Budget PC build for 20 man multibox.

[Speed]

Hello. Right now my PC spec :
i5 3570k, 16gb ram, 680gtx.
Running 5 man group without any problems. But i want to expand first to 10(15) man and later maybe even to 20man multibox.
I am playing on 1920x1080 resolution + second monitor(1920x1080) for twitch,youtube etc.
I am on a tight budget. Will i be able to run 20man on i5 8400, 32gb ram, 1060gtx 6gb?

[Kayley]

if you want to stretch what you have now, set macros up so the alts lower the render scale when running in the background.

/console renderscale 0.1 - for 10%
/console renderscale 0.25 -for 25%

Sure, things on your alts will look like a coloured blob, but you'd be amazed at how much you can save resource wise.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

if you want to stretch what you have now, set macros up so the alts lower the render scale when running in the background.

/console renderscale 0.1 - for 10%
/console renderscale 0.25 -for 25%

Sure, things on your alts will look like a coloured blob, but you'd be amazed at how much you can save resource wise.
Just to second this and comment, if you figure out about what percentage the size of your alts are compared to your main, you can set renderscale to that amount and you won't notice anything different on the alts (since they're tiny windows) aside from significantly reduced GPU/CPU. There does seem to be a very slight "lag" when ramping the alts back up when you switch to them but that could be caused by my macro also restoring the view distance back out to max. I haven't done the work to find out exactly but I suspect renderscale is the single most effective alt-resource-reduction option, with possibly ground clutter or shadows as close seconds.

[Speed]

if you want to stretch what you have now, set macros up so the alts lower the render scale when running in the background.

/console renderscale 0.1 - for 10%
/console renderscale 0.25 -for 25%

Sure, things on your alts will look like a coloured blob, but you'd be amazed at how much you can save resource wise.
Thnx!
But it didnt help me.
Still same load on CPU(20-25% on my main and 10-13% on minions), same load on RAM 1-1.5gb per window.
Total CPU usage ~80-85% for 5 man
FPS is locked to 60 on main and 30 on minions.
I guess this renderscale command only lowers GPU load or my PC is strange :)

[MiRai]

I am on a tight budget. Will i be able to run 20man on i5 8400, 32gb ram, 1060gtx 6gb?
It's highly unlikely that jamming twenty 64-bit game clients onto six CPU cores is going to be an enjoyable experience, especially when the base clock of the 8400 is only 2.8GHz. Unfortunately, "20-man multiboxing" and "budget" don't normally fall into the same sentence. :)

However, if you're using multiboxing software that is capable of running from two different machines, then you could always try and split the load between them.

[Speed]

It's highly unlikely that jamming twenty 64-bit game clients onto six CPU cores is going to be an enjoyable experience, especially when the base clock of the 8400 is only 2.8GHz. Unfortunately, "20-man multiboxing" and "budget" don't normally fall into the same sentence. :)

However, if you're using multiboxing software that is capable of running from two different machines, then you could always try and split the load between them.
Is base clock on CPU that important even if it goes to 4Ghz in turbo boost mode?
I tried to overclock my 3570k@3.6Ghz(x36 multi) to 4Ghz(x40 multi) no impact on client cpu usage(still 20-25% on main window)
But i got great result by lowering FPS lock from 30 to 15 on my slave clients. CPU load went from ~13% to ~7% for each minion window.
Is 8400 worser than 7700k for multiboxing?

[WOWBOX40]

If people could 20 box with such a crappy system, everyone and their mum would be 60 boxing atleast right now. It just aint happening. Expect minimum a pc worth 2 ish k dollars to 5box smoothly with low settings, thats including a monitor or two. Then add more pcs as needed.

A pc worth 3k dollars will play 10 games, but not smooth all of the time.. best to buy pcs for max 5 games on each, for a smooth experience. For safety you should calculate 4 gig RAM per game.

[Speed]

Expect minimum a pc worth 2 ish k dollars to 5box smoothly with low settings, thats including a monitor or two. Then add more pcs as needed.

A pc worth 3k dollars will play 10 games, but not smooth all of the time.. best to buy pcs for max 5 games on each, for a smooth experience. For safety you should calculate 4 gig RAM per game.
Umm.... WoW isnt that demanding.
1.7k$ PC is more than enough for 20 man.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

I set my background fps at 12 as it really doesn't seem to matter above that IMO.

[MiRai]

Is base clock on CPU that important even if it goes to 4Ghz in turbo boost mode?
"Boost" is nothing more than marketing BS because it normally only affects one or two cores, and if you're cooling on air, then it's going to be for a limited time (unless you adjust settings in the BIOS and are willing to run at a higher temperature).

EDIT1: There's a reason why there's a 1.2GHz gap between the base clock and the turbo clock. If the turbo clock was easily sustained then the gap wouldn't be so large (it's almost 50% of the base clock of the CPU). Also, 2.8GHz isn't the base clock for "power saving," because that's what C-States are for.

EDIT2: GamersNexus has an article (https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3077-explaining-coffee-lake-turbo-8700k-8600k) on this that shows the boost tables for CoffeeLake CPUs, including the 8400 (their table is wrong, it's 4GHz and he states that in the associated video), and here's a thread (http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-3546742/turbo-boost-coffe-lake-core-8400-work.html) over on Tom's Hardware where TechyInAZ explains it. In so many words, the maximum boost clock is only achieved when you're using one core, and then it drops down from there based on the amount of cores that are being used, which is then based upon thermals.


Is 8400 worser than 7700k for multiboxing?
Slightly, yes.

[Speed]

EDIT1: There's a reason why there's a 1.2GHz gap between the base clock and the turbo clock. If the turbo clock was easily sustained then the gap wouldn't be so large (it's almost 50% of the base clock of the CPU). Also, 2.8GHz isn't the base clock for "power saving," because that's what C-States are for.

EDIT2: GamersNexus has an article (https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3077-explaining-coffee-lake-turbo-8700k-8600k) on this that shows the boost tables for CoffeeLake CPUs, including the 8400, and here's a thread (http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-3546742/turbo-boost-coffe-lake-core-8400-work.html) over on Tom's Hardware where TechyInAZ explains it. In so many words, the maximum boost clock is only achieved when you're using one core, and then it drops down from there based on the amount of cores that are being used, which is then based upon thermals.

Got it. Thnx for info!
hmm according to GamerNexus 8400 will keep constant 3.8Ghz on 6 cores if CPU usage over 50%. Pretty good. Probably ll be able to handle 15 man with lowest graphics and background fps locked to 12.

[MadMilitia]

I set my background fps at 12 as it really doesn't seem to matter above that IMO.

That doesn't cause stragglers for you? I mean on follow.

[WOWBOX40]

These new wannabe multiboxers with a low budget apparently wont listen to advice from people who has done the same mistakes they themself are about to do. I can kinda understand it, been there done that... regretted it immensly. You just cant buy a maxda with 130 hk and imagine it being able to output 500 hk out of thin air. But ohwell, lets just let them experiment with the "12 background fps will solve it" mentality. You could just as well just take that cash out from the bank, then light it on fire.

[Speed]

These new wannabe multiboxers with a low budget apparently wont listen to advice from people who has done the same mistakes they themself are about to do. I can kinda understand it, been there done that... regretted it immensly. You just cant buy a maxda with 130 hk and imagine it being able to output 500 hk out of thin air. But ohwell, lets just let them experiment with the "12 background fps will solve it" mentality. You could just as well just take that cash out from the bank, then light it on fire.
What mistake did you make? New gen CPUs are powerfull.
I am pretty sure 8400,32 gb, 1060gtx ll be enough for 15 man.
https://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/53958-NEW-PC-with-i7-series In this thread the guy running 16man on 6700k, i think 8400 will be on par.
Amd 2700x, 48gb, 1060gtx ll be more than enough for 20 man.

[johny_mnemonic]

I am running 11 clients on this setup:
cpu: i7 2600K Sandy Bridge
mb: Asus P8Z68-V
RAM: Kingston 32 GB DD3
VGA: Gainward GTX 1060 6B
LCD: 2x 24" Benq

Right now when I am doing nothing just idling in low level zone, my CPU is at 55% and RAM at 24GB. As soon as I am porting just 5 toons to Dalaran, the game crashes, because 32 GB RAM is the limiting factor here. I have to port 1 by 1 and RAM settles at 31-32 GB. All toons except 1 leader for each group has vga settings to 1, leaders got 6.

This way I am getting constant 60 fps on which ever toon I am active on. I highly doubt, that 32 GB RAM will be enough for 15 toons, if you want to do something more than idling in town. As soon as I am playing doungeon or pvp, RAM usage goes for 2-3 GB per wow.exe instance. I had to lower the graphic settings even more after the prepatch 8.01. because they changed the game and it suddenly much worse to even start the game. Where as on monday 11 clients started 1s after each other, now it is 5s, and logging (even choosing which toon to play) tooks sometimes half a minute! So now I have clients set to /console renderscale 0.4 on all except leading toons, and starting the game is significantly faster. I dont mind having toons on lower settings, because 90% of time I have active windows on leading toons.

[Speed]

This way I am getting constant 60 fps on which ever toon I am active on. I highly doubt, that 32 GB RAM will be enough for 15 toons, if you want to do something more than idling in town. As soon as I am playing doungeon or pvp, RAM usage goes for 2-3 GB per wow.exe instance. I had to lower the graphic settings even more after the prepatch 8.01. because they changed the game and it suddenly much worse to even start the game. Where as on monday 11 clients started 1s after each other, now it is 5s, and logging (even choosing which toon to play) tooks sometimes half a minute! So now I have clients set to /console renderscale 0.4 on all except leading toons, and starting the game is significantly faster. I dont mind having toons on lower settings, because 90% of time I have active windows on leading toons.
Do you have ssd? Alot add-ons? Also if you didnt update WoW client(recently blizzard released few mini patches), logging will take long time.
Tested Dalaran with my 5 man on full-pop server. Was runing in circles in the city. I have the same DDR3@1600mhz memory, ram usage 1.7-2gb, Fps Locked 60/15, CPU usage on main ~25% steady 30fps while running, ~8-10%
on slave windows.
https://www.dual-boxing.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2055&stc=1

[Ughmahedhurtz]

That doesn't cause stragglers for you? I mean on follow.
Not if they're all using the same speed mounts/etc. I might have some issues very rarely when negotiating tight corners in populated areas but I don't notice any difference between 12 and 30 in my play.

[johny_mnemonic]

Do you have ssd? Alot add-ons? Also if you didnt update WoW client(recently blizzard released few mini patches), logging will take long time.
Tested Dalaran with my 5 man on full-pop server. Was runing in circles in the city. I have the same DDR3@1600mhz memory, ram usage 1.7-2gb, Fps Locked 60/15, CPU usage on main ~25% steady 30fps while running, ~8-10%
on slave windows.

I have SSD, it would be unplayable without it. I am using just few addons, jamba, isboxer, arkinventory, and tsm warehousing on all, except full TSM on my AH account. It was just fine before the patch, it is horrible after.

[MadMilitia]

I have SSD, it would be unplayable without it. I am using just few addons, jamba, isboxer, arkinventory, and tsm warehousing on all, except full TSM on my AH account. It was just fine before the patch, it is horrible after.

The new GFX minimums are probably to blame. SSO is disabled but shadows apparently no longer have a very low setting. The lowest is like medium shadows on the old build.

[Kayley]

Just make sure it's still on DX11 and hasn't changed to DX12. Should be relatively the same.

[Toned]

If people could 20 box with such a crappy system, everyone and their mum would be 60 boxing atleast right now. It just aint happening. Expect minimum a pc worth 2 ish k dollars to 5box smoothly with low settings, thats including a monitor or two. Then add more pcs as needed.

A pc worth 3k dollars will play 10 games, but not smooth all of the time.. best to buy pcs for max 5 games on each, for a smooth experience. For safety you should calculate 4 gig RAM per game.

Agree'd I have 3 systems that can handle 10boxing, and one of them only runs 32GB of ram and it's a pretty big difference between the 64gb machines.
I'm using 1080ti in the 32gb machine and the others are 64gb with 1070ti and they 10box.

WOD graphics engine update made multi-boxing pretty taxing on your system. Pre-WOD I could 5 box off my laptop with zero issues.

[Kayley]

I'm only bumping this because----

Due to all the 'sky is falling' amongst the GPU crypto miners.. you can pick up some A M A Z I N G deals on second hand GPUs atm.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

I'm only bumping this because----

Due to all the 'sky is falling' amongst the GPU crypto miners.. you can pick up some A M A Z I N G deals on second hand GPUs atm.
It's a worthy point and probably worth its own thread in the Hardware forum, though I would *definitely* caution anyone looking for something like that to be aware of the way some miners treat their mining equipment. I cannot find the link for the life of me but it went through a whole bunch of examples of abused hardware. Most of it was environmental, like running their rigs in:

* non-climate-controlled environments
* non-humidity-controlled environments
* unfiltered environments
* environments with relatively high levels of corrosion-enhancing elements (like oceanfront properties or rat/mouse piss or roach droppings)
* somewhere that wasn't protected against physical water intrusion (more likely than you'd think)
* a room where the rig had junk stored around/on it, causing physical damage to things like fans or heatsinks

I really wish I could find the thread as it had some of those gnarly pictures like you see from "My IT Horror Stories" threads.

As always, Caveat Emptor.