GM Malkorix on automation, fairness, PvP balance...

[Tonuss]

Umm... sit around an LFG for an hour to get a single run, or do two or three runs in that same time frame? Hmm.... I think he's a little out of touch with what (some) of us are capable of. And just because it takes a little longer to gear our toons.... when you take out the "idiot PuG member" factor, you pretty much eliminate the gear deficiency.

Yeah, but using PUGs or bad players to make the point is exactly what people like Kaideline do. Her rationale for disallowing multiboxing? That it grants an "overwhelming" advantage in BGs because of bad PUG groups.

Any player controlling a single character who has access to a busy-enough guild will not wait for PUG groups to form. I play in a guild I helped start with RL friends and which we grew with people who became friends. I've played WoW since November of 2004 and have been in something like three or four PUGs. And I am not exaggerating. I *never* run PUGs. And I definitely progressed faster than I would have if I'd been multiboxing, since my friends play on pretty much my exact same schedule.

As for that thread, keep in mind that Kaideline is one of numerous people who has said that they will continue to beat the dead horse because she believes that if enough people complain enough times, Blizzard will remove multiboxing from the game just to quiet them. Any attempt she makes at showing that she is "coming around" to our side is likely to be fake. She tried as hard as she could to push the idea that if you consider it on a player basis and not a character basis, that it's hard for Blizzard to defend the practice, and would not accept Blizzard's point of view that it is the character that matters to them. She wanted to make it seem as if Blizzard was trying to hide from the truth by using characters instead of players. It's funny to watch her try and take the high ground by acting as if she's after calm and rational debate when she has threatened to quit over multiboxing in the past, and when she has proposed that people keep bombarding the forum with complaints in order to 'force' Blizzard to forbid multiboxing. It's like someone saying "Man! I'd shoot my mom in the face if it would stop multiboxers! Oh, um... I'd also feed hungry children if it stopped multiboxing! Yeah, feed the hungry! Right on!"

[Velassra]

[quote='Tonuss',index.php?page=Thread&postID=121030 #post121030]

As for that thread, keep in mind that Kaideline is one of numerous people who has said that they will continue to beat the dead horse because she believes that if enough people complain enough times, Blizzard will remove multiboxing from the game just to quiet them.

"[/i]

This is the particular point I'm concerned with because I believe it ultimately will prove to be true. Despite Blizzard specificaclly saying it's ok, even to the point of using a 3rd party program to do so and having access to the data of exactly how many of us are out there. I think ultimately they will cave. They have caved on almsot every single issue.
some examples:
Warlock nerfed into the ground
Fear nerfs
Multiple AV changes
Arena ratings to placate raiders
Racial nerfs
PvE to PvP

And these are just at the top of my head.

Blizzard has done it to itself really too. The prove time and time again, whine long enough and often enough it will get changed. Really, repeated forum Trolls need to get banned. From the times I was playing SoE games, they were never shy about banning forum accounts.

Edit: I don't see how my post got attributed to Tonuss ....it's outside the quote boundries, hmmm I fail at forum posting lawlz.

[Tonuss]

I disagree. Correlation does not equal causation. Blizzard has made many changes to the game. Some of those changes came after people complained for the change, some have come after people complained AGAINST the change. Some of those changes have come after people complained for more than a year, which means one of two things:

> if you complain for more than a year, Blizzard will give in. Or...
> Blizzard makes changes based on its own analysis of the game, not because they are influenced by complaints.

The thing about multiboxing is that Blizzard reps have gone out of their way to explain their support. Multiboxing isn't something that they feel is borderline and "are watching." It's something they feel is fine and they continually take the time to explain that they have no problem with it. Heck, their reasoning for not allowing PvE-to-PvP transfers was always a bit suspect (since they wouldn't allow it even if you'd leveled to 70 on a PvP server and transferred off). But notice how long it took for them to change their policy. People say it's because of the complaints, but that just doesn't wash. Looks like they saw a reason to open up the transfers on their own (population imbalances and the problems with high-end raiding guilds recruiting) and decided to allow it.

If Blizzard made changes based on the crying and whining on the forums, rogues would be underpowered and twinks would not exist.

[Basilikos]

I don't believe the complaints will cause anything by themselves. ToS / EULA changes don't occur based on whining; they occur based solely on Blizzard's understanding of a problem.

[Caspian]

This is entirely an e-peen problem. One "fat slob with pimples that lives in his mother's basement" being able to 1 shot me just isn't fair!!! Never mind it was 5 characters. Some people just refuse to acknowledge the difference between player and character. Nobody here has EVER one shot another character. We all have controlled our characters and maybe 3 or 4 or 5 shot someone but it was never ever a single shot that killed them. Unless people acknowledge this difference they will always disagree.

[Velassra]

Nobody here has EVER one shot another character.

I take it you've never played a solo cloth class in BGs before, pre-BC?

I remember that just prior to TBC and the release of new talents for 70's at 60. I was getting 1 shot on my priest in full T2. It was frustrating. Kinda remebmer raiding ended about that time too due to the tanks not being able to pull off enough threat to counter the dps.

[Caspian]

Nobody here has EVER one shot another character.

I take it you've never played a solo cloth class in BGs before, pre-BC?

I knew I could count on you . We are not pre BC any more. But yes I was one shot by a mage and one shot other people with my warrior pre BC. And actually just the other day I one shot some one on my rogue, but they were level 34 so .... you know what I meant.

[Tehtsuo]

I like seeing how often they ignore the Blizzard rep's posts completely. They choose to argue posts a few on top of the Blizzard reps, hoping they can put in enough filler that people won't pay attention to the Blizzard reps.

[thinus]

This response, IMO, is illustrative of "intransigent disagreement," as the poster quoted above stated previously in the thread. It basically shows you that no matter how "logical" the anti-MB arguments seem to be, when confronted with logical counter-arguments and the reason why Blizzard approves _from_ a Blizzard poster, they still fall back on being subjectively outraged by "being effectively one-shotted by a single player." Further, this anti-MB poster shoots herself in the foot by actually telling us that arguments based on "the mechanics of game balance" are antithetical to practical gameplay and really don't matter because that mean old multiboxer just one-shot me and there wasn't a thing I could do about it. Of course, if she'd have been steamrolled at the bridge in AV by a horde rush, that would have been OK because a multi-player zerg isn't as OP as a single-player zerg.

When was the last time you and your friend next to you got 1-shotted by 5 shaman in a BG that were being played by individuals, ie not multi-boxed?

The fact remains that 5 characters being played by 1 person has much better coordination than 5 individuals especially in places like AV where you are facing PuGs with no coordination most of the time. I think it is mostly a problem with shaman, other classes don't stack that well.

[ObesAU]

I actually find it funny.

In daoc multiboxing was a non issue. I am going to guess because as DPS either you used assist or you didn't run in a group. The assist train was king. Hell even in a PUG in DAOC everyone knew who the assist was.
Win the CC war, assist train people down, healers hide.


If people learnt how to effectively assist in and heal in WOW PvP Multiboxers would be speed bumps.

I seriously suggested in the WoW suggestion forum they make a new realm type, called either "No Multiboxing" or "Multiboxing" (with free transfers for affected Multiboxers). It is after all a play style like RP, PvE or PVP.
Tho seriously, I couldn't see a multiboxer ever being on a RP server... so maybe its already there.