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plex warfare is very effective, on neutdragoons/talwars, it can be a somewhat annoying since fighting frigs usually means any dead ship will get insta podded. but if you plan accordingly you can have lots of fun for almost no expense. a respectable talwar fleet can go for around 20m, a perfect one for around 60m. and the difference between them is minimal.
if you want to pvp, stick to tanked dessies, frigs will die to easily. cruisers are only good when you have other pilots doing logistics for you. a fleet of mallers or Naugorors can decimate bigger fleets, and they don't require much micro.
and for lowsec ganking, with rubicon you can do it on Assault frigates, specially minnie ones, with warp rigs they are crazy fast. first get a suicide point bomber to hold your target then move in the frigs or just log them in for the kill. point bombers don't fit guns, only tank and point/web. (bombers have no targetting delay after decloaking).
with the new ghost sites, you will have targets. specially on the first months when the gold rush happens.
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[Talwar, Cheap Talwar Gang]
Pseudoelectron Containment Field I
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I
Alumel-Wired Sensor Augmentation, Targeting Range Script
[empty med slot]
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Upgraded 'Malkuth' Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Nova Light Missile
Small Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I
Small Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I
[empty rig slot]
is what ive personally used for talwar gangs, both for multiboxing and normal gangs ive FCed in factional warfare space, very effective once you get 6 or more of them since you can volley most t1 frigates, interceptors, EW frigs and the less tanky destroyers. They only take about 10 days for a completely new alt with no training to get into and fly with 1k volley and 50km range. Since i cant find the regroup command ( i swear there used to be one? ) i broadcast orbit 500m on the slowest alt and try and keep atleast 30km range on the enemies warp in. each talwar only costs 8-10m.
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regroup command is still there
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ah okay, guess ive just forgotten where it is.
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its right next to the leave fleet command, which 10 years after the game has been released still has no confirmation dialog, so if you miss click it you drop fleet...
its on the drop down menu at the top left corner of the fleet window.
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I have run incursions solo, with a vulture tank, 4 scimitars, and 5 or 6 sleipnirs. Great money -- 3 to 5 billion on a long day, and pretty intense because I wasn't using any tools to box with (ISBoxer, keyclone, etc.) [and to the OP, paying that 9 billion each month doesn't seem that onerous when you're able to pay that off in 3 good sessions -- or 8 "crappy" ones ;-) ]
Unfortunately, I moved and my internet cuts out "occasionally" now. One net hiccup would mean 3 ships lost, on average, for a loss of 1 to 3 billion, depending on what dies.
So, atm that has caused me to spend my game time else-game or in the belts mining. (Yes, some hate mining, but it is still self supporting -- just not the extreme cash gush that incursions is ;-) )
I'd love to suckle on the cash-flow teat of incursions again, and what that seems to mean is finding someone(s) who can fly 3x logistics to keep me and themselves alive when my net takes a short-break, until I can get back on. Or maybe some other mix of ships would work as well... in case I couldn't get back you could at least kill things off until you could escape.
I have my brother training logistics, but he is (so far, muahaha) only one account (and not fully trained.)
Because of my net I've been away from incursions for a while now, if I started doing them again I'd probably want to start with a few short sessions to get warmed up. (and I was doing particular sites that the sleipnirs did well in... not sure how they fair now, having lost effectively 1 turret of power since I last flew them)
I've got eve in "keep the skills training at least" mode right now. I'd have to both see your message and rearrange my schedule for this to work.
Edit: My apologies for posting on topic. I'll try harder next time. ;-)
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the topic did get a little off i guess :P
the CS rebalance ended up being very nice for most of the ships, im pretty sure the sleipnir didnt lose any dps since it would have gotten a bigger ship bonus to compensate as the other commandships did. I'd be able to bring 3 scimitars for incursions but at the moment im moving to a new house where the internet isnt set up yet so i wont be on a whole lot.
I'd say this is closely enough related to OPs topic to put it under here: whats peoples experience with alternatives like L5 missions? i had a chat with OP one day but would be nice to get someone with experience in multiboxing them to point out the pros/cons to those instead of incursions. What ive been able to gather is that you can do it with alot less characters and skillpoints without the competition and moving around. Of course theres the thing with it being based in lowsec but other then that, why wouldnt you do L5s rather then incursions?
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Well, Vanguards+ are where the ISK is it in incursions, and you really need 8-11 pilots to do them. So, for people who aren't running that many accounts L5 missions are probably a better choice.
Or, join a nulsec corp and just do anomalies :)
More on topic:
I've basically just spent the past three weeks playing around with my UI and ISBoxer setup while training. I've been doing a fair bit of 'safe' ratting in 0.5 space. I can say that my success so far with spider tanking is pretty promising for an Incursion fleet. I think it's probably safer than running dedicated logistics due to the scare of neuting.
Once I get everything set up 'perfectly' Mokoi and myself will be doing some videos showcasing setups, thoughts etc.
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multiboxing L5s is fun as far as a multiboxing experience goes, you will get jumped on, you will have plenty of fleets engaging you. the problem is you wont make isk, you will barely break even.
if you go with 3 or so ships, you will either need to pimp them or it will take too long to clear, and if you fly expensive stuff or too many ships, you WILL get jumped on. don't doubt it. you will show up on intel channels as soon as you complete a mission or two due to the NPC killed stat. (damn free intel...)
in the end due to their static nature, the only way to do LvL5s is to blitz them with an AF and take the missions with the alts. far from a multiboxing experience. anf if you WANT to box them, then you cant really fly anything more expensive than a BC.
if you want to avoid incursions, then wormholes are better for making money, or lowsec exploration which will be much more fun and will make just as much ISK. a C4 will be ideal for Wh. you can do them with t1 cruisers (at least 4) with logi support. lots of isk, lots of pew pew with the random pirates.
and about the Sleipnirs, with perfect gunnery you are looking at 24km with phased (with two T2 Ambit Extensions), that means that 50% of the time you will deal 75% of your DPS, and 50% of the time 50% or less. you are looking at 600dps with 4 gyros + DCUII in the lows (best fit due to heavy penalties on falloff) also that dps is shooting t1 ammo, because shooting faction or T2 will cost you a fortune.
compare that to the 634dps with the SAME tracking up to 32km optimal from absolutions, with about 30% more tank, slightly lower sig (sansha misiles are monstruous) and the 30% tracking increase from effortlessly swiching to multifrecuency for targets under 10km (lasers have instant ammo swich), not to mention the retarded damage increase. (779dps with my skills :o)
the only upside i see on sleipnirs is the "free" midslot you get, you can add a SeBo for faster lock time after jams. obviously, if you only have sleipnirs then they are by far the second best Command ship to use on incursions.
comparing current CS to battleships is kinda pointless... they take forever to warp and align and the lock times are dreadful, T1 bs are twice as expensive as CSs due to rigs and extra fitting, and to reach the same levels of tank they need to be pimped, so they end up being 4x as expensive. which makes the fleet way too vulnerable to Disconnects.
and if you want to upgrade them for pirate ships you are looking at 2 billon a ship. and without resorting to webs the only viable ones are the nightmares. which are still inferior to sleipnirs and absolutions in terms of damage... :/ (tracking and gun signature)
Btw after some practice i got to make 482 million an hour including LP. and that's with only 5 dps... i need to find something to do besides losing t1 cruisers with my main...
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