Dinged 80 yesterday, accounts closed today

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Originally Posted by Fursphere',index.php?page=Thread&postID=211411#pos t211411]

[quote='Maxion',index.php?page=Thread&postID=211404 #post211404]Isn't it 535 DEF for heroics though?[/quote]

In theory - yes, you should only need 535.

I have found that in practice, I get ROFLStomped with anything less than 540 Def. Yes, I know the math behind it doesn't justify it, but I tried some heroics with less than 540 and got punked. I switch a trinket and got back up to 540, and it was a cake walk. (I had a holy trinket equipped by accident I think)[/quote]Yes, the time old QQ about "I ONLY NEED 535 DEFENSE FOR HEROICS", Ok, so maybe it isn't really a QQ, but what some people many NOT realize, is not only does defense make you uncrittable, it ALSO adds to avoidance.

From: [url]http://www.wowwiki.com/Defense[/url][quote] Each point of +Defense skill adds 0.04% to the chance to be [url='http://www.wowwiki.com/Miss

Missed[/url], to Block, to Dodge and to Parry for players. This means +25 Defense will grant you an extra 1% Miss, Parry, Dodge, and Block. The formula is constant across all classes

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So 540 Defense is not a BAD thing at all. I see new tanks getting trashed hard. usually because they're defensive stats aren't up there yet because their gear is just getting them by, they don't have the high ilvl stuff with high avoidance. A fresh 80 may not even have 400 defense, check and make sure you do.

I agree with what other people said here. Spec a dedicated healer that doesn't do any dps.

I got my 4 shammies and protadin to 80 on a server without any other 80s. I started doing heroics with them the day I dinged, cleared 2. You NEED a healer (I leveled 3 ele 1 resto since 70, so I was used to it by then).

My method of healing is as follows: earth shield on same button as pally shield pull.
Have a button for riptide on the tank (this is a very powerful heal)
Have a button for lesser heal that target's each group member (mine were F1-F5) (make sure your tank one is easy to reach, you'll be spamming this)
Have a button for NS + Healing wave

I also had buttons for 4x chain heal on each shaman and 4x lesser healing wave (on shamans, not on tank) for heavy AoE fights.
I also had a round robin each shaman lesser healing wave on tank button, for those exceptionally strong bosses (HoL first boss in berserker stance with +30% damage debuff = awesome). You need this button less and less as your gear improves.

I pretty much never used healing wave or single target chain heal (although that's just because I never thought of a way to make them easy to use).

Also, don't give up and be prepared to wipe a lot :).

A dedicated healer will do a better job of keeping you up. My resto shaman is a bit geared but Earth shield + Riptide + some LHW is easily enough to keep up a newly geared (L80 blues) tank through heroics.

There are quite a few easy to get upgrades for your tank that would help you out.

Go to the auction house for these BoEs :
Burning Skull Pendant
Crusader's Square Pauldrons
Tattered Castle Drape
Waistguard of the Risen Knight

Run a normal Oculus for the quest reward Bracers of Reverence. Nice ring drops from the last boss too and there is a tasty trinket for your casters as well.

Work on Wyrmrest reputation for Breastplate of the Solemn Council. Then do Argent Crusade for the head enchant. Enchant your other items too - don't have to go all out on BiS enchants but at least get something on them. Work on your enchanting for +stam rings enchant as well.

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Originally Posted by 'Pocalypse',index.php?page=Thread&postID=211417#po st211417

I agree with what other people said here. Spec a dedicated healer that doesn't do any dps.

I got my 4 shammies and protadin to 80 on a server without any other 80s. I started doing heroics with them the day I dinged, cleared 2. You NEED a healer (I leveled 3 ele 1 resto since 70, so I was used to it by then).

My method of healing is as follows: earth shield on same button as pally shield pull.
Have a button for riptide on the tank (this is a very powerful heal)
Have a button for lesser heal that target's each group member (mine were F1-F5) (make sure your tank one is easy to reach, you'll be spamming this)
Have a button for NS + Healing wave

I also had buttons for 4x chain heal on each shaman and 4x lesser healing wave (on shamans, not on tank) for heavy AoE fights.
I also had a round robin each shaman lesser healing wave on tank button, for those exceptionally strong bosses (HoL first boss in berserker stance with +30% damage debuff = awesome). You need this button less and less as your gear improves.

I pretty much never used healing wave or single target chain heal (although that's just because I never thought of a way to make them easy to use).

Also, don't give up and be prepared to wipe a lot :).

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I 5 boxed all heroics the same way poca did healing wise with nearly the same setup. (hunter instead of a shaman)

3 elementals+ 1 resto is best with a bad geared tank.
4 ele shamans is alot easier then running with a healer IF your tank is well geared.

So my suggestion is to either do quests and buy lots of gear for your tank.. (i personally regret that i never did it this way)

Next patch paladin tanks got death prevention with 2 min cooldown wich is tbh fking insane.

"Ardent Defender has been redesigned - Damage that would take you below 35% health or taken while you are at 35% health is reduced by 10/20/30%. In addition, attacks which would otherwise kill you cause you to be healed up to 10/20/30% of your maximum health. This healing effect cannot occur more often than once every 2 min."

Once you're def capped for your desired bosses, you're MUCH better off increasing block value and avoidance due to diminishing returns.

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Originally Posted by 'Ughmahedhurtz',index.php?page=Thread&postID=21143 9#post211439

Once you're def capped for your desired bosses, you're MUCH better off increasing block value and avoidance due to diminishing returns.

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dont forget stamina.

Stamina scales better than anything imo. You can never have enough.

I geared my pally tank solo before starting to box, same with my primary ele shaman, but when i got my 3 new ele shamans to 80 I was able to clear gundrak and DTK fairly easily without using a dedicated healer. 4xLHW = 12-20k in 1.5seconds which as far as I'm aware, is better than the raw output of any single healer. In saying that, there's only a couple of times i really have to keep 4xLHW'ing my tank during trash, usually on the eck trash because of the poisons that they apply. Otherwise he only needs one, or none, 4xLHW hits per pack. There is also the other side to the argument, having 4xLHW's being cast means that if one of your guys is dead, you still get healed, whereas if your healer dies accidentally, you get no more healing unless you switch to using a macro which makes the remaining shammies start healing as well..

I have not yet seen an enounter that 4xLHW healing will not cope with, but I havent boxed all the heroics either (Just GD,DTK,COT,VH exept cyanigosa).

540 def cap should be the only priority when gearing, then move to stam/avoidance. No point having 25k hp if you're crittable, you'll get pwned.

Gear reference: Pwnstarr on WowArmory

this here is my pali
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...onemaul&n=Gond
he isnt geared to the teeth basically has 542 def 21k health.this is after running Utgarde Keep,Drak'Tharon Keep, and Drak'Tharon Keep a few times.

535 is a def minimum there is no cap. Once yeh got enough hitpoints to survive what every bosses magic damage, yer going after, stacking defs is still about the best stat yeh can stack.

what I did was try getting into all of the instance in order of level what I found is if yeh end up skipping allot of instances yeh will be missing allot of gear

Your guys have allot of gear that is level 74. yeh been concentrating to much on you tank

having a dedicated healer helps allot due to the fact there considerable more efficient then having a dps cast heal spells.

One of the thing yer running into is that yer dps cant burn down the critters fast enough

I made some minor upgrades to my chars (dk + 4 ele shamans) and now running the easy heroics (UK, Gundrak, azjol-nerub) results in very few deaths. It was more of a matter of getting the fights down than a gear issue, although my dk has gone from 25k to 29k recently and the extra buffer seems to help quite a bit, shamans started around 13k hp with 1100 +dmg unbuffed, now around 16k hp with 1600 +dmg unbuffed just from heroic drops + welfare arena gear.

I started strictly with quested gear on the shamans and boe gear on the DK. It was pretty frustrating at the start, but the upgrades do come very quickly.

http://www.youtube.com/stoatie has some videos from when I first started out including a failed attempt on the collosus in gundrak. Fire eles really make that fight. Things go much smoother now. If I think about it I'll record the runs tomorrow to compare.

You definately need 535 def that's number one goal. However, point wise even after that defense is still a very good stat to stack way past the 535. My team isn't up to heroics yet but even when I'm solo with a group I still need heals. Resto is really only option in heroic's. If I'm in a single box group and a non healer spec tries to keep me up they would constantly be spamming heals and wouldnt be able to dps anyway. So no reason not to go with a resto on your team.

Here's my paladin's armory. I don't raid much but I think I have decent gear. I definately still need a dedicated healer in heroic groups though.