My Plan - Come critique it.

Having spent the last month or so debating on a setup, researching, and planning stuff out I'm finally at the point where I have a rough draft that is ready for a second set of eyes.
I am planning on PvE Software boxing using Hotkeynet.
My healer will be click healing.

Class Selection:
Unholy DK: AOE tank with dps capes. Buffs groups damage

Resto Shaman: Everybody needs a little shaman lovin. Strong totems, Mana Tide, Chain heal, Cleanse Spirit, Can reincarnate. (will also be my main for solo raiding)

Demo Lock: Demo seemed to have a simple rotation. Curse of Elements for more damage, as well as extra damage from the pet crits. So a little synergy. Also comes with soulstones, and summons.

Frost Mage: I know that spamming just frostbolt is tough, but I should be able to manage that complicated rotation. The pet I will keep to CD use only, as well as Mirror Image. Focus magic buffs the warlock for more pew pew. Comes with the arcane taxi, as well as mage cookies. AI is always a nice addition too.

Boomkin: MotW, Moonkin aura, Battle Rez, Chicken Dance.

Basically I was going for strong group synergy with lots of damage increasing buffs/debuffs. (Ebon Plaguebringer, WoA, Warlock Spellpower Pet buff, Moonkin Aura)

Key Setup:
----------DK----------Sham----------Lock----------Mage----------Boom
1---IT,PS,BS,SS,SS---LB,,,,,,,---Pet+DE,SB-----Frost Bolt-----WR,SF,SF
S1--------UB,---------------------CoA,Corr-----Frost Bolt-------IS,MF
C1----Bone Shield----ES Tank-------------------Spell Steal---Throns Tank

2-----Obliterate------FS,LB---------SB----------FB,FrstBlt-------MF
S2-------------------------------Soul Steal

3----Chains of Ice---Earthbind----AoE Fear------Frost Nova
S3----Mind Freeze-------ES------Race Silence------CS,Race-----Warstomp

4-----SS,Pes,BB-----Nova Tot,,,,----SoC-------------AE----------SF,MF
S4-----DnD,UB----------------------,RoF------------Blizz-----Trees,Hurri

5-----EmpW,AotD----Elem Tot,BL----Metamorph------IV+Pet,MI-----SF,Trees

Z-------IBF--------NS+Heal ToTT-----------------------------Brez,Innervate
SZ--,Fear Trink---Trem Tot,Trink--,Fear Trink----,Fear Trink--,Fear Trink

X---------------------Totems
SX----------------Grounding Totem

C----Blood Tap-------Cleanse----------------------Decurse------De-poison
SC----------------Mana Tide(com)---Buffs(ooc)-----Buffs(ooc)-----Buffs(ooc)

1 is my spammer. Shaman casts a random LB here and there. Just a little extra dps, but not enough to hurt his mana.
Shift 1 is for after the initial DK sequence on long fights. (bosses)
Ctrl 1 is for pre combat, and things needed to keep on the tank. Also trys to steal a spell.
2 is my quick damage button. Not really to be spammed on elite fights, but for normal mobs it should hurt them.
3 is my snare button. Shift 3 for interrupts.
4 is my tab target AOE key. Shift 4 is my click cast AOE. (~ will be my send mouse click key)
5 is my ohh snap here comes the pew pew.
Z is my ohh shit (any other tfc players out there? "MEDIC!") When I have an alli targeted: if dead my druid rezes them, if alive he innervates them. In combat only of course.
X is my totem button, spam it to drop all 4. SX for a grounding totem.
C is my utility button. DK blood taps for more runes, and if something unwanted. It will disappear.
SC to drop mana tide in combat, or buff ooc.

Question Time:
My biggest unknown is the moonkin. Does his synergy stack? MotW is nice and all, but I can't watch for eclipse procs, so his personal DPS won't be as high as it can be. I'm hoping his group synergy will make up for his lack of DPS.

Is a DK's ghoul useful? I think I might be a bit on the low side for DPS due to the moonkin not being able to use eclipse procs properly. If I put one talent point into that would it help makeup for the lost dps? EJ and everyone I have talked to says its a waste of a point as a tank, but I havn't talked to any multiboxers.

FTL - Am I correct in assuming I would take up 15 keys for the above stated setup? I am a debate about how to handle targeting. I would like for it to be easy to play my second team of 5x boomkins (using the boomkin from this group + 4) for PvP shenanigans. I imagine if I setup FTL on both, and then just do a page swap on the boomkin in this group it would take no effort to make the change. The other system I was thinking about was a party1 system, because when I use PiP (F1-F5) I could easily promote whatever character i switched to, to the leader. Any suggestions?

What macros would you use to handle reapplications of dots? If I am using FTL I can't use something like reset=alt to start the macro over again. So how would I restart a sequence?

Please post your comments, let me know of things that I haven't thought of, or am flat out wrong on.

Please use the Multiboxing Group Composition Discusssion forum, but hopefully the admins will move it :)

Anyway earth and moon dont stack with curse of elements so my suggestion would be to drop the warlock and get a elemental shamanfor TOW.

Double set of totems never hurts, even less in fights were grounding totems absorbs spells!

I posted in general because it has to do with macros(control setups) as well as group comp.

Since CoE doesn't stack, I could put CoA on the target.
Does the pet damage buff stack? (I'm at work or I would look up the name of the talent)

drop the boomkin for a shadow priest. healing and synergy from the coe.

Just wanted to mention that there are some mods that will let you see party procs (in reference to watching eclipse procs). I use mik's combat scrolling text and you can configure the popups in order to show when a proc has occured for a party member (for me i watch when i get a 5 stack of maelstrom weapon on my shaman and i watch when my warrior gets an instant slam proc available).

Will let others comment on the groups.

Looks like a pretty solid composition, even more so when 3.1 hits and your Frost Mage will get Replenishment. ;) You mention it's primarily for PvE so my question is: Why no Paladin tank? Or do you reckon Unholy Blight and DnD will be enough help with the AoE groups?

On the CoE vs. Earth and Moon matter I'd say that Earth and Moon is superior in that way that it is applied through your main attacks and also gives you a passive 3% spell damage whereas CoE is detracting from the Warlocks damage in the sense that he can't use CoA.

As for dropping the Druid for a Shadow Priest, I personnaly wouldn't do it. The only thing a Shadow Priest really brings is Fortitude and Vampiric Embrace (and Divine Spirit in 3.1). But the Warlock would then have too use CoE. So I suppose it comes down to survivability vs. damage.

Wow RedBeard, that would be awesome. Now I wonder if there is a way I could keep track of the internal cooldown it has..
I guess I could modify that mod to start a timer whenever it notices eclipse proc through the combat log or whatever it uses to notice party procs. Then I could toss up a timer bar on my mains screen to watch when the ICD is about to finish.
That would really help boost the moonkin dps. (its worth over 500dps to use eclipse properly according to EJ)

Doing some more searching I stumbled upon this: http://raidcomp.mmo-champion.com/
Its a lovely little tool that lets you play around with buffs.

It really looks like Earth and Moon and CoE are both worthless as far as debuffs go due to Ebon Plaguebringer being so easily spread. I think I will keep the talent points in it though for the 3% self damage increase.
CoE is definatly out though.

As for why a DK over a paladin. I maintanked on a paladin soloboxing for quite some time, and started getting rather bored with it in the end. Its just too easy. A DK (from what I've read) does more damage, it also looks more fun. I will be leveling the group to 60 using a paladin, so if worse comes to worse, I'll just pop up him to 80. My wife also plays a paladin as her main, so if there is a heroic that I just can't figure out with a DK tank, I could let her tank it and just 4box.

I think the shadow priest would be too complicated for not enough payoff. The farthest I ever went with spriest was SSC, and it was pretty intense to play the class to its max. A lot of cooldown watching.
It does bring a nice health/spirit buff, but I would lose out on armor/stats from MotW. I wouldn't have to cast CoE due to Ebon Plaguebringer, so it wouldn't affect the lock. Replinishment will exist from the mage by the time I even create the characters.
I did take a good long look at the spriest based upon your comment, so thanks for that. However I don't think it fits as well as the boomkin, and it would mess up my 5man boomkin team :) (using RAF grants to pop 4xboomkins to lvl 60)

EDIT: The first post in now fixed.

So are they any gaping holes that I am missing that need to be filled in order to complete heroics?
The one thing I am missing is a magic dispel. Is that needed?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 'Clanked',index.php?page=Thread&postID=182042#post 182042

Wow RedBeard, that would be awesome. Now I wonder if there is a way I could keep track of the internal cooldown it has..
I guess I could modify that mod to start a timer whenever it notices eclipse proc through the combat log or whatever it uses to notice party procs. Then I could toss up a timer bar on my mains screen to watch when the ICD is about to finish.
That would really help boost the moonkin dps. (its worth over 500dps to use eclipse properly according to EJ)

Doing some more searching I stumbled upon this: http://raidcomp.mmo-champion.com/
Its a lovely little tool that lets you play around with buffs.

It really looks like Earth and Moon and CoE are both worthless as far as debuffs go due to Ebon Plaguebringer being so easily spread. I think I will keep the talent points in it though for the 3% self damage increase.
CoE is definatly out though.

As for why a DK over a paladin. I maintanked on a paladin soloboxing for quite some time, and started getting rather bored with it in the end. Its just too easy. A DK (from what I've read) does more damage, it also looks more fun. I will be leveling the group to 60 using a paladin, so if worse comes to worse, I'll just pop up him to 80. My wife also plays a paladin as her main, so if there is a heroic that I just can't figure out with a DK tank, I could let her tank it and just 4box.

I think the shadow priest would be too complicated for not enough payoff. The farthest I ever went with spriest was SSC, and it was pretty intense to play the class to its max. A lot of cooldown watching.
It does bring a nice health/spirit buff, but I would lose out on armor/stats from MotW. I wouldn't have to cast CoE due to Ebon Plaguebringer, so it wouldn't affect the lock. Replinishment will exist from the mage by the time I even create the characters.
I did take a good long look at the spriest based upon your comment, so thanks for that. However I don't think it fits as well as the boomkin, and it would mess up my 5man boomkin team :) (using RAF grants to pop 4xboomkins to lvl 60)

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Yeah, I totally missed Ebon Plaguebringer. :whistling: The ludicrous rotation of the Shadow Priest totally overshadows the buff they brings (imho). Much the same way is Affliction Warlocks, although less so with 3.1.

If you miss with IT or PS you're missing out on a lot of threat. You need a way to recast them when they miss.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 'Zaelar',index.php?page=Thread&postID=182272#post1 82272

If you miss with IT or PS you're missing out on a lot of threat. You need a way to recast them when they miss.

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Hmm. This is what I was looking for in posting this thread. I hadn't thought about misses.

If I used reset=alt in the DK macro, I could hit c to blood tap, then hit alt-1 and start the rotation over again. I would still have the second blood rune for the BS, and then I would just be stuck on SS like normal.

Does that sound like it would work?

First, you have too much overlapping buffs in your current setup.
Second, you need more than one shammy for fully utilizing totem buffs. For example, you will often need Stoneskin and Tremor totems, WoA and Nature resist, ToW and Frost resist, etc. So if you get resto and elem shaman with DK tank, you won't need warlock and boomkin. I highly recommend to get a priest, fort buff is the most important buff for multiboxing, and shadowpriest's aoe does not need to be mouse-targeted.
So for you I'd say the following option: DK, elem sham, resto sham, spriest, mage. You can sub mage for boomkin if you want to trade free water + AI + ports for battlerez + 3% spellhaste. It will also allow you to distribute gear a bit better.

For people who complain about rotations please see this thread:
Utilizing /click to run concurrent castsequences

As far as the group makeup goes I've been planning on revamping my group myself. Currently I run 1 Pal 3 ele sham 1 resto sham I've done every heroic so far (cept Occulus just haven't had time to go back and do it). This setup works and it is very easy almost to the point of retardation. I'm about 99% sure that I'm swapping my Paladin for a DK tank. That got me to thinking if I was going to restructure my pve group now would be the time. Keep the 4 shams together for pvp, but totally revamp the team.
DK Tank > Holy Priest > Boonkin > Ele Sham > Lock was an idea that I was tossing around, but I'm still not 100% sure what I'm going to do.

However, looking at your planning / setup you are going in the right direction. Honestly the group composition won't really matter aslong as you can manage different scenarios on the fly with success. You can either Run 1 Tank 4 hybrid dps to all cover heal your tank, or split up to the 1 tank 3 dps 1 healer approach. Something that no one has brought up is if you keep your druid; IF your tank goes down you got BR, if Tank is dead and BR isn't up you could always finish the mob off with a bear tank. Even though you're not feral it's better than your healer / clothies getting PWNED.

The combination that you've picked doesn't have the best synergy but you can work around it. Your group comp will definately have a lot of buffs and utility which will come in handy. If synergy is one of your concerns you could always go with DK , 2 mages, 1 lock, 1 priest. You have great synergy, lots of utility, still pretty good set of buffs. If you do continue with your choice in the post keep us posted. I am even debating a hunter in my setup dunno keep us posted.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Clanked',index.php?page=Thread&postID=182002#post1 82002]Having spent the last month or so debating on a setup, researching, and planning stuff out I'm finally at the point where I have a rough draft that is ready for a second set of eyes.
I am planning on PvE Software boxing using Hotkeynet.
My healer will be click healing.

[size=12][b]Class Selection:[/b][/size]
Unholy DK: AOE tank with dps capes. Buffs groups damage

Resto Shaman: Everybody needs a little shaman lovin. Strong totems, Mana Tide, Chain heal, Cleanse Spirit, Can reincarnate. (will also be my main for solo raiding)

Demo Lock: Demo seemed to have a simple rotation. Curse of Elements for more damage, as well as extra damage from the pet crits. So a little synergy. Also comes with soulstones, and summons.

Frost Mage: I know that spamming just frostbolt is tough, but I should be able to manage that complicated rotation. The pet I will keep to CD use only, as well as Mirror Image. Focus magic buffs the warlock for more pew pew. Comes with the arcane taxi, as well as mage cookies. AI is always a nice addition too.

Boomkin: MotW, Moonkin aura, Battle Rez, Chicken Dance.

Basically I was going for strong group synergy with lots of damage increasing buffs/debuffs. (Ebon Plaguebringer, WoA, Warlock Spellpower Pet buff, Moonkin Aura)

[b][size=12]Key Setup:[/size][/b]
[font='Courier New

----------DK----------Sham----------Lock----------Mage----------Boom
1---IT,PS,BS,SS,SS---LB,,,,,,,---Pet+DE,SB-----Frost Bolt-----WR,SF,SF
S1--------UB,---------------------CoA,Corr-----Frost Bolt-------IS,MF
C1----Bone Shield----ES Tank-------------------Spell Steal---Throns Tank[/font]

2-----Obliterate------FS,LB---------SB----------FB,FrstBlt-------MF
S2-------------------------------Soul Steal

3----Chains of Ice---Earthbind----AoE Fear------Frost Nova
S3----Mind Freeze-------ES------Race Silence------CS,Race-----Warstomp

4-----SS,Pes,BB-----Nova Tot,,,,----SoC-------------AE----------SF,MF
S4-----DnD,UB----------------------,RoF------------Blizz-----Trees,Hurri

5-----EmpW,AotD----Elem Tot,BL----Metamorph------IV+Pet,MI-----SF,Trees

Z-------IBF--------NS+Heal ToTT-----------------------------Brez,Innervate

X---------------------Totems
SX----------------Grounding Totem

C----Blood Tap-------Cleanse----------------------Decurse------De-poison
SC----------------Mana Tide(com)---Buffs(ooc)-----Buffs(ooc)-----Buffs(ooc)

1 is my spammer. Shaman casts a random LB here and there. Just a little extra dps, but not enough to hurt his mana.
Shift 1 is for after the initial DK sequence on long fights. (bosses)
Ctrl 1 is for pre combat, and things needed to keep on the tank. Also trys to steal a spell.
2 is my quick damage button. Not really to be spammed on elite fights, but for normal mobs it should hurt them.
3 is my snare button. Shift 3 for interrupts.
4 is my tab target AOE key. Shift 4 is my click cast AOE. (~ will be my send mouse click key)
5 is my ohh snap here comes the pew pew.
Z is my ohh shit (any other tfc players out there? "MEDIC!") When I have an alli targeted: if dead my druid rezes them, if alive he innervates them. In combat only of course.
X is my totem button, spam it to drop all 4. SX for a grounding totem.
C is my utility button. DK blood taps for more runes, and if something unwanted. It will disappear.
SC to drop mana tide in combat, or buff ooc.

Question Time:
My biggest unknown is the moonkin. Does his synergy stack? MotW is nice and all, but I can't watch for eclipse procs, so his personal DPS won't be as high as it can be. I'm hoping his group synergy will make up for his lack of DPS.

Is a DK's ghoul useful? I think I might be a bit on the low side for DPS due to the moonkin not being able to use eclipse procs properly. If I put one talent point into that would it help makeup for the lost dps? EJ and everyone I have talked to says its a waste of a point as a tank, but I havn't talked to any multiboxers.

FTL - Am I correct in assuming I would take up 15 keys for the above stated setup? I am a debate about how to handle targeting. I would like for it to be easy to play my second team of 5x boomkins (using the boomkin from this group + 4) for PvP shenanigans. I imagine if I setup FTL on both, and then just do a page swap on the boomkin in this group it would take no effort to make the change. The other system I was thinking about was a party1 system, because when I use PiP (F1-F5) I could easily promote whatever character i switched to, to the leader. Any suggestions?

What macros would you use to handle reapplications of dots? If I am using FTL I can't use something like reset=alt to start the macro over again. So how would I restart a sequence?

Please post your comments, let me know of things that I haven't thought of, or am flat out wrong on.

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My 2 cents worth here: This is a great group. The only thing I would change is the Resto shaman to a Discipline priest. The reasons are that you get a healer with good defense as well as another AE fearer to go along with the Demo Lock but the Discipline priest also gets the much needed buffs for Spirit and Stamina for all in the group. He also gets a few other nifty things in the Discipline line as well.

All of the other character classes are spot on with what I'd recommend for a multi-class boxing team.

Hmm. The priest fort buff would be lovely, but the spirit buff doesn't seem very useful to me. None of my casters would live outside of the 5sr where the spirit really helps (I haven't played since TBC, so if the regen model has changed please inform me). Yes the mage/boomkin have 30% regen, but once they get replinishment I doubt they will be running out of mana. I already have the spell power buff from the demo lock (iirc the imp spirit buff can become better depending on gear, but I can't look it up at work)

So the brings me down to the debate between Stam buff/AOE Shield vs Totems/Reincarnation.
I'll have to think on this one.

I'd probably change the Boomkin for a Shaman or Priest. I am not sure how well a mixed DPS group would heal as an equivalent to four elemental shaman so it is likely you will need a dedicated healer at some point, if that is what you were going for. So I think a Shaman or Priest would offer more if you already have a warlock

Also, by "trees" do you mean force of nature? That spell is a "ground based" targeted spell (i.e., you have to click the ground with the green target circle).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 'Clanked',index.php?page=Thread&postID=182682#post 182682

So the brings me down to the debate between Stam buff/AOE Shield vs Totems/Reincarnation.

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Bloodlust > all.

@heffner - Yes trees = Force of Nature, yes I am aware its a ground target spell. ~ will be my send mouse click key, and I don't expect it being very diffictult to use once I get used to it. The shaman I plan on using will be a dedicated healer.

@weeep - I knew there was something important I was forgetting that the one shaman brought to the table.

So I think that settles my internal debate about resto shaman vs disc priest. The fort buff/aoe utility isn't worth losing totems/bl imho. Worst case scenario is I level my already 70 spriest up to 80 and switch him with my rshaman since they will be on the same account. The resto shaman will become outgeared rather quickly since he will be my main for raids. So whatever bonus a disc priest has over a resto shaman for AOE healing would quickly be negated due to the shaman having much better gear from endgame 25mans.

Why are you even considering a warlock? Elem shaman brings higher dps and better group utility.

I haven't played Wotlk yet, but I assume Warlocks > Ele Shamans in dps. Warlocks being a dps only class and all.
ToW is about twice as good as Demonic Pact. (the gap lessens as my warlocks gear becomes better, but I don't really expect to hit over 2800 spell damage)
The "extra" bloodlust is negated by the debuff. I'm not expecting mana troubles, so mana/healing stream doesn't hold that much value.

So I would be losing personal dps, a potential OT (voidwalker), a potential HP buff (imp), summons, and the best aoe in the game.
And gaining 140 (or less) spell power for my group, a shorter CD on wipes (reinc vs SS), and resist totems.
Min-maxing. Yes, an ele shaman would probably net a higher DPS for the group, but I personally believe the warlock offers more utility than a second shaman due to the OT if needed. Summons are also a very nice thing to have.
I'm sure your opinion will remain different than mine, but you asked why I was "even considering" a warlock, and there is my reply.

On another note, I am thinking about using the FTL PvE Lock and Hold control system. Not exactly targetless, but I don't think the mobs can use who I am targeting to their advantage :) Every normal spell has /click <target and hold assister> Every counterspell key clicks one without /stopmacro in it (so that it always assists)

Target and Hold Assister
/stopmacro [exists, harm, nodead]
/assist [mod:lctrl,nomod:ralt,target=Toon1][mod:lctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon2][mod:rctrl,nomod:ralt,target=Toon3][mod:rctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon4][nomod:rctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon5]

Then I'll have F bound to /cleartarget on everything except my main so that I can change targets easily if needed.

I can't think of a good way to do CC though.
Maybe something along the lines of:

/assist [mod:lctrl,nomod:ralt,target=Toon1][mod:lctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon2][mod:rctrl,nomod:ralt,target=Toon3][mod:rctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon4][nomod:rctrl,mod:ralt,target=Toon5]
/clearfocus [modifier:shift][target=focus,dead][target=focus,noexists]
/focus [target=focus,noexists]
/cast [target=focus] Polymorph
/targetlasttarget

The problem I forsee with that is: pressing it while targeting <TGT> but wanting to sheep <FOCUS>. The macro would sheep <FOCUS> correctly but then it would /targetlasttarget, and <FOCUS> would become targeted by the mage. (or whatever it had targeted before <TGT>) At which point the next damage spell would hit the sheep.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 'Clanked',index.php?page=Thread&postID=182776#post 182776

I haven't played Wotlk yet, but I assume Warlocks > Ele Shamans in dps.
...
So I would be losing personal dps, a potential OT (voidwalker), a potential HP buff (imp), summons, and the best aoe in the game.

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It explains a lot :) Class balance changed greatly, it is hard to find warlock in a pug nowadays, because they are too gimped compared to other classes. Their "best" aoe is mediocre even compared to shadowpriest's, their DPS is mediocre too, and it drops even lower if you are unable to watch DOT timers and procs.