You know...

[Juseffinwork]

... call me a cop out, call me a whiner, do whatever you want...

but tell me there's an easier way than writing scripts and trying to get third party programs to work with more than one copy of wow?

I installed AHK, I toiled over the scripts, but I notice something among all of them.

they're specifically written for the user who made them.

I play wow in a style all my own, and I don't want to conform to someone else's idea of how I should play, what buttons to press, etc.

So, after having spent multiples of hours on this site, I'm either blind or too tired from exploring...

I just want a program that will let me send the exact same key press on my keyboard to the other wow window without having to move my mouse over to that one to make it active. and I want those key presses to be the universal key presses. Not this F1, F9, Numpad5 BS I keep seeing. I want to be able to press "N" for talents, or 5 for the option on bar # 1 in slot 5.

I.e. I am running wow on the same computer with two windows open (one on each monitor) and I use a standard button layout. I don't use any addons like Bartender or anything. I just want something that works without having to spend 4 hours setting it up.

Am I dreaming?

[unit187]

ow... lol

Well, to be honest (gonna tell u a secret!), with AHK, Keyclone and stuff u can use everything, A-Z, 0-9, numpad, F1-F12 etc etc etc

People are using keys like numpad because for example keys 1-9, with shift and alt and some other keys are basically not enough for 5-boxing (or even less-boxing :P)

[unit187]

oh and if u want something easy, then you probably need to use Keyclone, havent used it myself but on screenies it looks like much more easy then AHK scripts

[aurelieshagwell]

in those hours of exploring you must have missed keyclone then :)

[Xzin]

Keyclone most likely - or hardware.

I see boxing as sort of akin to building something personal to you and your preferences. I customized my setup because I wanted something that works for ME. It may not work for everybody but that is ok. There is no "easy" way to do this that will do everything you want it to do and cost nothing while

As with most things in life.

That said, surely you can reassign the AHK scripts, buy keyclone or go pure hardware.

[Juseffinwork]

Indeed I must've missed keyclone.

I found a script on the AHK site, but the process of getting it to work is pretty close to nil. I install the program, copy the script in and then what?

That's the missing gap, and maybe that's why I'm so irked about it. I'm missing vital details and it's frustrating the hell out of me.

[Juseffinwork]

Ok, so KeyClone is installed, I see how to load keysets and all that... but... where and how? Sorry guys, I'm an "out of the box, it needs to work" kind of guy for software I don't know.

[unit187]

Indeed I must've missed keyclone.

I found a script on the AHK site, but the process of getting it to work is pretty close to nil. I install the program, copy the script in and then what?

That's the missing gap, and maybe that's why I'm so irked about it. I'm missing vital details and it's frustrating the hell out of me.
well the thing is there is some info on this site, multiboxing wiki and AHK site you could find and use to create script you need.

I have spent like 2 days on searching all this stuff and like 2 more days on scripting, now I have the script done and working perfectly. No one really helped me with advise and no one pointed me at how to do anything and my mistakes.

So u can do the same :)

[Xzin]

I somewhat echo this sentiment. Keyclone costs $$$ so there is an expectation that it will work or there will be some handholding.

Everything else here is volunteer. I and others of us put the info out there - if you can't make sense of it and are not willing to dig into it and nobody else is willing to help then perhaps you should reconsider if this is the right hobby for you.

[Juseffinwork]

I don't have the kind of time you do. Thanks.

Unfortunately I need a sample to build off of and then I'm good. AHK is pretty much uninstalled, and Clonekey is heading that way. I've tried to make key sets in the program, but they don't save, and I can't load them after I've hit save (though nothing happens when I hit save in the first place)

[Xzin]

Aside from Keyclone and AHK (for windows) there really is nothing else out there. Both will work for what you want to do so if the problem is time then I must respectfully suggest that perhaps boxing is not for you. Consider it will take 10 - 15 days played to reach 60 - 70, depending on your play style. This is after you set everything up too. If you cannot be bothered to setup AHK or Keyclone then well.... and I don't mean this to sound mean but you might want to consider sticking to 1 boxing. It took me months to plan and build my setup and while that is all neat and great - I point that out not to show how great it is but to illustrate that boxing is complex and there is (yet?) a drop in solution that will "just work". I can't tell you how many problems I have had to overcome - things you would never even think of. But that is part of boxing (and life) and something that I enjoy.

[unit187]

I think most of us are people without tons of time, multiboxing costs money. For money you need to spend time for work...

Personally I am having work and spending alot of time on capoeira, but still I can afford myself to dig for info.

[Juseffinwork]

Ok guys listen, the problem isn't time with the game or the time with searching the forums.

The problem is that you guys all recommend this stuff, but the bloody websites that you get this stuff from is lacking in tutorial information. Then of course you vets get pissed at people like me who allegedly "can't read". If you want us to stop doing this, post a bloody tutorial that goes step by step. Make it a sticky, fine, but make it easy to follow.

I'll keep playing as I have been, but I'm not going to let my style fall under scrutiny because you think I should do it one way or the other.

I spent 6 hours on this site last night looking over ideas and threads. I'm not completely niave.

[aurelieshagwell]

You dont need to configure keyclone at all. Just run it, add the game windows to it (setup, general, autoadd) and youre ready to go. Keymaps are not necessary.

All the keys are automatically sent to all the versions of the application. you just configure in game the spells etc so they are on the same keys.

Keyclone took me seconds to set up and I wouldnt touch AHK with a bargepole because its about 2 levels too compelx for me

[Xzin]

Keyclone really does not need much of any configuration like AHK does. If you are having issues with it, contact the author. He posts here and would be likely to help since you are paying him for his product.

I don't work with AHK. I don't like the concept of it for various reasons and cannot suggest it nor write a sticky FAQ on it. Given the right amount of time put into it, it can do what you need. You don't want to do that, which is fine, but that means you will not be able to use it. I spent hundreds of hours planning out my setup and tweaking it. That is not required but it will take more than a few hours to get the hang of all of this. Nobody learns to fly a plane in six hours. What you are looking to do is no less than condensing what takes five people to do and doing it with a single person. WoW is already a somewhat complex game and there is a great deal to learn - please, have a little patience and I am sure you will be able to get it working.

Not really slamming your style, just letting you know there are certain realities of your situation. If you want to get this to work you will need to either invest the time needed to make it work, spend more time with Keyclone (it seems like) or go pure hardware (or none of the above). This could be writing your own, better program or not boxing at all.

[unit187]

Try http://www.wowwiki.com/Multiboxing - there is simple example for mapping "2" key. I started from it and have ended with perfect script ^^

Also use http://www.autohotkey.com/docs/ and ofc "search" option.

http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/ - alot of info listed here if u dig deeper ^^

[Juseffinwork]

I understand that, and I'm not trying to be an ass. I've just been reading all these great posts about how such and such program is "teh shiz" and it doesn't work the first few times I try it. AHK didn't work with any script that I tried, and now keyclone doesn't work (I'm sitting here with two instances of wow open and a key press on one does absolutely nothing in the other)

[unit187]

As I said, there is simple example at http://www.wowwiki.com/Multiboxing and it DOES work. If you cant get it to work, then you must be doing something totally wrong. Maybe forgot to run the script or something :P

[Juseffinwork]

if I can't get keyclone working (doesn't look good) I'll try AHK again and use those example(s).

If I can before work that is... /sigh

[caldvn]

rofling cause i've been multiboxing for years testing and perfecting. And someone researches for only 6 hours should expect their hands held for free. When in reality the information they're getting here was much more then what I and others ever had

If u can't figure out here. I can damn well tell you that you will blow monkeynuts boxing. Because you actually have to think....

[Xzin]

Well, no need to be condescending cald. I too wish the resources of this site and others were available when I set out to box.

Try emailing Keyclone... see if he has any suggestions. Post specific error messages so we can better try to diagnose the problem. Many of us have no problems sharing our areas of expertise (mine is very light when it comes to software solutions) but others out there may of better help.

If I gave up the first time linux didn't work... or we gave up trying to go to the moon the first time astronauts died or we stopped living as a free society the instant something catastrophic happened - then we wouldn't ever do anything as a species. Keep at it, sleep on it whatever you need to do. I am confident that your "ah-ha" moment will come :)

[Juseffinwork]

rofling cause i've been multiboxing for years testing and perfecting. And someone researches for only 6 hours should expect their hands held for free. When in reality the information they're getting here was much more then what I and others ever had

If u can't figure out here. I can damn well tell you that you will blow monkeynuts boxing. Because you actually have to think....

You're a PVPer. I can tell right now.

I've been doing this all by hand for the past two years myself. It's only recently that I decided I wanted to try the multibox approach. You're right, it may not be for me, I may have to settle for "only" one character at a time.

It's the lack of helpful content that had me frustrated. So many threads on the same topic (mine is no help) when a single stuck thread with screenshots would be all I would have needed.

Something to consider for future visitors for those who have the time and desire to show others.

[unit187]

2zin: nice said 8)

[Xzin]

I agree with you, it would be helpful to write a FAQ on how to dual box or multibox with software. I will sticky it the instant one appears but nobody has yet taken the time to write one. I would but I am no expert on these programs. If somebody wants to step up and write one, I would be happy to link to it and sticky it here. It would be of significant value to people attempting to multibox cheaply or with software only.

[aurelieshagwell]

I dont agree on this. AHK made me feel ill and it has a horrendous learning curve for most of us. When I see an application in which I cant even grasp the basics without long reading, i simply turn off. With keyclone however, multiboxing really doesnt take anymore than an hour or two. It took me that time to run kc, set up the ingame keys for 5 boxes, set up the right macros and get killing. Within 10 hours, i was mount/charge/slaughter whole camp/drink/charge off-ing like I've been doing it my whole life.

Granted im still way off some of your setups, for example setting macros for changing main or various spread out movements, but pve wise, mobs are falling over and I can do instances near my level comfortably.

My point is, you dont need to spend insane amoutns of time setting multiboxing up. You can get an excellent setup with a very very user friendly learning curve and then, as you go along, improve it.

[unit187]

well yeah, I am gonna test new version of my script tomorrow and then I'll make small tutorial about using AHK with examples of scripts.

[Wilbur]

With Keyclone, have you tried typing in the extension before clicking save?

[caldvn]

Well, no need to be condescending cald. I too wish the resources of this site and others were available when I set out to box.


I don't mind so much that people come to the site asking for help, but now he wants you to sit there and hold each of his hand and do the work for him, comparing how much time boxers have put into it pre dual-boxing.com.

From a certain standpoint, some people lack common knowledge, and the very basic of that is understanding their own computer software and hardware, like how to install etc...so that just tells me maybe they're not ready to box if they don't understand how to use a simple software....and at what point do you decide, hey...I'm wasting my time helping this guy.

2 pages of post trying to comfort the guy into something he may or may not be ready for but thinks that we should do everything to help him?

Most of the information in this site hasn't helped or improved my boxing experience since I've settled on my own style long before. I mostly go here to see where people are at. The spread out thing was fun to try, but that's about it. (it's a waste of key for me.)

P.s. I don't pvp, there's no real bragging right to sit there with 5 toons to kill one person, on the other hand if you can 5 man instance by yourself without wasting one hour for a group one hour on wipes and one hour on idiots....?

[unit187]

I dont agree on this. AHK made me feel ill and it has a horrendous learning curve for most of us. When I see an application in which I cant even grasp the basics without long reading, i simply turn off. With keyclone however, multiboxing really doesnt take anymore than an hour or two. It took me that time to run kc, set up the ingame keys for 5 boxes, set up the right macros and get killing. Within 10 hours, i was mount/charge/slaughter whole camp/drink/charge off-ing like I've been doing it my whole life.

Granted im still way off some of your setups, for example setting macros for changing main or various spread out movements, but pve wise, mobs are falling over and I can do instances near my level comfortably.

My point is, you dont need to spend insane amoutns of time setting multiboxing up. You can get an excellent setup with a very very user friendly learning curve and then, as you go along, improve it.
I might be mistaken but Keyclone is pretty new software compared to others so people HAD TO use non user friendly software. Well and hardware ofc.

[Xzin]

I dont agree on this. AHK made me feel ill and it has a horrendous learning curve for most of us. When I see an application in which I cant even grasp the basics without long reading, i simply turn off. With keyclone however, multiboxing really doesnt take anymore than an hour or two. It took me that time to run kc, set up the ingame keys for 5 boxes, set up the right macros and get killing. Within 10 hours, i was mount/charge/slaughter whole camp/drink/charge off-ing like I've been doing it my whole life.

Granted im still way off some of your setups, for example setting macros for changing main or various spread out movements, but pve wise, mobs are falling over and I can do instances near my level comfortably.

My point is, you dont need to spend insane amoutns of time setting multiboxing up. You can get an excellent setup with a very very user friendly learning curve and then, as you go along, improve it.

I think this is an excellent point to clarify. It is more true now than before - when NOTHING was out there. It IS possible to get up and running fairly quickly (albeit not at a complex level) within a few dozen hours of tweaking. That gets you in the door, so to speak, which is to say it is limited but functional. There is no reason why one could not go the software only approach and have 5 copies running on 1 machine with Keyclone within 3 - 4 hours. Actually controlling them would be another story but please don't think that my methods are the ONLY way to play. I feel they are the best for what *I* do but there is no reason you need the same investment in hardware and setup to play.

[view]

I agree with the OP to an extent, but not entirely.

I only joined this site 2 days ago (fresh to this stuff aswell - been doing it manually by running two small windows on one screen) up to now - never thought of doing it through automation till I saw Zin's vid on the wow forums and I thought that I have to give it a go!

So to give another persons perspective that is quite similar to the OP;

I'd have said this site has all the information needed. The first thing I saw was AHK or Keyclone (just by looking in the software forum and general) and looking at the big posts. I downloaded AHK first (as it was free) and it seemed to be the better option - but not being able to find a prewritten script was a bit of a turnoff. I then saw keyclone claiming that you literally open it and you're good to go.

Well it worked... but not very well. I pm'd the developer within minutes of downloading it as the program was hanging (having just handed over my $10) and I'm yet to get a reply. This obviously isn't very pleasing. The program works for simply duping all key commands to all windows, but I need more than that. The keymaping scripts fail completely - the program crashes whenever I try to load one to a window or load one to edit it. Again - yet to get a response from the developer about this.

AHK however became a dream. Downloaded it again, had a dig around on the forums and found what I wanted. An example script for the '2' button. Changed it to numpad - but that wasn't working because it was passing each letter in the word "numpad1" not the actual key.

Posted on here asking for help, and within a couple of hours some one posted their script for mapping the numpad keys. Copy+Paste and it worked. It's easy to work from there when you have an example to go from - and being able to safely edit it on the go (edit it, reload - if there's no errors it loads, if not it doesn't and it gives you *very* good debug info) is a godsend.

I agree having a more detailed intro guide for people doing this approach would be amazing - but I also fully understand why there isn't one. This is the kind of thing that if you want to get into, you have to accept it's going to be a long hard route to perfect what you want.

But, the help and support offered here so far is amazing :)

[Juseffinwork]

To Caldvn:

I'm not your run of the mill "noobfest" person. I have years in the computer world, but I do this stuff for my job, and quite honestly, I don't want to do it for my fun time. If I have to devote my own time, I will - my point is that I didn't have a clear jumping off point, that being said the lack of direction on where to go is also what upsets me, and what caused my posting of this thread. It doesn't help that I've been fighting a migraine all morning, so I apologize if I've come across as crass and naive. I don't expect you guys to hand this over to me, no questions asked. I just want more clear and concise information without having to dive into pages and pages of threads on the subject matter. It's obvious you know what you're doing and you do it well, but for crying out loud, it's a computer game. You don't need to treat me like I just walked into the ER with a tub full of E. Coli.

This site on the outside still looks fairly new, so it's possible that the point of walkthroughs and such haven't been made.

[Mannyman]

Keyclone works fine for what you want it to do, duplicate keystrokes in another window. Make sure the auto add form says World of Warcraft. If you're running off one computer, I can't see what the problem is. As soon as I load 2 Wow's and load up Keyclone(and the 2 wow's are added to the window list), keystrokes are broadcast automatically. And that's right off the bat, no configuration. All of 5 minutes. Yes, the documentation could be more friendly to new users. I had to do a lot of forum browsing to figure out how to get it going with my particular situation. But it was well worth it.

I don't know what your setup is for playing, but I highly recommend you spend time learning how the program you will ultimately use works. There are a lot of issues that come up when you multibox that can be solved quickly if you understand what your program does and doesn't do. Whether that be Keyclone, AHK, Synergy, or whatever you choose. I understand you don't have much time. I work 14-18 hours some days, and I still find time.

I spent about a week thinking about my setup, working out the issues, getting all the Keyclone macros needed for 4 characters in, UI customization, etc. When you actually delve into multiboxing, there are a lot of things that need to be addressed, and everyone does it their own way. How are your characters following you? Do you want them to turn? Are they attacking off assist, focus, etc? How do you handle buffs? Mouse clicks? Quests? Tells? Looting? Crowd control? It's not as simple as showing up and 1 shotting everything.

So in your case, you have a few options.

1. Pay $10 for Keyclone. It broadcasts everything on your keyboard unless you put keys in the do not pass list. I hit N for talents, it comes up in all my windows fine. If you want your secondary characters to cast spells etc, you have to write assist macros, like /assist me, /cast fireball. Like I said, it works right off the bat. Did you activate it through the paypal site? Are you using Xp, vista, etc? A little comment about your setup would be helpful.

2. Synergy, Multibox, AHK, etc are all free and work fine if want to spend a little more time setting things up.

3. Get extra hardware, 1 computer per WoW, and eliminate the need for these programs.

Again, the documentation on Keyclone and maybe some other programs are spread out in the forums. Yes, you have to do a bit of research here to fully understand them. I read Rob's website pages a few times over, and read his threads/replies. Yes, it's time consuming and could be organized better. But you have to consider, he wrote that program in his spare time after work, and we all chip in on the forums for free. You can't expect top shelf quality documentation all the time:) It's not like we have nothing else to do during the day and we get paid for it. I'm sure it will be sorted out one day.

[HPAVC]

Am I dreaming?

I am not sure what the actual dream is, I understand 1 computer two accounts. But really you can always map the keys for the secondary screen just fine.

I think if you sit down with some paper and design a plan with the existing keyboard you will come out with a viable two-boxing solution.

Even with a 'progmatic-keystroke application' you still need to lay the keys out to fit your play style. You might find working without the application and partitioning a region of the keyboard a good fit.

Many people use the numpad for this, or they use the top row (` to =), or a number function keys for the second accounts keys. Obviously in WoW your going to have the keybindings for the second account interact with these keys and the other computer is not.

So to move the second character forward you might 'CTRL-UPARROW' and 'ALT-UPARROW' on the first account you might have 'UPARROW' and 'ALT-UPARROW'. This would be an example of a keybinding that both accounts would share, but each could do distinctly.

What we are leveraging here is the two keybinding options in wow (and the ability to have spells on multiple action bar numbers).

[caldvn]

I have years in the computer world, but I do this stuff for my job, and quite honestly, I don't want to do it for my fun time.

This is all I need to know to understand what you're thinking... my point is made.

[keyclone]

view..you sent me a PM at 7am this morning.. a SATURDAY morning... and i was not online until tonight.

i am sorry you are having some frustrations... but there is a reason. you see, keyclone requires activation...which is an automated process triggered by paypal issuing a 'transaction complete.' couple that with you using an echeck, and you have a delay in the automated process... thanks to paypal.

and since keyclone will not work until activated, i think we see the problem.

i went ahead and authorized your copy and you should be able to run keyclone, add wow clients, and get going (this goes against my better judgement.. complaining loudly does not work with me.. unless you like getting hit with a stick)

i was also working on a revamp to the website while i was offline. the revamp has a FAQ area and i may add a tutorial area as well. that being said, i'd ask anyone that has any FAQ style questions they would like to see on the page to let me know and i'll pull it all together.

also, i believe a tutorial for the noobies would also be useful. i'll see what i can do about that as well.

[Xzin]

Keyclone - $10 a copy is a LOT of money and all. I expect you to be available 24/7 - 365. Come Christmas morning at 4 AM if I want to buy Keyclone and get support it had better be there. I will be mailing you a promissory note in a foreign currency BUT I DON'T CARE. I want results. If I can't get them then I will go to a competitor! Yeah! Even though there are none I WILL MAKE ONE and complain to them too.

(Can you tell I have dealt with customers before). Here is a secret: You will NEVER EVER satisfy them all. EVER. It is just not possible. No matter WHAT YOU DO.

So you do the best you can and always strive to do better.

A bit of a sercasmrant while I wait for XP to load into a boot prompt for the 30th time today..... *sigh* I even pay for dozens of copies of XP and I still can't get support for it. *grumbles*

[keyclone]

yea.. sometimes i wonder if these guys realize that $10 is nothing. hell, you can't get your yard mowed for $10 these days, and yet paying for software talent is too much? i mean, come on already.

and its not like i'm charging for every upgrade... its a one time fee. geez.

and yes, you cannot satisfy everyone... there'll always be someone that will whine loudly in an effort to get some attention. (these are the adults that were the spoiled babies you see in the super markets)

this is where the big stick comes in...

[Xzin]

I think its great, I would prefer people contribute their talents for free (like I do) but I also realize that we live in a capitalistic driven world economy. If I did not have other sources of income, I would probably charge for my guides or bundle them with some hardware or something like that. I put a TON of time and energy into my setup and I should be compensated for my time. The last company I put as much time into as I have my multiboxing work.... is doing very well. Writing guides and giving them away for free.... nets me absolutely nothing :) I don't mind giving them out for free of course but keyclone can do what $2000+ worth of hardware can do for $50. I think that's more than worth it - which is why I support your efforts. Just bear in mind that it is only one guy and Keyclone doesn't exactly pay all of the bills for him either (he has a full time job).

Anyway.... now to deal with a lovely nvatabus.sys could not be found error while watching some BBC. I love it :)

[Scribbler]

Keyclone is probaly going to be the best for you.

You start of with the entire keyboard being cloned, then you just add keys you don't want to be cloned to an exception list.

[Mannyman]

Well Juseffinwork, all this, and it turns out you didn't pay/activate the product? Jesus Christ.

Guess you didn't have enough time for that either. :lol:

[unit187]

Juseffinwork,

Here is the AHK guide: http://www.dual-boxing.com/forums2/viewtopic.php?t=807

Enjoy.

[Xzin]

I stickied it - good guide!

[zanthor]

Keyclone will by default send every keystroke to every copy of wow with about 10 seconds of setup.

[Stealthy]

If you're having dramas with AHK or Keyclone, why not try Synergy?

Ellay has posted a thread about it in the hardware / software section with a link to a key broadcasting version.

The only configuration required is getting the monitor setup right and selecting a key to turn key broadcasting on/off.

Cheers,
Stealthy

[Stabface]

A month or so ago I went out to a nice bar with some friends and had some drinks... some good bottles of wine, a great but not top end scotch. I drank quite a bit but not an over the top amount (didn't get sick or have a hangover). My part of the tab alone cost... more than an entire year of WoW subscription for 1 account. I'm not a rich person so I can't do this type of thing very often mind you, but it really showed me how cheap WoW -- and keyclone -- really is.

[Shogun]

A month or so ago I went out to a nice bar with some friends and had some drinks... some good bottles of wine, a great but not top end scotch. I drank quite a bit but not an over the top amount (didn't get sick or have a hangover). My part of the tab alone cost... more than an entire year of WoW subscription for 1 account. I'm not a rich person so I can't do this type of thing very often mind you, but it really showed me how cheap WoW -- and keyclone -- really is.

I used to work as a barman in a VIP bar. The ammount some people would blow on just one round of drinks, most of the time to impress a lady would astound me... Shame tipping in the UK isn't like the US, but it still shows you how cheap your hobby is compared to what others spend to feel sick in the morning (and most of the time the barman would pull the lady before they did anyway ^^)

[MrLonghair]

Now that you mention it, I could probably build a third box for the value of my liquor cabinet. Running five clients at a time on one hand, enjoying some of the best scotch gin and vodka without having to pay a $20 entry fee to a fancy place downtown on the other..

Can't forget the mandatory wardrobe cost either.