[How-to] 5x Paladins Disscusion

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Originally Posted by Ughmahedhurtz

Welp, the girls are 80. Normal instances are such a steamroll with this group. Exception is bosses like the elemental in Gundrak. That damned AoE poison crap just hurts. Now to finish up the other zones for money. :D

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Am I missing something...Can't you just have everyone cleanse themselves? I haven't been in Gundrak, so I don't know that boss. Is it a poison DOT or like a flamestrike AOE or what? I have 2 of my pallies with holy light glyph so they heal 20% to everyone. It isn't much, but if you are healing anyway. I just was wondering what type of things I should look out for. Also, I hope that my shammy (4 pallies and 1 shammy) will help with a poison/disease totem and/or nature resist.

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Originally Posted by ElectronDF

Am I missing something...Can't you just have everyone cleanse themselves? I haven't been in Gundrak, so I don't know that boss. Is it a poison DOT or like a flamestrike AOE or what? I have 2 of my pallies with holy light glyph so they heal 20% to everyone. It isn't much, but if you are healing anyway. I just was wondering what type of things I should look out for. Also, I hope that my shammy (4 pallies and 1 shammy) will help with a poison/disease totem and/or nature resist.

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http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=29573

That's the boss (or half of him). He drops these puddles of goo that do nature damage if you stand in them. And since he spams just about everyone in the group randomly with 'em every second, sometimes it's difficult to be able to stand there long enough to DPS with puddles all over. :P I've some ideas on movement once I stack the pallies a bit but it's just one of those resists that paladins don't have. :) The entire rest of the instance was a complete steamroll.

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Originally Posted by Ughmahedhurtz

http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=29573

That's the boss (or half of him). He drops these puddles of goo that do nature damage if you stand in them. And since he spams just about everyone in the group randomly with 'em every second, sometimes it's difficult to be able to stand there long enough to DPS with puddles all over. :P I've some ideas on movement once I stack the pallies a bit but it's just one of those resists that paladins don't have. :) The entire rest of the instance was a complete steamroll.

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My pallies are dual specced holy, for that boss i spread them out like i would a shaman group, then i Judge/Holy Shock/Exorcism the boss down. Yes it takes twice as long but its safe. Also useful for other bosses that have too much AoE and no enrage timer.

Just a thought.

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Originally Posted by Ughmahedhurtz

http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=29573

That's the boss (or half of him). He drops these puddles of goo that do nature damage if you stand in them. And since he spams just about everyone in the group randomly with 'em every second, sometimes it's difficult to be able to stand there long enough to DPS with puddles all over. :P I've some ideas on movement once I stack the pallies a bit but it's just one of those resists that paladins don't have. :) The entire rest of the instance was a complete steamroll.

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Ran this last night (non-heroic) with my 76 pallies with a mix of greens & blues. As you said it was a steamroll except for the elemental boss. My strat for this boss was pretty simple:
Phase one (stone guardian form) : tank and spank
Phase two (water ele form): dps down, tried (only somewhat successfully) to stay out of the pools - divine shield when alts health was at 30%, heal, continue to dps
Phase three (stone guardian form): back to tank and spank
Phase four (water ele form): blow trinkets, dps down - self cast lay on hands when alts health at 30%

Finished the fight on about 60% health.

Drops from the bosses were crap, but got several nice quest upgrades:
For Posterity - www.wowhead.com/?item=Ring of Foul Mojo / www.wowhead.com/?item=Solid Platinum Band
One of a Kind - www.wowhead.com/?item=Trollkickers
Gal'darah Must Pay - www.wowhead.com/?item=Clasp of the Fallen Demi-God

Cheers,
S.

I've posted a spammable ret dps macro here for those interested:

http://www.dual-boxing.com/showpost....1&postcount=80

Cheers,
S.

"Divine Sacrifice / Divine Guardian - I am not a fan of Divine Sacrifice for an all paladin team as I use Divine Storm as a group heal and having all that damage go to one toon defeats that purpose, I'll explain more on this when I write up my section on Heroics. Divine Guardian is however quite nice for the increased effects to Sacred Shield. More passive mititagation is always a good thing, especially when you're not running with a dedicated healer."


I have a question about the statement above. It sounds as tho you are using Divine Sacrifice with only one pally. What are the consequences of using it with every pally at the same time? Would it split any damage taken among every member of the group (that has the buff on) ??

Err not sure how that would turn out 150% of group damage is redirected to one player, so I would think that each player would take 150% of damage and therefore die.

P.S. Divine Sacrifice is supposed to be used in conjuction with Divine Shield as Raid rets use it all the time and 150% of raid damage would instantly kill the ret in most circumstances. So look at this way: You could save Divine Shield for all members to use it at once or you could rotate Divine Shield + Sacrifice on each ret such that the damage to a group is more even and manageable and hopefully your divine storm will overcome the amount of health that wasnt absorbed by divine sacrifice. Im sure someone could theory math it out but head math tells me that it will be better. 10Secs of everyone invulnerable OR 40 secs of group damage mitigation(everyone takes 40% less damage and one player is invulnerable). I think at 40% less damage the goo would be a LOT more manageable.

Cant be 50 secs because you cant DS the tank or the group gets killed. (obviously ;))

edit: also 150% isnt counted until the paladin starts taking damage, so its basically a 10 sec 40% less damage buff to the whole group with no drawbacks.

Ok. Thanks for the reply. I thought I was onto a way to split the damage among our all pally group. MAybe I"ll look into doing it with Hand of Sacrifice. next. I just want a way to make someone do enough damage to kill the whole group before anyone goes down.

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Originally Posted by Multibocks

Err not sure how that would turn out 150% of group damage is redirected to one player, so I would think that each player would take 150% of damage and therefore die.

P.S. Divine Sacrifice is supposed to be used in conjuction with Divine Shield as Raid rets use it all the time and 150% of raid damage would instantly kill the ret in most circumstances. So look at this way: You could save Divine Shield for all members to use it at once or you could rotate Divine Shield + Sacrifice on each ret such that the damage to a group is more even and manageable and hopefully your divine storm will overcome the amount of health that wasnt absorbed by divine sacrifice. Im sure someone could theory math it out but head math tells me that it will be better. 10Secs of everyone invulnerable OR 40 secs of group damage mitigation(everyone takes 40% less damage and one player is invulnerable). I think at 40% less damage the goo would be a LOT more manageable.

Cant be 50 secs because you cant DS the tank or the group gets killed. (obviously ;))

edit: also 150% isnt counted until the paladin starts taking damage, so its basically a 10 sec 40% less damage buff to the whole group with no drawbacks.

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I find for Pally 5 box groups, you use either situationally. Sacrifice & shield is good for encounters where there is sustained AOE damage (e.g. puddles from the Elemental boss in Gundrak), whereas 5 x Divine Shield works well against burst AOE (e.g. shadow axe from Ingvar in Utgarde Keep or exploding corpses from Trollgore in Drak'Tharon Keep).

Cheers,
S.

Ok so my paladins are 80 and lets just say i'm none too impressed. I run 1 prot and 4 ret, they are wearing mostly deadly gear (did close to 100 AV victories on each /wrists) and I can so far only kill Trollgore and the last guy in Draktheron. Granted they are only using De-Rage Waraxe for the main and I am actively searching for Titansteel Destroyers (no one makes these anymore), but the dps leaves a lot to be desired. Trollgore takes 1min20secs to kill which is 4 x slower than my shaman (who are obviously more geared). However the problem I am running into is mana.

Take the frost boss for example. I get him down to about 120k and my guys are OOM. Everyone. Including the prot because his only heals are from Divine Storm (which is really all he needs.) So I switched all slaves to the glyph that gives 8% mana back when you judge with Seal of Command active. (Used to use the glyph that gave 12 expertise when using Seal of Vindication.) Even using this they are still running oom. It's frustrating really. How do they expect this class to play if they are always oom?

I run the Niley's superlong macro for Ret PvE dpsing and I also use Divine Shield/Divine Sacrifice on round robin to reduce group damage. At this point I am considering shelving the paladin group and going back full time to 5xshaman for pvp slaughter. Oh and that's another thing. Holy crap can mages kite the everliving shit out of your group and thats with DS, Hand of Freedom, Cleanse. I F*cking hate mages. They make you look so stupid.

Anyways, I just wanted to say I wasnt expecting awesomesauce from the getgo, but considering most of my gear is ileve213 and three have i226 helms(PvE BoE), I just dont really see how it can get much better. Maybe using pvp gear aint all that and that's my problem. They need more mana regen as a group and I just dont see how it can get any better than the judgement talent + the glyph.

p.s. mad props to the guy who used 5 paladins to down H ToC. I see now how truly insane that is.

p.p.s. anyone notice that paladins are mad aggro? Halfway through fight Im having to taunt shit off them and this is with a 35k unbuffed health tank. I shouldnt have that much trouble. Yes I have the right ret talents, it's the same cookie cutter one everyone takes.