It's happening on Mag as well...it's reportable btw. Offenders will most likely have thier gear stripped, so get those reports in!
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It's happening on Mag as well...it's reportable btw. Offenders will most likely have thier gear stripped, so get those reports in!
Simply by the definition of an exploit, it's not an exploit. Why? Well, Blizzard wants to prevent people from getting an unfair advantage. The fact that everyone can do it means there is no unfair advantage. If you currently own WG and you lose because a bunch of demolishers squeezed thru the doorways...come back in 2.5 hours and do it to them. I'm not saying that it doesn't ruin the WG experience. I'm sure they'll prevent this from happening in the future.
To be an exploit, there needs to fundamental flaw in the design. This is a mistake made by the clipping/collision/size parametrics of the demolisher object. Ever notice how close you need to be to melee a demolisher? You can't hit it if you're standing at the wheels, but you can hit a catapult from a distance. Fixing these parameters will probably break something else (most likely in Strands of the Ancients).
This is an exploit:
Warlocks using their teleport circle to port themselves back up to the top of the Dalaran Arena. Why? Only Warlocks can do this and it prevents melee classes from attacking them. This gives them an unfair advantage.
Farleito - sorry but I would respectfully disagree with this:
Even though both sides are able to do it equally does not mean that each side is not exploiting a flaw in game design/implementation.Quote:
Simply by the definition of an exploit, it's not an exploit. Why? Well, Blizzard wants to prevent people from getting an unfair advantage. The fact that everyone can do it means there is no unfair advantage.
Then you would agree that there is no unfair advantage. Like I said, I'm not arguing that it doesn't ruin the BG.Quote:
Even though both sides are able to do it equally does not mean that each side is not exploiting a flaw in game design/implementation.
Are they going to do anything about shaman knockbacks in EoTS? Is it considered an exploit to use Thunderstorm in EoTS to knock people off of a cliff? If you answer no, then how come you don't get a kill point and why do you take durability loss when you die this way? If you answer yes, then why haven't they fixed it? By your standards, it's taking advantage of a flaw in the game design/implementation. If they purposely wanted you to do this, then you should get a kill point and the opponent should not take a durability loss. It's not too far off from this WG issue. It sucks when it happens to your team, but your team can just as easily do it to them. The simple fix would be to increase the object size of the demolisher so it can not pass thru the door, and to put up some false walls around the sides of the flag in EoTS at the right height, so if you run off it doesn't save you. Will they do this? No, because they don't consider them as exploits.
It's an exploit. The error in your logic is your definition of an exploit. "Using an UNINTENDED game mechanic." Thunderstorm knocking people off a cliff is an intended mechanic, just as mind controlling someone off a cliff is a valid strategy. Driving a vehicle through a crack in a wall that it cannot possibly fit? An exploit.Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Farleito',index.php?page=Thread&postID=183686#pos t183686
Regardless, GMs confirmed it's not intended. Just because both teams can do it and that makes it ok: inane at best.
[align=left][/align]It's a doorway, not a crack and apparently, yes, it can fit...cause if it couldn't fit, it wouldn't go thru. The argument is that they should not fit, not if it's an exploit.Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Alemi',index.php?page=Thread&postID=183693#post18 3693
Does it make sense to leave it this way? No. Are people getting banned for doing this? No. This has been an issue for some time now and it was not addressed in the recent patches. If it was truely an exploit, they would have hot-fixed it like they did w/ the endless mob "exploit" that I had posted a few months ago.
Calling it an exploit is a matter of opinion. In the end, our opinions don't really matter. Like it or hate it, Blizzard will do what they think is fair. If you want to call it an exploit, then so should the following, but they're not:
Tanks unbleedable, lowering the dps of certain classes, but diseases and curses are supposedly ok? All disease/curse classess are exploiting this.
The ability to parachute into the fortress, completely negating the walls, even without the gnomish planes. *Made even worse by having an extra second allowed on flying before dismounting in a later patch* People do this all day long and nobody complains.
Occasionally misplaced siege engine shots damage your own workshops/walls/towers -or- Vehicles left alone for too long, despawn but don't release the vehicles resource. (I could make an opposite faction toon and do these things on purpose to help my other toons win)
Widely fluctuating values of Tenacity during the first 5 minutes of the BG because of the huge amount of arrivals. I can go on a killing spree w/ this temporary tenacity buff and 1-shot everybody.
Design of the fortress, The GY spilling out onto the right hand area of the fortress, this makes assaulting that right hand side HARDER then the left. As the Alliance favor attacking the right and the horde the left, this gives the Horde an advantage when attacking albiet a small one. Horde players are exploiting this.
It sounds like you need to read this link:Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Farleito',index.php?page=Thread&postID=183705#pos t183705
http://us.blizzard.com/support/artic...rticleId=20224
Specifically this part:
Bug Exploitation
We have a top notch Quality Assurance team who tirelessly stamp out bugs and design inconsistencies within World of Warcraft. However, a handful of trained professionals can never isolate and resolve each and every bug in such a deep and complex game accessed simultaneously by thousands of players. You may come across the occasional bug during your adventures. Some bugs are minor and do not affect gameplay, but sometimes these bugs can be used to provide an unfair advantage to certain players or affect the service itself. Factors included in determining the appropriate penalty:
- Whether or not the exploit is performed intentionally, maliciously, and/or repeatedly
- Whether or not the exploit damages another character, their gameplay, the service itself and/or its economy
- Whether or not an attempt has been made to conceal the exploit's use
If a player is found to have abused/distributed an exploit, he/she may:
- Be given a verbal warning if exploitation is unintentional and no attempt has been made to hide its occurrence
- Be temporarily suspended from the game
- In extreme cases the account will be closed outright
Bug exploitation that we consider extreme includes, but is not limited to:
- Any exploit that has a severe negative impact on a realm's economy
- Causing disruption in service or intentionally crashing a realm/server
While these repercussions may seem harsh, we feel very strongly that this type of abuse has no place within Azeroth due to its negative effect on other players or the service itself.
The design intent of WG is obvious - the walls are supposed to be destroyed before players can proceed to the next area. Driving a vehicle through an undamaged section of a wall circumvents the design of WG, and is by the definition above, a bug exploit as it cleary gives an unintended advantage to the attacking team.
Don't make the mistake of thinking just becuase Blizzard isnt hotfixing it, that people who continue to use the epxloit won't be punished in the end. Blizzard let win trading in the arena continue for months before stripping gear and banning accounts.
Cheers,
S.
Perhaps you should have posted the rest of that site...
Specifically the part about abusing game mechanics:
Abuse of Game Mechanics
The distinction between exploiting bugs and abusing game mechanics is a fine one. While bug exploitation involves the abuse of what is essentially a programming mistake, the abuse of game mechanics is the act of taking advantage of the limitations of the World of Warcraft game systems. Since the line between the sanctioned use and the abuse of game mechanics is sometimes unclear, we prefer to educate players before taking any action against the account being used.
They are NOT the same thing. The WG issue does not involve a programming mistake. This would be considered abusing the game mechanics, not an exploit.
This is getting ridiculous. I'll leave you with this.Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Farleito',index.php?page=Thread&postID=183757#pos t183757
It's a crack in the wall that is CLEARLY meant for a mounted player to get through. No matter what physics you describe, no item on that size can fit through that "doorway" as you call it. The doors are made of stone, not rubber - period. You can rationalize it to yourself however you want; tanks are bleedable - physics doesn't work! Common sense should tell you that even in a video game a square peg cannot fit in a round hole.
It's a programming error that a vehicle can turn sideways and have its z axis negated to fit through the doorway. Which is exactly what's happening. Seige vehicles had their z axis removed because they were getting hung up on certain objects. Using terrain tactics to manuever a vehicle so that it's y-axis is 0 (i.e. a 90 degree switch) isn't exactly an "intended" bug. You want to play word games, but it is a bug exploit of the programming mistake. Regardless, this conversation is going no where as our versions of reality and semantics seem based in different places. I see no further value in continuing a conversation on this topic.
It'll be fixed soon enough. Just as getting on top of the horde roof in WSG was fixed using "creative" terrain tactics - which was also considered an "exploit" by Blizzard.
..and big mounts can't fit thru most doorways...cause this totally makes sense. You expect a videogame's physics to be entirely accurate with the physics outside of the game? You must be living in a World of Warcraft.Quote:
It's a crack in the wall that is CLEARLY meant for a mounted player to get through. No matter what physics you describe, no item on that size can fit through that "doorway" as you call it.
Really? Sorry, I must have missed that class in college. Perhaps you can enlighten me on how they get all of those sensible magic spells to work. Start w/ my favorite, Slow Fall. You seem to have this notion that all of the x,y,z parameters for every object in the game are hard-coded and can only change w/ a recompile. Maybe you can explain how the software recompiles itself to shrink my toon (and my mount) when I drink a noggenfogger elixir.Quote:
Common sense should tell you that even in a video game...
I'll agree that what you point out here would be a programming error but I don't think we're talking about the same thing. I can set my vehicle to "auto-run" foward, right thru the doorway. I don't have to turn in any fashion to fit. Just go forward. Maybe the z-axis was removed from the demolishers...I still think the argument is that it's too wide to fit, not to tall. The size of the demolisher was obvisouly set to its current dimensions because something else was broken (in SotA). They did not need to fix any lines of code to do this. It's a limitation. You can fit thru places that they intended you to fit thru, and as a side effect, you can fit thru places they wouldn't want you to go thru. You can't have both until they fix the game mechanics. Until they fix the game mechanics, people will abuse the game mechanics.Quote:
It's a programming error that a vehicle can turn sideways and have its z axis negated to fit through the doorway. Which is exactly what's happening.
Cut the oil lines. Let it bleed out, like how you bleed the brakes on your car. Good thing you can curse and disease these things though, cause the physics work there.Quote:
tanks are bleedable - physics doesn't work!
What am I trying to prove here? That just because something does not work in your favor all the time, it does not mean it's an exploit. Like I said in all of my replies in this thread. I am not saying that it does not ruin the fun and the experience. I discovered this by trying to auto-run forward into a wall so I can spam attacks on it. When I made it up to the wall, I happened to pass thru it. Did I do anything special? No. Who in their right mind is going to say "gee.. that doesn't make any sense. I should put this bad boy in reverse and get back on that other side." Nonsense! Go knock down the next wall. It's no different than discovering, after a patch, that your lightning bolt randomly does 4000% more damage. Are you going to stop using it? Are you exploiting anything here? Clearly it is unintentional, but you can't go and call it an exploit. You don't have to do anything special to make it happen. It just happens.
Just trying to call it what it is.