arena/charity epics/changes

I signed up for a 5v5 team and have gone 2-38 on the matches over the last four weeks. The 2 wins were fully played but the other team didn't have a healer though. Then again, a win is a win damnit and they can’t take that away! ;) Anyways, I’m amazed on how quickly the points accumulate compared to the time/effort invested. NOW I fully understand the "charity" label they received.

Does anyone have a link that explains the upcoming changes that will be taking place regarding arena points? I've read snip-its here and there but most seemed to be opinionated or guesses. I'm just looking for a little insight to plan my purchases and such before these so called changes sneak up and bite me in the butt.

Thanks in advance!

doesnt the new changes require team rating and personal rating ?

Being an old school rank 14 and having a 2K+ 2v2 and 5v5, I think the "welfare" talk is crap.

15 t4-t5 players + 10 green/quest geared players go into SSC/Gruul/Mag and clear the whole place. How are those 10 players not in turn getting "welfare" epics?

Yes I agree that S4 will bring about appropriate rating requirements that should have been in place since S1, but getting to 2k requires skill, just as putting BT on farm requires skill.

You'll still be able to buy S3 stuff without a min rating when S4 starts (less the shoulder's/weapon) -- for cheaper even.

But honestly, if you're losing 90% of your 5v5 games the best you'll do is ~300 points per week. So, for example, the S3 helm costs 1875 points. It is going to take you, at minimum, 6 weeks to get. Is that welfare? 6 weeks. 1 item. (when S4 starts, you could pick it up in 5 weeks. So that's something to look forward to)

It's still an mmo. You don't really have to be that good to get anything. You just need time spent.

edit: I forgot all about the op's question... My plan is to have arena points for the S4 gloves (only thing without a rating req.) and use my saved honor points to buy up the S2 stuff. I'll add S3 stuff when I have points available (starting with the pieces that req. WSG tokens. I hate wsg). I'm still running around in full rep pvp blue gear because I don't want to start buying S1 stuff when S2 for honor is just around the corner.

Gear-wise, at least I'll be somewhat competitive at that point.

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Originally Posted by Canasou',index.php?page=Thread&postID=69447#post69 447][size=10][color=#57595a][font='Trebuchet MS

Does anyone have a link that explains the upcoming changes that will be taking place regarding arena points? I've read snip-its here and there but most seemed to be opinionated or guesses. I'm just looking for a little insight to plan my purchases and such before these so called changes sneak up and bite me in the butt.[/font][/color][/size]

Thanks in advance!

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www.mmo-champion.com

Great place for all updates.

As for purchases, I always go with those items that will be the biggest upgrade. In terms of season gear, that is always 1) Legs , 2)Head, 3)Chest.

Legs will always be the biggest upgrade (assuming you get the epic leg enchants)

Head is next if you have your gems and meta lined up

Finally Chest for the +resil enchant and gems.

Thanks for the info. Looks like the rule of thumb is that you can always defer to the purchase of the previous seasons gear if the butt gets bit.

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But honestly, if you're losing 90% of your 5v5 games the best you'll do is ~300 points per week. So, for example, the S3 helm costs 1875 points. It is going to take you, at minimum, 6 weeks to get. Is that welfare?

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IMO, yes it is. If you look at it in the sense of time spent to cost to effort, it is a charity. Now keep in mind I'm not one of these multi-boxers boasting about 30-45 minute heroic badge runs and getting 20 a night, I'm still trying to get through regular runs. I have 200g invested in the creation of the team and spend 45 minutes a week to get the 10 matches in. That's it! After only 4 weeks I was able to purchase the Vengeful Gladiator's Waraxe on my hunters. That beats the hell out of running Shadow Labs trying to get the Sonic Spear to drop for all of them. So instead of investing more time (SL is way more than 45 min for me) running for a specific drop such as this that may or may not drop, I am guaranteed that I get the Ax afer 4 weeks spending a combined 3 hours.

I remember running instance after instance after instance trying to get the dungeon set 3 pieces to round out sets on my other characters prior to being able to get comparable gear from factions just by hitting honored. Oh how times have changed in Azeroth... I mean, before I started multiboxing it was a real kick to get out of the regular instance run lfg grind and hit heroics. Most of these people then had experience in the instance by achieving revered for the key. Now every Tom, Dick, and Harry have keys at honored and think they can run them just because they have the key. Not enough gear and no experience, makes me shiver...

WOW, did I ever get sidetracked... But whew, that felt good to get off my chest lol



I guess it's an individual's perspective based on what value one places on time spent to cost to effort to be called a "charity".

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Originally Posted by 'Fursphere',index.php?page=Thread&postID=69456#pos t69456

Blizzard needs to change this so you must win at least 50% of the games you play to get any points. Welfair epics indeed.

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A lot of people have suggested this, but it is fundamentally flawed. For every win, someone must lose. This means that half the teams playing any given week will have less than a 50% win rate. Those who lose frequently will always find themselves at the bottom and never get any points, so they will stop playing. That will mean a new batch of players that were just above the bottom are now at the bottom and will never see points, so they will quit as well. This cycle will just continue until there's no one left playing.

The system as it is is designed so that when a team reaches its appropriate rating, they will maintain about a 50% win rate, so even 2k+ teams will have weeks below 50%. Should a 2k rated team that went 4/6 this week because they hit their rating plateau not get any points?

I should note that my 1306 rating may bias my opinion slightly. :D

Yeah the current system certainly has its flaws, especially for a new team of fresh 70s just trying to get off the ground. The carrot on a stick paradigm of ever improving gear will always leave behind those just starting out, so it's hard to come up with a simple solution.

The system works fine. "Charity", "Welfare" whatever...

You pvp often, you get points, you get gear.
You raid often, you get dkp, you get gear.

With my pve lock I'd out-dps 2-3 "Welfare" geared toons, so they wouldn't be very valuable for a Sunwell Progress Raid.
My pve geared lock gets smitten in pvp duel/arena style combat, so it wouldn't be very valuable for a 5v5 team for example.

I'm not saying this because I'm some kind of super player, or that I'm smarter than everybody else here, I'm saying this because I got experience from high level raiding and pvp. The time it takes to gear up from freshly dinged 70 to full pvp gear is pretty long, any longer and you'd never get to test any other classes unless you gave up everything but the game.

2-38 wtf you multi 5 hol ?(y pallies or something ?(

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Originally Posted by 'scottig',index.php?page=Thread&postID=70084#post7 0084

2-38 wtf you multi 5 hol ?(y pallies or something ?(

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Thats nice.............
You also have to understand that not everyone has the same skills right off the bat, or the time to farm a full S1 gear before they start with arena.
Another point is that not everyone has an easy battlegroup, i constantly meet S3 geared opponents in the arena even at 1500 rating.

so please : Think it, but FFS dont type it, its disrespectful.

i wasnt being mean

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Originally Posted by 'scottig',index.php?page=Thread&postID=70602#post7 0602

i wasnt being mean

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It still came across as downright rude.

The gear won't matter anyways once the expansion hits... hell, it doesn't matter now if you think about it.

2-38?!!?

OMG, that's a lot better than my 0-120 over the last 6 weeks!

(As I'm typing this I'm in my 14th AFK game in a row - so many 70s I need 2 5v5 teams now)

In less than an hour of web surfing I'll have gained 4043 arena points, as I do every week.

Welfare? Absolutely

Do it? I'd be an idiot not to. Plus all the goodwill of giving away approx 300 points in arena rating to teams that actually prepared, have 5 players, and give a crap.

I always picture the other team on teamspeak, "Dude, queue us up again - FAST! Maybe we'll get that group again! Hurry!" Does my heart good to be nice to folks. 8o

Sure, I'll try when my shammies get some decent gear, but with 40 resiliance and 600 spell damage it would be rather silly at this point.

I am 5-45. I run 3-5 games with one group (with my shamans) and the rest of the games (with my pre-multiboxing toons) on another group for a total of 10 games. I try to win the games, but I usually get blown up even at my low rating. I usually only lose 0 to 5 points per game. The 5 times I have won were all 20+ point wins. I understand why some people consider this welfare epics, but for people like me who suck at arenas, it takes us a long, long time to get a piece of gear. But, I can go get epics all day long from heroics very easily.