When to stop gathering haste?

[Lyonheart]

elemental oath is not a bad reason now that it gives you spell power. The spell power bonus is only when YOU proc EO. So having it up on the boss is not what makes EO so important, in regards to crit.

[Hachoo]

Actually EO only gives you spellpower when YOU proc clearcasting AND EO. So its not as amazing as it sounds (although still good).

[Lyonheart]

Clearcasting happens 100% of the time when you crit. EO is amazing for dps now. But i guess since you crit with LvB every time its up, you should have clearcasting up a lot.

quote" Elemntal Focus - After landing a critical strike with a Fire, Frost, or Nature damage spell, you enter a Clearcasting state. The Clearcasting state reduces the mana cost of your next 2 damage or healing spells by 40%.

edit:I missed the AND EO part, but it still a great dps upgrade from pre 3.08

[Multibocks]

haste is an amazing stat, I know everyone wants to see OOOHBIGNUMBER flash on their screen. My shaman currently run close to 20% haste (not including totem), that's almost PERMANENT bloodlust. I believe you are all familiar with that spell and how devastating it is.

[Fuzzyboy]

Interesting discussion :-)

According to maxdps, at 2k spelldmg unbuffed, with 100 hit rating, 20% crit unbuffed and 550 haste unbuffed, these are the extra stat contributions with a fs/lvb/cl/lb rotation:

(+) 10 Spell Power: 9.29
(+) 10 Haste Rating: 6.23
(+) 10 Crit Rating: 3.85
(+) 10 Hit Rating: 0.00

Or in other words: spellpower > haste > crit

@ 1000 haste with the same other stats:

(+) 10 Spell Power: 10.26
(+) 10 Haste Rating: 6.23
(+) 10 Crit Rating: 4.34
(+) 10 Hit Rating: 0.00

I'm not sure what maxdps' calculations are based on, but it seems to correspond to the general opinion that haste > crit, which is what I'm gearing for. My only concern is that it doesn't take heroism into account, since in terms of 5-man content, heroism will be up about 20-100pct of boss fights (for us shaman boxers anyway).

I'm going to search EJ and see if I can find some more precise answers :-)

[blbjtb]

Dual-Boxing.com Making me a better Wow player since 2008 HAHA

Ya gonna keep on moving along with Our friend Mr. Haste

After reading here and EJ (Which Really OT but EJ gives me a huge headache to read Like It feels like Im actually using brain power for wow)

[Fuzzyboy]

From EJ:

Just to correct two misconceptions:

"In my Patchwerk kill, 64% of my damage came from LB and CL, both of which benefit more from crit than haste (my total damage % which came from spells that benefit from crit > haste is even higher once you consider the first tick of FS and a few Thunderstorms thrown in)"

This in incorrect. For pure LB spam, or any combination of LB and CL haste will give you more DPS increase per point than crit.

"With the 3.0.8 patch won't crit be even more important? Keeping Elemental Oath up as much as possible will be a priority. Also, the spells that benefit most from crit (LB and CL) are being buffed."

Crit becomes a lot better in absolute terms and moderately-marginally better in relative terms. Regarding EO and CC the issue is diminishing returns. As has already been discussed on these forums, the 2 charge system for clearcasting means that any decently geared Ele will already be at 80%+ uptime for CC. An extra 1% crit will give noticeably less than 1% additional CC uptime. Whilst crit does therefore give us one of our best buffs, stacking it is inefficient in terms of DPS increase.

[Fuzzyboy]

Also from EJ:

There are a couple of reasons why Haste > Crit.
Haste affects everything aside from the FS DoT, while Crit will only affect CL, LB, and the DD portion of FS
Haste also has a lower rating requirement for 1% (~32.7 vs ~45.9 for crit)
Lastly, we already get a high amount of crit. I can be sitting around the 45% mark, so 1% more is a 146/145=0.689% increase, while going from 14% to 15% haste is an increase of 115/114=0.877%

[Hachoo]

Missing a couple pieces of info there - crit also effects magma totems (which haste doesn't I don't believe) as well as other periodic things that can crit. Crit and haste both also effect healing spells - I would imagine this is where haste shines even more though - getting 4x chain heals off 20% faster is a HUGE benefit.

[Fuzzyboy]

Additional thoughts (not from EJ): Doing primarily 5-man instances there are a few things which changes our min/maxing from the EJ min/maxing (which are aimed towards raidiing):

1) Bosses top out at level 82, putting our hitcap much lower (6% instead of 17%)
2) Our gear choices are much more limited
3) We don't have mana issues because boss fights are short

Ad. 1) With a draenei in the party and elemental precision, our effective hit cap is 6% - 3% - 1% = 2% = ca. 53 hit rating. This goal will be reached almost no matter what you do - T7 gloves alone is 42 hit rating with socket bonus, leaving us needing just 11 hit, which can be reached with 1 +hit gem.