Want to start all over again, is it worth it?

Hey guys,
I REALLY would love to box again, my main goal is pvp and arena. I noticed that in 5.2 you can buy Malevolent weapons and armor with honor, which is amazing and really gives an opportunity to make a comeback PvP wise.
I would like to play enhancement shamans or any other melee team.
My question is: is it worth it to come back in 5.2 ( I want to reroll new toons and level them up before 5.2 comes out ) and which melee class should i pick? I prefer multiboxing 4 toons and letting some random healer healing me.
Thanks in advance,
Negativ1337

Only a couple of weeks until 5.2, have to hit the leveling pretty hard. What team composition were you thinking?

Only you can answer it it's worth it.

Either 4 enhancement shamans, 4 frost DK's or 4 arms warriors for 5's.

if you do RaF you can get a few teams up

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Originally Posted by Negativ1337

Either 4 enhancement shamans, 4 frost DK's or 4 arms warriors for 5's.

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4 Enhancment Shamans seems like would be hell to manage maelstrom weapon procs. I'd rule that one out personally.

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Originally Posted by Chivalrous

4 Enhancment Shamans seems like would be hell to manage maelstrom weapon procs. I'd rule that one out personally.

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Its very easy, actually. Check out some of the videos of enhancement shaman teams.

DKs are just so good for multiboxing. Enhancement has amazing burst. I'd lean towards enhancement but there is no clear winner.

If you're looking to do competitive arena (>2K) I don't think it's worth coming back. If you want a 50% win rate and a shot at the 1600 bracket and 20 minute queues, roll 4x enhancement shaman and find a very patient healer. They're kind of a gimmick in other PVP scenarios though - BGs and world pvp, where 3 minute instagib cooldowns don't win you anything.

It's funny how those hating on enhancement are the ones who haven't played them this expansion and the ones supporting their cause are the ones who have.

Every three minutes you can clear out and entire node. Whether it's a base in AB or EoTS or the flag carrier and the supporting healers, you can kill them all. Surprisingly 3 min is not that long of a time as how often do you need to kill massive amount of peeps?

With that said, enhance can do plenty of damage and kill plenty of peeps during the other 2:45. Elementals, wolves, and hard hitting instant elemental blast are enough to be a dominate force. For 15 seconds you are amazingly strong. For 2:45 you are very good. They really don't suck outside of ascendance, they're just god mode inside of ascendance.

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Originally Posted by Owltoid

It's funny how those hating on enhancement are the ones who haven't played them this expansion and the ones supporting their cause are the ones who have.

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I'm not hating on it, just giving my opinion on what I think is the reality of its viability outside of the ascendance highlight reels people are posting.

I have played enhancement. I have also played in BGs and wpvp with one boxer playing enhancement the other playing a different comp. That's is a lot of what shaped my opinions on it.

You could go Ele and get AOE silenced and cry over it :) Melee is the way too go now days on any class ima kno

The age of the Ranged Caster is over... Let the age of the melee striker begin!

I just dont get it! Wake up people!! Destro/demo locks! They are the most tanky caster out there, + have tons of self- and instant heals. You get port, aoe fear, tons of pets, and insane burst. Coupled up with a good holy paladin you can get 1800-2000 easy!

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Originally Posted by Nikita

I just dont get it! Wake up people!! Destro/demo locks! They are the most tanky caster out there, + have tons of self- and instant heals. You get port, aoe fear, tons of pets, and insane burst. Coupled up with a good holy paladin you can get 1800-2000 easy!

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Has anyone actually done it? Are there videos or any sort of proof anywhere?

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Originally Posted by Owltoid

Has anyone actually done it? Are there videos or any sort of proof anywhere?

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Attachment 858

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Originally Posted by MiRai

Attachment 858

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I love that game.

Nikita's locks are only 88, so unless he's aware of another boxer tearing it up in arena with locks, it's weakly in the theorycrafting land.

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Originally Posted by Owltoid

Has anyone actually done it? Are there videos or any sort of proof anywhere?

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You can check 5v5 arena ratings and filter by team comp, and check each battlegroup:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/pvp/arena/bloodlust/5v5

Warlocks: zero teams of any rating.
Shaman (elemental or enhance): A lot of them, none over 1400, majority of games are losses.
DKs: A lot, none over 1500. Most or all under 50% win rate.

You can check EU realms as well if you want. There are a couple outliers but, honestly if you are coming back to multiboxing with the goal of glory in the dead 5v5 bracket, that time is probably over.

Actually, in general:

Attachment 859

Actually there may be some substance to Warlocks.
I know in bg's, morphing and doing the AoE spam 1 lock was able to do some serious serious damage on my characters and it happened twice in the bg.
If I recall though they require a bit of ramp up time which in the arena world is difficult to obtain.

Writing this on my iphone, early in the morning. So grammar aint the best.

Most of the pvp oriented multiboxers in this community are theorycrafters! Ellay, the ramp up time aint much, really. Locks would survive the opening burst waves alot easier then ele shamans, and like you said, 8 x chaos wave + use trinket, grimoire of sacrifice (25 % more dmg). We are talking about hits well above 80k+, if not more. Chaos wave is instant, and on a 10 sec CD if Im not mistaken. Which means you can kill someone everytime your trinket is up!

Basicly, run out and put corruption up on all 5 targets, ranged aoe stun if needed, curse of the elements on all 5 ( 5% inc magic dmg taken), health stone, uneding resolve (40 % reduced dmg taken), and by the time that is done, you can start bursting.

Just like my hunters back in s9, I'll prove that locks work in 5v5, even better then shamans and DKs :)

My locks are level 83,5. They will be rdy before next season :) just need to cap JP and HP before the season starts

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Originally Posted by heyaz

I'm not hating on it, just giving my opinion on what I think is the reality of its viability outside of the ascendance highlight reels people are posting.

I have played enhancement. I have also played in BGs and wpvp with one boxer playing enhancement the other playing a different comp. That's is a lot of what shaped my opinions on it.

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Indeed.
Enhance have the best burst for multiboxers in game, the best utilities, poor heals (will be slightly better in 5.2) and very bad sustained damage. Even with ~490 u will not be able to compete >1800

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Originally Posted by Nikita

Just like my hunters back in s9, I'll prove that locks work in 5v5, even better then shamans and DKs :)

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The community has a lot of respect for old school pvp multiboxers like you, and when you make bold claims like this, people are going to take it seriously.

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Most of the pvp oriented multiboxers in this community are theorycrafters!

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Including you, unless I'm mistaken:

Your highest achievement bnet wide is High Five: 1750, and highest ever rating 1939 back in cataclysm when shaman were overpowered.I don't mean this as disrespect, but when you come in here with all theorycraft and lead people to believe you've taken <insert new comp here> to a respectable rating, it may very well motivate a lot of people to roll that comp and find themselves extremely disappointed when they get into 5v5s and see the reality of MoP PVP and 5v5s in general.

I just don't want people to waste their time chasing a dream, you have to manage expectations or you won't enjoy your multiboxing experience at all.

Im the biggest theorycrafter heyaz, and probably the most naive :P

I would never ever try boxing hunters, paladins or shamans in 5v5 if it wasnt for theorycrafting, thats what this community is all about. Helping each other with feedback, theorycrafting of comps, brag about achievements and so on.

We all are looking for decent comps to play in arena. And on paper, locks look like they can achieve 1800++ in 5v5 when multiboxed. They certainly have better survivability and burst then dks and ele shamans.

Im no PvP god, far from it. But I do enjoy a good challenge!

I got 1939 rating in 5v5 in season 10 boxing 4 ele shamans with a priest friend, ele shamans were far from OP, they were in the lower bracket of PvP speccs. Ele shamans have not been good since s7/s8.

Ofc this is all just theorycrafting, but I'll sure as hell give it a good try!

I'm always excited to see new comps. Please post videos when you can.

Im streaming as I write this!

http://no.twitch.tv/nikitax4

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Originally Posted by Nikita

Im streaming as I write this!

http://no.twitch.tv/nikitax4

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Please don't post random streaming links wherever, whenever... very few people are going to see them. We have a sticky dedicated to this so people can subscribe to that thread and get updates based on when people are streaming.

http://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/46342-Now-Streaming

You said run in and put corruption up on all 5 targets. Do warlocks have some type of aoe corruption? I see they can do this via seed of corruption but it is delayed. That's 5 globals just to get started.

I think Locks are a decent team.
More so for battlegrounds, than for arena; not saying you cannot do arena, but would be surprised (surprise me) if they got a high rating.

Warlocks can have an insane amount of hit points.
Basically, they're the only class that with equal gear is not going to be one-shot by 4x Enhance with Ascendance.
Not saying you won't take one out, in the Ascendance window... but they have the health, that someone could react and give them a BOP or whatever rather than one-shot them.

In Tier 2, you could mix Shadowfury (ranged AoE stun), Howl of Terror (AoE Fear) and Mortal Coil (Insta-cast Fear that heals the lock for 15%).
In Tier 4, Soul Link or Dark Bargain.
In Tier 5, Unbound Will, which is a one minute PvP Trinket... so you could go 2x DPS trinkets or if they don't share a re-use lockout, a one-minute trinket effect and the normal two-minute trinket.
In Tier 6, either increase your AoE radius by 500% or an enemy takes 25% of the damage you do for 8 seconds... could quickly kill someone if your team was subject to cleave/spell-cleave effects... I like a huge radius on Seed of Corruption AoE too.

You wouldn't necessarily want Demon Form (almost anyway) constantly, but with Demon Hunting (major glyph) you get a persistent Apophesis... which makes you that much harder to be killed.

I like all three specs.
Again, more so for battlegrounds than for arena.
Affliction is dots on the run, with a lot of decent self heals... could combine with a Priest or Druid healer.
Demo has the pets.
Destro has Chaos Bolt and the interaction with Havoc.

One of my teams will be 6-7x Warlocks, with 3-4x Resto Druids.. )

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Originally Posted by Ellay

You said run in and put corruption up on all 5 targets. Do warlocks have some type of aoe corruption? I see they can do this via seed of corruption but it is delayed. That's 5 globals just to get started.

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I had this same concern but I was hoping a new warlock-specific thread was going to get started. As a multiboxer, I think you have, at most, 3 GCDs to get a target down - it could be argued you only have 2 GCDs. Anything more and the other team will have time to react/adjust. Locks do seem to have very high survivability, but if you're counting on 5 of the opponents being in the open and waiting for you to DoT them up, then it's not going to happen.

Thanks for all the replies!

I started a new team, I now have 4 human warriors on level 80 :-)

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Originally Posted by Owltoid

I had this same concern but I was hoping a new warlock-specific thread was going to get started. As a multiboxer, I think you have, at most, 3 GCDs to get a target down - it could be argued you only have 2 GCDs. Anything more and the other team will have time to react/adjust. Locks do seem to have very high survivability, but if you're counting on 5 of the opponents being in the open and waiting for you to DoT them up, then it's not going to happen.

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I imagine that with some decent setting up five warlocks would be pretty brutal: 1-2 fel guards (Stick on healer #1 or mean melee), 1-2 succubi (CC melee), 1 fel hunter (stick on healer #2) .. chances are healer #2 will be a druid, there will be a rogue. So set it up and with the fel guard get the charge/AOE off to mess them up as soon as possible with 1-2 Demo locks dropping hand of guldan on the target while your aff lock dots one up and maybe a destro or two lines up a chaos bolt... pray you pop one and can shift to the healer and then roll the dice and see if it happens. I could see trying to go for an instant kill but I really just don't think it is possible beyond a certain CR. WOW players and WOW CC abilities have gotten too good especially if they are sticking it out in Arena due to haveing to cap weekly and what not.

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Originally Posted by smalltanker

I imagine that with some decent setting up five warlocks would be pretty brutal: 1-2 fel guards (Stick on healer #1 or mean melee), 1-2 succubi (CC melee), 1 fel hunter (stick on healer #2) .. chances are healer #2 will be a druid, there will be a rogue. So set it up and with the fel guard get the charge/AOE off to mess them up as soon as possible with 1-2 Demo locks dropping hand of guldan on the target while your aff lock dots one up and maybe a destro or two lines up a chaos bolt... pray you pop one and can shift to the healer and then roll the dice and see if it happens. I could see trying to go for an instant kill but I really just don't think it is possible beyond a certain CR. WOW players and WOW CC abilities have gotten too good especially if they are sticking it out in Arena due to haveing to cap weekly and what not.

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I think your post is a good example of pure theory crafting instead of what is actually feasible. If you could pull off the CCs listed above, you'd be the greatest multiboxer by far. Individual players may be able to do it, but I doubt any multiboxer would have the awareness and reaction speed to manage all those pets and CCs while staying alive and killing targets.

Just to continue to rain on your parade, I don't think 4-5 warriors will have success, either. Better to be warned now than to spend hundreds of hours on a team that likely isn't viable for PvP.

Don't get it why you guys keep trying so hard for arena. DKs are tearing it up nicely in BGs. Any other class is subpar.

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Originally Posted by Palee

Don't get it why you guys keep trying so hard for arena. DKs are tearing it up nicely in BGs. Any other class is subpar.

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BGs or RBGs? Big difference.

Arena is the purest test of your team and skills. BGs have been dominated by multiple team compositions, including DKs and enhancement shamans in MOP. We have yet to see success in RBGs from any team - care to offer proof otherwise?

Pretty sure he said BGs in both his post and in the quote.

I've rather push for 5s than attempt serious RBGs. I'm not planning on doing either.

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Originally Posted by heyaz

Pretty sure he said BGs in both his post and in the quote.

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Yeah - I'm well aware of what he typed and what I quoted. I was asking if he really meant BGs or if he was talking about RBGs, a much more appropriate comparison to arena. Peeps make typos or use the wrong acronym all the time.

Yes I mean BGs, not RBGs. Competitive PVP is nice to feel your blood pumping but after a while it gets really frustrating and stressful.
There are still challenges in BGs. Like going in AV or IoC where the bulk of their team is and try to survive as long as possible.

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Originally Posted by Palee

Yes I mean BGs, not RBGs. Competitive PVP is nice to feel your blood pumping but after a while it gets really frustrating and stressful.
There are still challenges in BGs. Like going in AV or IoC where the bulk of their team is and try to survive as long as possible.

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Personally, I think consistently winning 10-man BGs is a bigger accomplishment than fighting the massive amount of bots in AV/IoC. Some of the worst multiboxing PvPers find lots of success in AV and IoC - not a lot of 4-5 mans can consistently dominate the smaller BGs where you actually have some pressure. Being successful at arena trumps almost all, in my opinion. The crowning achievement would be a fully multiboxed RBG team with a decent rating, but we haven't seen that, yet.

Buuuut, if AV or IoC is your goal, pretty much any comp will work and you can have fun.

I don't see anyone being successful in a 10-man Rated BG.

A 5-man often has issues in the 10-man BGs.
Less so, but still has issues in many of the 15-man BGs.
Having 50% (or 33%) of the team... always in one place, is a serious detriment.

RBGs are always 10-man.
If you had a pair of 5-boxers, you'd still likely be at a disadvantage compared to a ten individuals.
Even if the 5-boxers were almost always able to achieve objectives where they were at.

If you're all ten players, in a 10-man rated BG...
You're only going to efficiently play in one place at a time.
You might guard your flag room, so they cannot take your flag... but there's zero chance of capturing their flag, while also protecting your own... and once both flags are in play, your flag carrier will get stacking vulnerability debuffs until they're one-shot.
A single flag return for the other team, will win the game likely every time.

Any game where you have to protect 3 of the five nodes (or even 2 of the three) isn't going to be that good for you.
You'll have to split your team, and concentrate on two separate objectives at once.
The other side is free to leave a solo player to guard a node (and call out INCs).
If you don't split your toons, three solo players will hold more nodes than your entire boxed team.
If you do split your toons, you'll have to be able to manage two separate battles simultaneously.

Basically, to be at all competitive in a Rated BG, you're going to need at least three players controlling the ten toons on your side.
You'd likely be better off with as many individuals as possible.
I could see two 3-boxers and four inviduals, or something similar... as having a chance at some wins.



Non-rated BGs are going to be much more doable.
The opposition isn't always going to have good gearing, and if you do... your 3/4/5, might be able to win some games, if the rest of your team is half competent.

EotS can be won, by rushing towards whatever they hold... and taking it.
If the rest of your team is willing to guard what you take, with at least a token force.

WSG can be won, if you intercept their flag carrier consistently.
And your team is capable of returning a single flag carrier.



Most boxers go for IoC/AV, because multiple compositions have a chance.
Not everyone wants to play the most optimal (or close to the top) team.
If you prefer 5x Feral or 5x Rogues... you have a chance to contribute to a win, in a 40-man.
You're probably guaranteeing your team loses any Rated BG and most 10/15-man non-Rated BGs.

It is a large scale BG, so you're only 12.5% of the team... which is a huge plus, as every other objective can (in theory) be held by the rest of your team.

Essentially, you can play what you enjoy.
You get the strengths of boxing... blowing things up, or making anyone near you immune to damage via your healing...
And can still win, at least 50% of the time (often, far higher... if you concentrate on an objective or two like recapping bunkers/towers).