Final boss of HFC split tactic does not work anymore?

Ok so on the Wiki, there is a tactic that if you pull the 2 guards before the final boss up the ramp into the "dark area", you won't aggro anything after they die and can run down and kill the dragon before taking on the rider...

So, I leave my 4 shaman clones up in the circular room before the ramp, go down with my main shaman, pull the 2 guards all the way back up into the circular room, and kill them, the dragon drops down, drops off the rider who stands in the middle of the room. So I'm like "great, this is working perfectly"....... until the dragon starts shooting fireballs at my group from about 150yards out - by the time I run up to within LB distance of him im already 2/3 dead.

Does this tactic no longer work? Now I'm thinking it would just be easier to bring all 5 shamans almost to the bottom of the ramp, kill both guards, drop grounding totems, and then run up with my main and aggro the rider and kill him first, then aggro the dragon and kill him also while I keep grounding totems down. I hear the rider goes down in 5-7 seconds.

Anyway, is there any way to make the prior tactic work or is it broken now? Also should I save my ele mastery, blood fury, and vengeance of the illidari abilities until after I kill the rider, or should I use them on the rider right away to take him down extra fast?

Thanks!

Hachoo-

I was similarly disappointed to find out this unbeatable strat would work! So I had to adapt to exactly what you're talking about.
Take it slow. Pull those two guards up to the top of the ramp, and have your shamans parked on the aggro side of the "color change" on the ground. So in other words, stay just on the beginning of the downhill.
Kill the two 57/59 guards. Drop grounding totems before the 2nd one dies.
Now begins the "exodus". The dragon rider will come down and yell, and like you said the dragon himself will attack you from 150000 yards away with fireballs. Let him get four off, and when the fourth is flying run about 20 paces downhill and drop your new totems.
I like to make use of this time to chain heal, or mana-spring mana back up, too, because dropping one grounding totem every 44 seconds allows you time to regen a lot.
When you get to the bottom you're going to get 41 yards away from the dragon rider, all the while dropping grounding totems. You're probably going to drop grounding totems twice in one spot (in fact that's ideal)
As soon as you drop your last batch (and hopefully drop your others like 3x Healing Stream 1x Mana Spring 1x Fire Resistance, as well as 5x ToW) then go ahead and zap the dragon rider's butt off.
When he's at like 40% you'll get the "Vazruden descends from the sky!" raid warning message, but the funny thing about shamans is by the time the dragon starts descending, you're going to have 5x lightning bolts already *descending* on the dragon rider's face.
So he'll be dead before the dragon is even combat-ready. Now you have to drop 5 more grounding totems and get away from them. Fireballs that the dragon shoots while on the ground are the napalm kind that leave that dangerous AoE patch.

How to kill the dragon? I had one alt with an elemental at this point, so I was able to use that. I don't know how you're going to do it because he's much tougher than the other guy and likes to swat/explode your face/flamethrower all of you.

I've used the split strat within the last few weeks, so I believe it still works fine.

You will indeed get nuked by the dragon after you pull the final pair of guards back, just drop grounding totems as you run to the platform. The key is that the rider is not agro to you, so you can get down to the platform (dropping grounding along the way) and nuke the dragon down without worry. When the dragon is low on HP he will land on his own, but it's an easy tank-n-spank at that point as he drops quickly and the rider is cake without fire dropping all over the place :)

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Originally Posted by 'Worthless',index.php?page=Thread&postID=117800#po st117800

I've used the split strat within the last few weeks, so I believe it still works fine.

You will indeed get nuked by the dragon after you pull the final pair of guards back, just drop grounding totems as you run to the platform. The key is that the rider is not agro to you, so you can get down to the platform (dropping grounding along the way) and nuke the dragon down without worry. When the dragon is low on HP he will land on his own, but it's an easy tank-n-spank at that point as he drops quickly and the rider is cake without fire dropping all over the place :)

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Yup, just did this last night and it works perfectly. For shaman teams, the use of grounding totems + PATIENCE makes this fight totally trivial. As others has noted, the rider will not aggro as long as you pull the guards up to the flat part of the ramp. He sits in the center of the round area like an idiot while you kill his dragon mount, actually. While you are killing the guards at the top of the ramp, drop your first set of grounding totems. The grounding totem eats the fireball, which prevents the "pool of fire" from spawning. If you take ANY fire damage in this fight until the dragon lands, you are not doing this correctly or trying to move too quickly...

From the air, the dragon sends fireballs infrequently enough that you can pretty much keep them all grounded. He usually pauses casting and flys around every 5 or so fireballs, this gives you a few seconds to safely move your guys down the ramp and set up a new set of grounding totems. I take my time and do it in 2-3 steps. Your target is the bottom of the ramp, where you will not aggro the rider, but will be able to (occasionally) target the dragon. You don't need to reposition beyond this; just keep up the grounding totems and lightning bolt whenever the dragon does come in range.

The time to blow EM, etc, is when the dragon landing emote happens. Even though the dragon lands, the rider will not aggro. Even if you blast the dragon while is is next to Vazruden, Vaz _still_ doesn't seem to aggro. So, nuke the dragon down.

After that, Vaz is a little pansy you can take down at your leisure.

Ah hah! I guess I misunderstood the Wiki, that makes much more sense. For some reason I thought the fireballs could still AoE me even when my grounding totems were there, so I was trying to frantically run towards the dragon (and running out of range of my grounding totems) while he was shooting me from the air. This will help immensely.

So I will try again tonight, and this time I will do the same thing I did before, but I will only run down the ramp after the dragon finishes throwing fireballs and starts to fly around, the i'll run halfway, drop another set of grounding totems, wait for him to stop again, then run the rest of the way, then drop more grounding totems and start nuking him in the air.

I'm guessing when he lands at 20% or whatever, ele mastery + vengeance trinket (+120 spell damage?) + bloodfury (now up to +135 spell damage or something) + 5x LB/CL/whatever should be more than enough to take him down before he can significantly damage me, and then if I understand it correctly I can rest to full before nuking the rider down also?

That sounds like it will be even easier than the first boss if I do it that way. I will try tonight and report back! Thanks everyone!

Nope, if you fully resist the fireball, no liquid flame pool is spawned. Same with grounding totem, although it does seem like there may be a bug if the grounding totem is cast just before the fireball where the pool does spawn. Taking my time, though, and getting my ground totems up at least a second before the fireball impact, I didn't have any pools spawn on two successive runs.

I was at level 63 with my shammy 5 man team; without even popping trinkets/EM, just CL+LB spam, the dragon was dead before he got to use his flame breath or fear. And, yes, for me Vaz stayed out of combat the whole time. Could have had a smoke, bio break. But he goes down in like 2-3 LB volleys, so you don't need much mana.

I wiped on this fight my first two attempts, in that ugly way where Nazan despawns and you can't attempt it again. After I took my time with the grounding totems, I took basically no damage at all. That was a lot more fun :-)

All,
Sounds like I was doing it the really hard, float-like-a-butterfly way.
The first time I tried to do it y'alls way that dinklestein would consistently fly out of range (because what does a fire howitzer dragon care about range?)
I'll have to try it the "split method" way of killing the dragon in midair. It was just pissing me off so much as I actually chased his purple butt around the entire platform, waiting for him to get in range.
I never tried it again that way, instead insisting on killing the rider first while grounding totems kept me safe from the dragon above. The HARD way!
I'm proud of my guys anyway.