Thinking of 25 boxing WoW - Not sure about a lot of things

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Originally Posted by 'Sam DeathWalker',index.php?page=Thread&postID=93016#po st93016

Given the chain heal seeks out the lowest HP person in teh group it seems perfect. By getting restro shaman I should be able to heal "good enough". I can still get one priest for rez and one tank. Taht will give me 18 mages. So I can do 4 groups that are 1 sham and 4 mage and the main group of tank priest sham and 2 mage. Main group can lead and tank will target for everyone, and tank can hopefully draw fire in pvp and agro in pve. And I can still go undead on the mages/priest/warrior and something else on the sham.

Keep in mind that the 25 will never be in a raid during exp times. If I can find a fast spawner or spawn area, Ill have 1 group of 5 getting the exp with everyone else ungrouped. Its just a matter of finding a fast spawn or spawning area (i.e. where they spawn instantly if killed instantly .... )

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I think Chain Heal also will heal outside a party if everyone in your own party is fully healed. So this would make healing a lot easyer for you since it would semi-automate healing targeting (allthough the jumps give lower heals)

So I think a group of 5 resto shamans would be a wery good choice of healing for your project. Another good thing about a 5man resto shammy group is that it will never run oom with 5x mana tide totems

Ahh well dump the priest then, I was thinking shaman only get self rez. Great, if I wipe I get 5 self rez and then they rez the rest ... big time saver. I can't put the 5 shammy in same group during pvp cause I need the tremor totoms for each group right? So 4 groups of one restro shammy and 4 mage, and 1 group of resto shaman, warrior and 2-3 mage (maybe 2 shaman in this group for even more healing of the tank).

If you are in raid it will jump to raid targets as a priority, I suppose during pvp I would be in a raid.

Sam, if you do this I only ask one thing. Do it on Mag so if/when I come back to WoW, I can see this in action.

I need a server where hord is underdog. Where I will have many oppenents to attack. Where there will be at least some chanch of world pvp.

Ner'zhul seems the most logical choice.

Don't worry, Ill have blue ray 1440 avchd videos of all 6 monitors (not the low resolution ingame stuff everyone else has) taking movies from behind me when I do something of value. Not only will you see the game in action you will also see how i do it in action.

SamDeathWalker.com will be happening at some point.


Why are these people complaining about mages so much:

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I played a mage in World of Warcraft since its release. After seeing the alpha talents for mages in WotLK and seeing the damage out put of my mage versus warlocks in inferior gear in Black Temple, I opted to reroll. I have since leveled a warlock and warrior to 70; primarily due to the leaked WotLK alpha talents. If my mage is ever to be touched again, Blizzard has some serious overhaul work to be doing. I have to say it's pathetic that already a warlock in tier 5 can out DPS a mage in tier 6... if WotLK talents stand as they are now... mages are to be a thing of the past. My form class has been ignored so long and faced so much degradation, that I've finally chosen to just reroll and become a warlock and or warrior since Chaos Bolt and Titan Grip are so superior to "annoying sparkler" or any of the other pathetic mage treats. I highly recommend rerolling my mage brothers, because frankly, we've been ignored since day 1. :)

Edit: I won't even begin to complain out how my paladin was ignored.
Also so you know I'm not a whiner if you didn't read the above: Loving my warlock and warrior :D

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http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=3


I don't see any warlock spell even close to arcane barage

Arcane Barrage Rank 3
610 Mana 30 yd range
Instant cast 3 sec cooldown

Launches several missiles at the enemy target, causing 936 to 1144 Arcane damage.

Instant cast, you can cast while moving lol can't be interupted, 30 range, 3 sec recast what more can anyone ask for?

its your setup, of course, but i really think you will miss the instant burst healing that multiple priests bring to the table. that 2.5 second chain heal cast time when any of your clothies is being focus fired will kill you. plus, chain heal is not a guaranteed hit on low HP targets. it "attempts" to seek out the lowest friendly target within range with its procs.. but its not guaranteed to hit. also, its procs heal for less than the initial burst per-jump. CircleOfHealing/PrayerOfMending/AoE Fear/and buffs will double the durability of your mages. prayer of mending works even better than chain heal by jumping from target to target, healing anything that takes damage. between that, 5x stacked HoT's from renew, multiple earth shields from the shamans and stacked HealingStream totem (once its raid-wide) your entire raid would be receiving massive amounts of passive healing, even without chainheal/circle of healing.

prayer of mending - 25 x 800
earth shield - 30 x 270
healing stream - 5 x 3240 over 2 minutes, stackable.
renew - 5 x 1404 over 15 seconds, stackable.

that is ALL passive healing.. absolutely discounting direct/group/aoe heals. and those are just the base numbers. all those values are increased dramatically based on your healers +healing from gear, wrath of air totems and crits.

theres really not a lot that 20 mages will do that 15 wont. as people have said, those last 5 mages will always overcast the target and just be wasting a group slot. 15 nukes = death. to anyone. add in crits, stun procs and aoe spam and DPS will not be a problem. you would be much better off investing those extra 5 slots on characters that will keep your mages alive and doing damage longer.

i think, without the priest/shaman healer combo to keep your mages up, you will be forced to resort to suicide bombing graveyards, taking out as many as you can before you get wiped. shamans by themselves will not have effective enough AoE healing to keep your mages alive Vs even close to even numbers. the 1priest/1shaman combo will actually make your DPS very difficult to take down. i do exactly this, only without the benefit of shamans. with 3 mages 2 priests per group, i could not live without the amazing burst heal of 4x circle of healing (which is why im pushing it so hard =P). people usually think of circle of healing as a situational heal. nobody seems to realise how amazing it is when youre focus firing instant aoe heals from a full group of priests. if any of your mages are about to die, target that group, hit CoH, that by itself will be 50% of his hp bar, guaranteed, for next to no mana.. followed up by the 5x chain heals that will hit 3 seconds or so later. i think you will come to love that staggered heal effect that comes from the combination of those two heals. shamans by themselves just dont have the instant burst heal capability. if they happen to be moving while you get spiked, or one of your characters takes a few big hits.. that 2.5+ second delay (assuming the shamans arent being hit, and their casting interrupted) gives your mages plenty of time to die before they receive a heal.

i, personally, would even be inclined to say 2 mages 3 priests per group, rather than shamans, but i think the setup i mentioned, with your healers in a stack, will be much stronger with raid wide tremor totems, come WoTLK, to negate fear. just make sure you make all your priests/mages female undead, your shamans male orcs. with their shield and larger body size, when you stop your healers /following, they will be in a perfect stack behind your main, your priests will be completely hidden (and untargetable via clicking) by the shamans. choosing all 25 characters with a simlarly themed name and switching between your mages as your "main" toon (to confuse people, so they will never know which mage is driving) will also somewhat prevent people from using /target and focus firing on you.

also, if youre planning on leveling via grinding world mobs.. you really dont need a tank. shamans have mail/shield, heal with the priest and ArcaneExplosion spam with the mages will clear spawns very well without needing to waste a group slot on any kind of actual "tank". the only reason id bother rolling a tank in this setup is if you plan on trying any kind of raid or 5man PvE content. and, personally, if youre so inclined, id roll your main groups first and then powerlevel a tank to use one one of the mage accounts later on.

as for arcane barrage.. cycle it with your other instants. ice lance, fireblast and arcane explosion are all instant cast and can be cast while moving. 15 fireblasts will generally kill the target. 15 arcane explosions will just about do the same.. ice lance is a little weaker than the other instants, unless you frost nova first, so you might have to hit it a couple of times, but if youre doing say.. a conservative estimate of 4.5 to 5k damage every 1.5 seconds it wont take long to drop targets, even if theyre being healed. cycling those icelance/arcane barrage/fireblast and arcane explosion/fire nova if you run into a stack.. your mages can do all their DPS without even needing to stand still to cast anything.. and without being interrupted by damage, since its all instant cast.

lol 11 edits and a novel later.. just consider the benefit of having an all but unlimited HP pool on all your mages (until your priests run OOM) compared to having 4-5 more mages that /cast fail constantly because their target is already dead =P

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Originally Posted by 'Sam DeathWalker',index.php?page=Thread&postID=93111#po st93111

Ahh well dump the priest then, I was thinking shaman only get self rez. Great, if I wipe I get 5 self rez and then they rez the rest ... big time saver. I can't put the 5 shammy in same group during pvp cause I need the tremor totoms for each group right? So 4 groups of one restro shammy and 4 mage, and 1 group of resto shaman, warrior and 2-3 mage (maybe 2 shaman in this group for even more healing of the tank).

If you are in raid it will jump to raid targets as a priority, I suppose during pvp I would be in a raid.

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Priests are superior healers for multi-boxing purposes in my opinion. There can be no argument that Resto Shamans are great healers if there is a player actually focusing his attention on the character, but the relevant difference for boxing between shaman and priest is the lower amount of attention and actions per minute you need to spend on a priest to heal a group effectively.

Examples:
Prayer of Healing - heals the priest's party, no target needed.
Prayer of Mending - set a fixed target that is likely to take damage, then fire and forget, it bounces around merrily.
Circle of healing - heals a party, which can be the one the priest is in, or the one of the person that the priest is targeting.

Think of the possibilities. Say 2-3 players are aoe'ing your group. You can on reflex hit the PoH button for your five priests and be sure that every group member will receive healing. Assume you are busy killing the faction boss in the enemy city. You can target heal your tank, bounce prayer of mending off the tank. You can also have all five priests heal one group that is low directly if you set up Circle of Healing to target the specific groups for all priests. G3 low? Nps, 5xCoH. Fixed. You can essentially reduce the healing buttons you usually use to a ridiculously small amount.

For a shaman, you have chain heal yes. But that requires the primary, secondary and tertiary target to be close enough (4-6 steps) to each other for the spell to jump. This is a much more annoying constraint than the priest's group heals that work over a 36 yard range.

its ridiculously easy. i try to remember to use renew, prayer of mending, shields, purely because i like to keep my skill level up and use them if theyre there.. but to be honest, with multiple priests circle of healing is the only heal spell you will ever need. even using low ranked CoH, my mages go from 500hp and nearly dead to 8000/full hp in two casts. with minimal effort.

also, dont forget holy nova. it costs a lot of mana, but in a pinch you can suppliment your mages arcane explosion spam with holy nova and with 5 priests it will be a pretty significant boost in DPS.

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Originally Posted by 'Steph',index.php?page=Thread&postID=93237#post932 37

You can also have all five priests heal one group that is low directly if you set up Circle of Healing to target the specific groups for all priests. G3 low? Nps, 5xCoH. Fixed.

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So that leaves:

Altherac Valley

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Scratch that.

You can only queue one party (5 people) at a time. There are mods that try to queue more than that, but they're hit and miss. The chances of consistently ending up with all 25 in the same AV are slim.

So you're really left with world PvP, such as it is, and very few opportunities to gear up as a team.

Ten is a much more useful number for WoW, albeit less unique and with less visual impact. You can actually DO things with ten characters (including most of the WotLK encounters if you're skilled enough), whereas you're pretty much stuck with dance-offs if you go for 25 :)

im really interested in seeing if the 10man content from WoTLK is doable by a boxer. if true end-game PvE sets are obtainable in a 10 man raid, i may actually consider rolling a tank and possibly a few utility class' and see if i can get some end game PvE sets together.. or selling raid slots for gold so i dont have to farm? =)

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Originally Posted by 'Otlecs',index.php?page=Thread&postID=93253#post93 253

..including most of the WotLK encounters if you're skilled enough

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Originally Posted by 'Otlecs',index.php?page=Thread&postID=93253#post93 253

There are mods that try to queue more than that, but they're hit and miss. The chances of consistently ending up with all 25 in the same AV are slim

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I wouldn't use the mod. I heard from a couple people that it is bandable. With 25 toons in av you will probably get reported tons of times from the other team.