes, which means it allows you to make up some interesting combos that Castsequence is not really going to work in. So you might have to get more button happy than you want too.

Why did I skip Anticipation?
Because you don't 100% need it. You really don't. But you can drop some in Frost and pick it up. It will depend on your play style. When others watch my videos, they see my HP drop like a brick in water, but I don't seem to die now do I? Does it happen? HELL YES IT DOES. But that's the name of the game. Fly by, by the skin of my teeth. :P

Now, I did spec dance a lot, so at some point, yes, I did have ANTI, and I will have it in the end spec that I am looking at, it's not going to be 5/5 because there are other talents that I would much rather have.

I enjoy my play style. I like the random spastic moments of OHSHITEOHSHITE!...

Once again, there is a good general guide coming along that will help others in so many ways, and also, make it easier for people to have an excuse to not be able to find it and say that they used the search feature and found no such thing... lol, we all do it.

Life and Females are taking control right now, and, well, I like females more than I like you guys, so, lol... 8| I will get to it when I get to it. Till then, I will try and pay more attention to this thread and help in any way I can.

[thedreameater]

Lol, there is a post somewhere in the video section where me and a few others went into much debate/data crunching over this... Lol
It's a good, but the risk it to great, and most of the bosses have a way of making it even more risky do to teleporting, stuns, AOE stuns, transformations, and just random odds and ends that make it very situational (low, that is).

Some more food for thought:

46/15/0

/castsequence reset=target Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Obliterate, Heart Strike, Heart Strike
/cast !runestrike
/cast !Death Coil

Then IT and PS come back, they will be ready for round two, and the one that Obliterate used can be used for 4 heart Strikes. So you can setup a second sequence or just keep the first one going. There is a lot of playing around I did to get the perfect one for my group to do the best damage, I did a very good amount of spec dancing and combo dancing to get what I wanted.

41/20/0

Same deal, only, no Heart Strike, and you are subbing it for Blood strike. Also, now you are going to being death/obliterate and both of those make the Icy/Plague Death Runes, which means it allows you to make up some interesting combos that Castsequence is not really going to work in. So you might have to get more button happy than you want too.

Why did I skip Anticipation?
Because you don't 100% need it. You really don't. But you can drop some in Frost and pick it up. It will depend on your play style. When others watch my videos, they see my HP drop like a brick in water, but I don't seem to die now do I? Does it happen? HELL YES IT DOES. But that's the name of the game. Fly by, by the skin of my teeth. :P

Now, I did spec dance a lot, so at some point, yes, I did have ANTI, and I will have it in the end spec that I am looking at, it's not going to be 5/5 because there are other talents that I would much rather have.

I enjoy my play style. I like the random spastic moments of OHSHITEOHSHITE!...

Once again, there is a good general guide coming along that will help others in so many ways, and also, make it easier for people to have an excuse to not be able to find it and say that they used the search feature and found no such thing... lol, we all do it.

Life and Females are taking control right now, and, well, I like females more than I like you guys, so, lol... 8| I will get to it when I get to it. Till then, I will try and pay more attention to this thread and help in any way I can.

Females are overrated. Haha.

Looking at the changes since this post, how would you update?

Still use that spec? Same cast sequence?

Your vids rule.

[ghonosyph]

Hey guys ! been a while since i posted on the forums here, as i've been going crazy hard on all my toons getting stuff done.

I play feral druid + 3 dks, but i would like to offer up some insight on spec/advice for a 5 dk setup, as i regularly run heroics with just my 4 guys. They are all frost/blood dual wield(remember you want slow swing speed dps weaps for this to work best) Im pretty sure you can set up a frost /blood spec with a two hander, but if you have the gear for dw, i find it to be much more entertaining. when friends heal for me i always laugh when we kill a giant aoe pull and tell them "WELCOME TO MY BLENDER MUHAHAHA! Would you like a frost freezy bloody margarita? =)" lol

Frost/sub blood is the way to go for all your boxing needs. Armory my toons MoocrewA, MoocrewC, and MoocrewD.

the spec i use is a combination of mostly frost and a little bit of blood for rune tap/imp runetap and glyphed. This is your main heal and its rediculous how good it is with just 3 dks, let alone 5.

So you may ask yourself, what kinda rotation is best, what should we do, and how should we do it. First off, Learn how to use the click to move in combination with the interact with target keybind, Best melee boxing tool we could ever ask for imo!
the spec i run uses a couple different tools, the glyphs i use can be found in my armory if you go look at the toons, but for easy reference i use howling blast, rune tap(party heals are ftw with no healer), and frost strike. Howling blast is your big aoe, and letting it apply diseases is a solid bonus as often times you get free procs with rime (which lets u cast howling blast for free) rune tap should be obvious, tie this however you like, since i only have 3 dks, i have it tied to my T key on all 3, thus every 30 seconds i get a 30 % party heal. which works great for healing my druid, or any residual aoe dmg i've taken. This could be setup in a cast sequence so that each dk casts it in a rotation, so you get a heal every 10 seconds or so, but thats personal preference
lastly frost strike = your biggest dmg / rune attack. Making it cheaper is just a plus as after you blow your aoe stuff, you should be spamming the snot out of this attack. more on this below!

okay so rotations, i have my bars set up like this
keys - spell tied to them
1 - icy touch
2 - plague strike
3 - blood strike
4 - obliterate
5 - howling blast
Q - pestilence
Shift + Q - Blood boil
Caps lock key - Frost strike
Shift caps - death coil
e - death and decay (i software box so i dont have a good way to drop 5 of these at once so i rarely use it unless im dpsing a whirlwind boss from range ** you can place it one at a time from range and it does good dmg. useful for those times you dont wanna be in melee, ie ranged dps)
Z - z is my interact with target key
S - s is my target nearest target key
F - F is my follow focus key(i use a focus based leader system)
shift + F - this is my /target focustarget key (ie my main assist key)
T - this is my rune tap skill (all my dks have this on the same key)
Shift + T is my ghoul summon
Alt + t is my army of the dead summon(this is kinda chaos when you pop it multiple times, but it does an incredible amount of dmg in the time its up lol popping ghoul and army makes for some quick dead bosses)

I have the wow mouse, so i have a couple oddball keybinds attached to my mouse, if you have a 2 button mouse i recommend tying your death grip (in a cast sequence macro, or shift /alt/ctrl modifier macro to one of ur mouse buttons, it helps to have it on tap quick and ready.)

my other main mouse button is hungering cold: more on this spell. It is effectively an aoe crowd controll for everything within range of its ability. I have this tied to each dk on a cast sequence, one dk casts it, then the next, then the next. This helps for a couple reasons, especially on big aoe pulls(like the 4 mob pull ur having trouble with in uk)

Here's a good scenario for you and a small explain of how my normal pull / combat goes.

First off pull, i pull with my diseases, my rotation on all multiple mob situations goes like this:

icy touch, plague strike, pestilence, bloodboil, howling blast.
At this point your runes are on cooldown. If you have tauren like me, this is where i would cast warstomp in cast sequence 2 times. From this point all your diseases are on everything, and you have a bunch of runic power(likely 40 or more, which is what you want. Right here is where you blow HUNGERING COLD, This point in the rotation everything has now been frozen in place. let your diseases tick a few times and your runes should now just be coming back up so you can blow the second part of your aoe rotation. I would also use this time if possible to blow potions if you've taken dmg too much and to use any racial talents that are useful. all my dks have herbalism, and use that heal at this point lol

when hungering cold fades, your diseases should still be up, here's your next cast sequence -

howling blast, blood boil, blood boil, death strike(normally for dps situations you would use obliterate, but the heal is going to be useful because you'll have both diseases up to buffer the heal)

You've just done a shit load of aoe dmg again, its time to blow hungering cold again on your next dk. Hungering cold applies frost fever, so thats one disease you dont have to worry about. let hungering cold tick here and cast blood tap quickly while your runes are on cooldown then cast rune tap to heal up the dmg you've taken(blood tap refreshes a blood rune and turns it into a death rune, this is handy because once a minute you can blow it and pop the heal(rune tap) as an emergency when its up

If things aren't dead by now then i'd be surprised, with your dks swinging like crazy with melee attacks from your main target.

At this point if stuff still isnt dead, its still aoe cc'd, still taking disease dmg, and in just a few seconds your runes will come up again, and you're ready to blow smore burst dmg. the rotation here gets tricky cuz you've already got frost fever on everything due to howling blast and hungering cold.

From here you should just concentrate on dpsing down single target stuff. Cast plague strike, then pestilence then howling blast, blood boil, frost strike with your remaining runic power, let your runes come back up, when they do re apply diseases then obliterate(or deathstrike if you're low on health and rune tap is down) then blood strike/bloodboil if more than one target is around.


many times, perhaps EVERY pull, can be done like this. Zap ur diseases on the main target(which should nearly kill it) spread them with pestilence, then aoe as much as you can then BOOM AOE CC, wait for ur runes to come up while everythings cc'd still, blow shit up again with your aoes and then BOOM AOE CC again. Repeat till mobs are dead!



Now for single target stuff its pretty simple(most bosses this rotation is EASY to follow, and simple to maintain.

icy touch, plague strike, blood strike, blood strike, obliterate rune power dump(what this means is dump all ur runic power with your main runic power attack, in this instance it will be frost strike)

when ur runes come back up you'll have a couple blood runes turned death. Cast obliterate twice then reapply your diseases. (if you're taking too much dmg, use death strikes instead of obliterate, it still does good dmg and heals for a bit which helps a ton. Keep in mind rune tap uses up a blood rune, and in any point in ANY of your rotations, blood strike or blood boil can be replaced with a rune tap heal. Or in emergency cases, blood tap/rune tap (you can macro this to one key too btw) will save ur butt!

One of my favorite things to do is blow up bosses with major burst dmg, using army, ghoul, and empower rune weapon to do insane amounts of dps in short order.

for that type of pull i would cast my ghoul, then cast army of the dead, then horn of winter on ALL 5(this gives 10 extra rune power) then i would pull the boss. From here, cast your diseases, icy touch plague strike, then blood strike, IMMEDIATELY pop empower rune weapon(i use this on shift U across all my toons, it refreshes your runes instantly) and blow obliterate obliterate and 2 blood strikes. From here just spam frost strike till your dks dont have rune power up, then reapply diseases and deathstrike spam/runetap for heals and cast obliterate and blood strikes till you're runes go down then cast frost strikes fast as u can. REMEMBER keep those diseases up too, thats soooo important as it buffs your dmg and your healing strikes!.

This should give you guys a few ideas on how to pull/dps as frost /blood, and some tips that i've found to help out a ton when dpsing with dks in a multibox environment. if you have any questions, pm me, or visit moocrew on azgalor server horde side and i'll chat with you!


Good luck guys, keep pewpewing!