Auto Follow being removed.?

[Dranny817]

Saw this on the forums

Drinks with Devs - Great Fun
I attended the Drinks with Developers event and I had a blast. The team were great to hang out with and very approachable. Talking with them I learned a lot about a number upcoming changes that are on the table - not sure if I was supposed to hear all of them.

Just a few of the nuggets I picked up. Many of these are "on the list" and not necessarily imminent:


Auto-follow will be disabled in warfronts
Warlord is getting a snare ability
Riftblade Synergy with Tempest will be getting a nerf
New intra-dimensional travel items are coming
Cross shard might soon become at will (though the effects are still being debated.)


There were more but I wasn't taking notes.

I learned a lot of insider jokes about things that were infamously broken - including the famous flying spider mount, the Ebb of the Tidelord achievement, and the ability to leave a warfront and still score kills with Wrathful Exuberance.

We also talked about our S.H.O.E. collections - and joked about an achievement/title for collecting them.

New L60 remade dungeons are coming for some old world content and are currently in QA. Looking forward to the new Realm of the Fae.

Daglar even brought up an idea of upgrade components to bring old world raid drops up to L60 spec - something we -might- have to look forward to.

I made out with a ton of swag too - a store display. concept art, a signed Collector's Edition Storm Legion copy, a T-Shirt, and some credits.

All in all it was a great event surrounded by good people - much fun.



http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/378375-drinks-devs-great-fun.html

[Lax]

Auto-follow will be disabled in warfronts
Sounds a lot like the WoW battleground follow nerf. The title of your post is a little misleading :)

[Dranny817]

aha my bad missed the warfronts off it

[shadowlord63]

Would be another blow to the boxing community since RIFT is the Best MMO out right now compared to WOW. I hope all the new MMOs don't jump on the WOW bandwagon and block boxers in regular game play or PVP.

[ebony]

Would be another blow to the boxing community since RIFT is the Best MMO out right now compared to WOW. I hope all the new MMOs don't jump on the WOW bandwagon and block boxers in regular game play or PVP.

multiboxing is done for. a lot moved to rift and kids just don't like getting "owned" by us.


i had a few good years shame to see it dieing off more and more.


i can see new games just not adding follow in them, EG: elder scrolls online

[luxlunae]

Honestly trying to five box warfronts is annoying anyway since the queue goes forever and then the game starts when it is just 5v5. I had been planning to try a defiant team with the mage spec that I loved playing solo two years ago just for the pvp but now I don't think I'll bother.

[JohnGabriel]

Why do they call it Auto-Follow and not just Follow? Sounds like they are removing the ability to macro it from BGs and make you type it in.

[Mercbeast]

I really hope that this is not a for sure change.

[Nitro]

They took it out of WF and CQ tonight, respond to this thread to let them know how you feel about this: http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/379204-follow-disabled-warfronts-conquest.html

[shadowlord63]

Seen it coming, especially since all the PVP boxers left WOW for RIFT. This will more than likely happen to the next game that all the PVP boxers migrate to after this becomes permanent.

[Khatovar]

I'm not surprised either.

[Dranny817]

Is there any/many EU boxers.? maybe we should all jump to a pvp server and start killing everyone in sight to strike back. :rolleyes:

[Dranny817]

Anyone know of a way to combat the removal of follow for wf's .?

[luxlunae]

What does CQ stand for?

[Dranny817]

What does CQ stand for?

It's conquest it's a large scale pvp zone.

[moog]

I thought they publicly welcomed ex-WoW players when Blizztard pulled the same stunt, even in PVP - I can't find the quote, though; sure I'm not imagining it!

If so, this seems like a bit of a bait-and-switch!

[MiRai]

I thought they publicly welcomed ex-WoW players when Blizztard pulled the same stunt, even in PVP - I can't find the quote, though; sure I'm not imagining it!

If so, this seems like a bit of a bait-and-switch!
Unless Trion Worlds specifically said something like:

"Hey WoW players who are disgruntled over the removal of follow in battlegrounds, we allow multiboxing and won't be removing follow anytime soon from our warfronts! Come play our game!"

...then I don't see this as much of a bait-and-switch. :confused:

[moog]

That's why I'd like to find that quote again - could have sworn it was linked in here somewhere!

Still, very lame to pull the same shit that Blizztard did just a few months later!

WTF do these whiners twats do if they ever meet, say, 5 organised players who focus fire?!?!

[MiRai]

Still, very lame to pull the same shit that Blizztard did just a few months later!

WTF do these whiners twats do if they ever meet, say, 5 organised players who focus fire?!?!
It is unfortunate that the kids and the casuals can't comprehend that they're fighting 5+ characters at once, regardless of them being controlled by a single player, but I think the big problem is that the game is F2P. This means that anyone and their mother can fire up multiple accounts, act like a douche, get those accounts banned, and do it all over again for free.

Multiboxing paired up with PvP can easily breed douchebaggery, and then add in the fact that the game is F2P... Well, that's going to bring a whole new set of possible problems to the table.

Trion Worlds probably saw this beginning to happen after the initial influx of multiboxers who had moved over months ago and had finally gotten their teams leveled up. They said the follow command in warfronts is easily toggle-able on their end and they're obviously looking for player feedback, but I don't believe that the general forums of any MMO is the right place to get real feedback; in fact, I'm not sure there is any place to get the amount of feedback they'd need to make an educated decision on the matter.

[Dranny817]

I thought they publicly welcomed ex-WoW players when Blizztard pulled the same stunt, even in PVP - I can't find the quote, though; sure I'm not imagining it!

If so, this seems like a bit of a bait-and-switch!


I've been looking for it too as I'm sure someone asked Trion when wow removed the follow, And they said they were cool with it hence the reason people switched games. I don't remember exactly what was said but not been able to find the post either.

[MiRai]

Are you two talking about this?

977

[Dranny817]

I did look at that one but didn't think it that was it but I could be wrong.

[luxlunae]

Has anyone successfully gotten their money back? There are mbers on the rift forum threatening to cancel and try to get refunds on subs but I see no evidence they've succeeded.

Personally the only money I've ever spent is on my first box (when I played it solo), and I don't pvp because of their moronic warfront design (in what world is starting the battle with groups of five and then slowly trickling up to full strength a fun idea?).

Reading the thread just makes me more and more sour on what is obviously a community of assholes. Which we knew already but still it makes me ick at them.

[Nitro]

Make your voice heard: http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/379448-hey-daglar-multiboxers-unwanted-rift-should-we-pack-up-get-out.html

[Dranny817]

lets all combine forces on Seastone Defiant and kill every last m****r F*****g one of them.

err might have to wait for me to get to 60 first :o

[moog]

Are you two talking about this?

No, it specifically mentioned PVP and was a quote from a developer - of course, I may be remembering it wrongly.

[RSM72]

Just for the record I read that they turned /follow back on last night but I cant check it at the moment.

[Nitro]

Just for the record I read that they turned /follow back on last night but I cant check it at the moment.

I played a round of CQ last night, /follow was working

[Binafus]

Hey all,

Apologies for any confusion that arose over the weekend - it appears that we need to do some additional work to ensure that auto-follow remains disabled on characters.

It has been re-disabled this morning, but you may have noticed it working starting some point Saturday or Sunday - that was not intentional.

Cheers, Elrar




Apparently it was a mistake when they turned it back on, sorta why I'm done with the game this has been handled really bad by Trion.

They said they were doing a test to see how removing follow would effect people in WF's and CQ and they only wanted replies on how it effected you personally.


Hey folks,

As some of you may have noticed, we've disabled /follow in both Warfronts and Conquest for the time being. This is a toggle that is now in our remote admin tool that we can turn on and off in real time.

I know that there are a lot of opinions on the subject of multi-boxing and it is a heated subject for some people. Please share your opinions on how this has affected your actual gameplay - but keep it clean folks.

Bill "Daglar" Fisher
Creative Director: RIFT




They removed posts for a day and half and banned people who would try to argue or discuss this on that thread, after a day and half there were more people pro Boxing in Warfronts. So it looked very good for Boxing again in Warfronts.

Then Daglar comes back to this same thread at post number 223 and says this.


I'm sorry that I have not popped in here to give more details or engage in the discussion.

This change is not a direct result of "just some people complaining on the forums". This issue has been discussed internally since we changed the business model - we've been afraid that the amount of multi-boxing in certain environments would increase due to the fact that there is no longer a barrier to playing the game.

We've been watching the issue, and it has been on the rise. The number of multi-boxers out there is not astronomically high as some people claim. The number of /in game/ feedback reports on the issue has been steadily on the rise since our conversion.

I really want to embrace as many play styles as possible for RIFT. I really do. I don't want to turn away players.

Unfortunately certain play styles combined with specific activities (such as Warfronts), results in a sub-optimal experience for other users. When a single user has the potential - and be clear it is only ever potential - to cause another user to exit the game that simply isn't good for anyone. It isn't good for the multi-boxer, it isn't good for the person being killed by the multi-boxer, and it isn't good for the business.

I know this decision is polarizing - taking no action was also polarizing. We cannot make everyone happy all the time though we strive to, and we make decisions that we feel are best for the game. I'm deeply sorry that this conflicts with how some of you enjoyed playing the game up until now.

Bill "Daglar" Fisher
Game Director




Again in a heavy modded thread that was suppose to contain no discussion, Elrar pops back in the make it a discussion instead of feed back and turn the topic to fit their agenda in my opinion.

So it seems since the conversation was not going the way they wanted it instead of how it effects you now it became a discussion, also it seems they wanted to make sure people knew the forums had nothing to do with this even though they brought it to the forums to gather data to help with the decision.

There were several posts about ways to make both sides happy, but in the end Trion is not going to support Boxers even though as of today it is still legal to box in their game and Warfronts.

Just a warning before anyone invests money as I did in this game, I asked the forums a month ago if boxing was legal in Warfronts and asked for a response from a GM, I was pointed to a post from Trion that said Boxing was leagal in their game , before spending any money, several hundred dollars later I'm done with them.

[Chalked]

I'm a bit confused as to why people are upset. I've been boxing for a year+ and honestly I've done BGs in both WoW and Rift. BGs were never really a fair environment for Multiboxers and Boxers always knew they drifted on a slim line with it. The company stance could change on a minutes notice and it has.

Multiboxers make up a slim amount of their customer base. So I don't really think they're going to listen to people's demands. And all this talk of "Oh lets go boycott this by killing/camping other players until our demands are heard" is quite childish. You should be thankful that they allow multiboxing in their game. They could have just came out and given the community the middle finger and said "Ban for anyone who multiboxs" and you can't do jack because it's their policy. So why add fuel to the fire?

[Binafus]

I'm a bit confused as to why people are upset. I've been boxing for a year+ and honestly I've done BGs in both WoW and Rift. BGs were never really a fair environment for Multiboxers and Boxers always knew they drifted on a slim line with it. The company stance could change on a minutes notice and it has.

Multiboxers make up a slim amount of their customer base. So I don't really think they're going to listen to people's demands. And all this talk of "Oh lets go boycott this by killing/camping other players until our demands are heard" is quite childish. You should be thankful that they allow multiboxing in their game. They could have just came out and given the community the middle finger and said "Ban for anyone who multiboxs" and you can't do jack because it's their policy. So why add fuel to the fire?

You have a very valid point, please consider this.

I do not feel a company is doing me a favor to take my money tell me I can box, then when people come complain which are very rude breaking the forum rules with every post the devs leave their posts because they agree with removing limiting boxing.

Now their official policy is you can box in Warfronts but with no Follow command, how is that a policy?

I will also add I had two forum accounts dating back to beta with Rift, I post very little in forums, I have been a member in these forms since 2008 and today was my first post.

I logged into one account and said something in favor of boxing, later I logged in with the other account and said something, neither post was against the TOS and I was not trying to act like two different people.

My logins are very similar and I log both accounts on every day playing, I did not even think about it really.

They ban both my accounts for having multiple accounts and remove my posts.

So I have 5 accounts I box on log on the first one, explain what happened it gets banned and post removed.

Log on the next one ask why they keep baning boom ban, log on the third box account send a private message boom it gets a ban, log on the fourth and fifth with the same results both ban.

So I create another account make one post are you going to keep baning me, boom ban.

I create another account and post in the forums I keep getting baned because I have alt accounts and I'm a boxer of course I have more than one account Trion does not want to hear a view point in favor of boxing watch how fast this account gets banned.

53 posts later the account is still open.

You are a bigger man than me if you can look at a company like this and say they are doing me a favor, I spent 300 + dollars in the last three weeks with Trion and will not spend another penny.

I came here to warn boxers that with a few bad posts from immature people they could change their mind tomorrow and you too could lose your time and money invested in Rift.

I mainly PvP in every game I play, Rift was a welcoming place to that a couple weeks ago. When I asked if there was any plans to remove boxing in WF's a month ago nothing but welcoming.

[Chalked]

I'm not here to tell you not to box. I'm going to make a comparison though.

I could go out tomorrow and buy a super car. (It'd be stupid but, let's say I did.) Ok so now I have this car that can easily do 200 MPH on the highway.

The state I'm in determines what speed I can go at, normally 55 mph oh the highway. Now they're not saying that I cannot use the car on the road (multibox in the game), they're just saying I cannot go 200 Mph and make other drivers uncomfortable.

Multiboxing creates a very unfriendly environment for the "victims". I was one of them. If one guy came up to me and killed me instantly I'd be a little upset. If he was in my BG I'd be more upset because of the fact, he's making the game not fun for me. I've boxed plenty of BGs and people have always come back and told me that I'm an ass because I'm cheating or whatnot. Sure I may not be cheating but I'm certainly ruining someone's night.

I can understand the desire to multibox pvp. Hell I started boxing because of it. It's very fun to have that much power, however I just started feeling bad for the other folks on the receiving end of my five lava bursts. So Trion is now facing what Blizzard faced. "Hey there's this guy creating and unfun environment for our other customers." Kind of like a family with kids coming into a nice steak restaurant and the kids keep talking. The restaurant will take your order and even take your money, but if they see that your kids are upsetting others, they'll ask you to leave. Because one table of lost business is better than a whole restaurant pissed off.

As I said before multiboxing walks a thin line. It's not really cheating, but it does really take the fun out of the game for others. So from a business standpoint I can understand.

Also I did a quite glance at their ToS

"In the event you cancel your subscription service, Trion will not refund any fees already paid or owed by you.D. Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods
Purchases of Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods are non-refundable, unless otherwise required by law."

So um that refund request is going to be trivial as you signed their ToS when you logged on or made the account, correct?

[Binafus]

I'm not here to tell you not to box. I'm going to make a comparison though.

I could go out tomorrow and buy a super car. (It'd be stupid but, let's say I did.) Ok so now I have this car that can easily do 200 MPH on the highway.

The state I'm in determines what speed I can go at, normally 55 mph oh the highway. Now they're not saying that I cannot use the car on the road (multibox in the game), they're just saying I cannot go 200 Mph and make other drivers uncomfortable.

Multiboxing creates a very unfriendly environment for the "victims". I was one of them. If one guy came up to me and killed me instantly I'd be a little upset. If he was in my BG I'd be more upset because of the fact, he's making the game not fun for me. I've boxed plenty of BGs and people have always come back and told me that I'm an ass because I'm cheating or whatnot. Sure I may not be cheating but I'm certainly ruining someone's night.

I can understand the desire to multibox pvp. Hell I started boxing because of it. It's very fun to have that much power, however I just started feeling bad for the other folks on the receiving end of my five lava bursts. So Trion is now facing what Blizzard faced. "Hey there's this guy creating and unfun environment for our other customers." Kind of like a family with kids coming into a nice steak restaurant and the kids keep talking. The restaurant will take your order and even take your money, but if they see that your kids are upsetting others, they'll ask you to leave. Because one table of lost business is better than a whole restaurant pissed off.

As I said before multiboxing walks a thin line. It's not really cheating, but it does really take the fun out of the game for others. So from a business standpoint I can understand.

Also I did a quite glance at their ToS

"In the event you cancel your subscription service, Trion will not refund any fees already paid or owed by you.D. Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods
Purchases of Virtual Currency and/or Virtual Goods are non-refundable, unless otherwise required by law."

So um that refund request is going to be trivial as you signed their ToS when you logged on or made the account, correct?

Chalked I think you are missing all my points, if I wanted money back I would do a charge back on my CC.

I'm not talking about cars or speed limits this really has nothing to do with what I was talking about or eating at a restaurant which is what I do for a living is own a restaurant, If I asked you to leave you would leave with your money in your pocket, not a chance I would keep your money and tell you to leave. This is how I think a business should be ran and successful ones are that way.

If all you got out of my post is I want to kill people in Warfronts and I'm mad and quit because I can't I did not do a good job explaining.

Just really short I feel they have been very dishonest with me, I feel like adding a follow off and on command to test then two days later planing saying it was not a test it is their intention to keep it, baning people that do not share their view while letting people insult and break the TOS if you share their view. I never even said I wanted my money back just told people if you are going to spend money consider my post. Most of all I do not feel a company is doing me a favor to pay to play their game and not break their TOS, it is still not against the rules to Box in Warfronts. So Trion says I can box today in Warfronts so can you how silly is this?

If you want to use the car example it would be like saying hey buy this super car it goes 200 mph and since you are buying a super car there are no speed limits for you, then two days later give you a ticket for putting gas in it, we changed the law on super cars you can not put gas in them but they are still legal and you can drive them as fast as you want.

I most certainly did not come here to argue with you just wanted to warn people.

[Smedbox]

I think it's perfectly fine to complain about multiboxers in low-level warfronts. Let's face it. We're all veteran high-class PvP:ers of the higher caliber. The other team consists of noobs who just started playing Rift in the last few hours and have no idea what's up or what's down. Their gear is what their mother gave them when they headed out. It's going to be very one-sided.

However, at level 60 things change dramatically. The noobs are now in such minority that their existence doesn't matter to the matches. Multiboxers are meeting fully geared premades and not random PUGs. Gigantic difference.

We should all push Trion to:

1. Re-enable /follow in all cases.
2a. Require premades to fight against premades only, never against PUGs for level 1-59 warfronts.
Or:
2b. Disable /follow for level 1-59 in warfronts. (Keeping it enabled for all level 60 activities.)

Because the poor noobs just have no defense against a veteran mutliboxer in the lower-bracket. It's like fishing in a barrel, with dynamite. A little ridiculous. We shouldn't be doing this, starting August 18.

I say, from August 18, we go on strike. We Demonstrate.

1. Refrain from any non-level-60 warfronts at all, whatever happens.
2. Walk your team straight into the middle of a 60 warfront. Then AFK:ing. Respawn when necessary and continue the passive demonstration. Maybe we should get some banners and such, and music... Doing this for a week should get most people to hear our message:
"It would be so much easier to actually try to fight if we could only _move_... Trion disabled /follow making it impossible for multiboxers to play Warfronts and Conquest properly".
3. FIght back and heal as much as you can to try to stay alive as long as possible.

[Chalked]

I understand why people are upset and I'm not really trying to argue with people.

I just don't see the point in trying to protest in an online game. If you have a problem with it take it to the forums or call their support. If they get more support calls about it chances they'd do more. I wouldn't suggest going into warfronts and being AFK. That's just being an ass and creates a bad image for multiboxers. It's much like a child who doesn't get his way so everyone has to suffer.

Why is PvPing in warfronts the only avenue that you must play? Why not world pvp? They aren't taking PVP out of the game for multiboxers, just warfronts because they feel it's unfair and in many degrees it is. I mean I've been boxing for a while. I know I can go around and press one button and the target will die. There isn't any hiding this.

I'm not directing my post to you Binafus, well not only you. But to all the boxers in this thread. It's just whenever these sort of things happen most boxers act like their whole existence in a game has been destroyed because they cannot multibox in BGs.

[Binafus]

Chalked I came back to Rift played my level 50 war to level 60 all WF's no quests accept some crafter ones to get Marks.

I paid to have all the crafting professions on my one war including mining, harvesting, gathering, so I could make everything for my box accounts. I do their armor, runes, pots, weapons, rings etc.

I started a new character a healer it is now 51 all in WF's it has not done ten in game quests.

On my box account I did five mages spent all the time to make all their items all the way to 29 so far, did the same thing for my clerics they are 38 now. I have actually done more PVE on my box accounts than I ever have in the game, just because the que times are long, mainly rifts. Most of the time I mess around on the internet while waiting for ques.

So taking away WF's from me is my game, I'm not protesting, sent a GM ticket in explained why I was quiting, made a post in the forums and I'm done.

I was not trying to start any time of movement here was just warning people what had happened to me and they should take it in consideration before spending money with this company.

They handled this very badly, again their stance now is Boxing is ok anywhere in the world of Rift even in WF's but you can not use follow in order to decrease the negative effect boxing has on the game. I feel they lied when they said there were just testing when the added the ability to remove follow on the fly.

Chalked if you enjoy Rift and spend money with them I have no problem at all, I'm just not gonna do it there were solutions besides what they did.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

Unfortunately certain play styles combined with specific activities (such as Warfronts), results in a sub-optimal experience for other users. When a single user has the potential - and be clear it is only ever potential - to cause another user to exit the game that simply isn't good for anyone. It isn't good for the multi-boxer, it isn't good for the person being killed by the multi-boxer, and it isn't good for the business.

Interesting. If they're going to justify that change based on the "potential to cause another user to exit the game" then they need to bring down the wrath of god on the botters, griefers, harassers, trade-spammers, and a whole host of other people. Very slippery slope, that.

Disappointing, but I can't say I'm surprised.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

Being max level in lower-level PVP zones creates a very unfriendly environment for the "victims". I was one of them. If one guy came up to me and killed me instantly I'd be a little upset. If he was in my leveling zone I'd be more upset because of the fact, he's making the game not fun for me. I've farmed plenty of lowbies and people have always come back and told me that I'm an ass because I'm cheating or whatnot. Sure I may not be cheating but I'm certainly ruining someone's night.

I can understand the desire to gank in pvp zones. Hell I started ganking because of it. It's very fun to have that much power, however I just started feeling bad for the other folks on the receiving end of my max-level gear and spells. So Trion is now facing what Blizzard faced. "Hey there's this guy creating and unfun environment for our other customers." Kind of like a family with kids coming into a nice steak restaurant and the kids keep talking. The restaurant will take your order and even take your money, but if they see that your kids are upsetting others, they'll ask you to leave. Because one table of lost business is better than a whole restaurant pissed off.
Modified to point out the logical inconsistencies therein. ;)

[Smedbox]

Why is PvPing in warfronts the only avenue that you must play? Why not world pvp? They aren't taking PVP out of the game for multiboxers, just warfronts because they feel it's unfair and in many degrees it is. I mean I've been boxing for a while. I know I can go around and press one button and the target will die. There isn't any hiding this.

I'm not directing my post to you Binafus, well not only you. But to all the boxers in this thread. It's just whenever these sort of things happen most boxers act like their whole existence in a game has been destroyed because they cannot multibox in BGs.

There are a few problems with this line of thought:

1. You need PvP gear to be effective in open world PvP. You need to play warfronts and Conquest to get that gear.

2. Conquest is not just for PvP purposes. It gives you benefits in PvE as well, for example Best-In-Slot PvE gear, movement speed bonuses and PvE stat increases. This move doesn't just hurt PvP, it hurts our PvE progression too.

[Binafus]

Any decent premade would beat a boxer and they allow premades is also another flaw in this logic.

I would have thought the easy way to fix all of this and also would have created a situation where they could get more boxers would have been to do something like turn off /follow in all warfronts under 40.

If you are 40+ can not deal with a Boxer in PvP you suck so bad you really have no room to bitch about anyone owning you.

But again they were not looking for a way to keep boxers they were looking for a way to remove them without going back on their words boxers were allowed, so they turn off follow and say boxing is still allowed in Warfronts, a very dishonest way of trying to fix a problem.

[Mickthathick]

So what is stopping every player multi-boxing many toons given it's f2p? If I was Trion that would be my biggest concern, people overloading my server with 5-10 free accounts while only buying crap on their main acn.

[Smedbox]

So what is stopping every player multi-boxing many toons given it's f2p? If I was Trion that would be my biggest concern, people overloading my server with 5-10 free accounts while only buying crap on their main acn.

I wouldn't be concerned about that. It's not like Rift is the first F2P game in the world, so we already know the answer to that. The portion of players who multibox remains very small in F2P games. I don't think premium vs F2P is a major factor.

[JohnGabriel]

So what is stopping every player multi-boxing many toons given it's f2p? If I was Trion that would be my biggest concern, people overloading my server with 5-10 free accounts while only buying crap on their main acn.

Multi-boxers are just as likely to spend real money as single players. They may not buy things that can be easily farmed, but they'd spend credits on exp boosts, wardrobe, mounts, pets, etc... x 5 or x 10 even.

[moog]

Multi-boxers are just as likely to spend real money as single players. They may not buy things that can be easily farmed, but they'd spend credits on exp boosts, wardrobe, mounts, pets, etc... x 5 or x 10 even.

Absolutely - I've already bought full sets of 16-slot bags and mounts for multiple 5-man teams, all with Rift gems.

[Mickthathick]

Multi-boxers are just as likely to spend real money as single players. They may not buy things that can be easily farmed, but they'd spend credits on exp boosts, wardrobe, mounts, pets, etc... x 5 or x 10 even.

That's true, but most multi-boxers who are part of this community and who view mb as a hobby would be very much the exception and have no problem dropping money into games they are enjoying.

I was thinking that Trion would be concerned more 'normal' people might be tempted to roll 5 accounts rather then 1 given there is no monetary barrier to starting the game.

[Smedbox]

That's true, but most multi-boxers who are part of this community and who view mb as a hobby would be very much the exception and have no problem dropping money into games they are enjoying.

I was thinking that Trion would be concerned more 'normal' people might be tempted to roll 5 accounts rather then 1 given there is no monetary barrier to starting the game.


'Normal' people don't do that. Same as in any other F2P MMO.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

'Normal' people don't do that. Same as in any other F2P MMO.

Exactly. The vast majority of players would never even consider multiple accounts other than for adding more character slots or having a bank/auction mule.

[Mickthathick]

Ok, you've sold me. So wth are Trion worried about then :/

[Smedbox]

It's not the amount of new multiboxers that people were complaining about. It's all the new F2P players who are complaining about existing multiboxers. All these new players have never seen a multiboxer before, so it leads to a lot more complaining than before.

That, and the fact that the new Rift lead ("Daglar") personally hates multiboxers. He was just looking for an excuse to prevent multiboxers from playing.

[Korruptor]

So is the PvE lacking to such an extent that the removal of /follow in war-fronts enough of a reason for many of you to leave Rift? I'd just like an idea of whether or not it worth leveling a team if the elder/end-game isn't worth the play time.

[Smedbox]

So is the PvE lacking to such an extent that the removal of /follow in war-fronts enough of a reason for many of you to leave Rift? I'd just like an idea of whether or not it worth leveling a team if the elder/end-game isn't worth the play time.

Without /follow it's pretty ridiculous. You'd like to help your team, move with them, organize which extractors to take, play what Trion calls their take on "Open World PvP like environment", and then they say that Multiboxing is still perfectly fine to participate in World PvP. But you can't. You can't move properly as a team and travel the zone like you should be able to. They say they removed /follow because of Free-To-Play, and and beeing afraid that free-to-play multiboxers would flock to their game with free accounts to do PvP. Well, I'm a subscriber and none of that applies to me. So why did they disable follow in CQ for all their loyal subscribing customers?

Hate.

It doesn't affect their bottom line whatsoever. Any hateful person still wouldn't quit Rift because of multiboxing. There's so much more to hate. And eventually he has a meltdown and quits Rift, for whatever random reason he hated at the time. Had it not been Multiboxing, it had been one of the other hundred complaints he had.

Maybe Rift is actually winning by getting rid of the irrational haters. They would just pester the rest of the players anyway and spread the hate.

In any case. Removing /follow in Warfronts doesn't change very much. This lets you get PvP gear only and has no impact on PvE.

Removing /follow in CQ, on the other hand prevents you from gaining/maintaining CQ Power. This gives you PVE benefits: Faster mount, and higher PvE stats like Spellpower. You also won't be able to get the PVE BIS trinket. CQ also gives some PvP gear.

So you if won't get any PvP gear, so you won't be able to participate in any World PvP events on the servers, which they said was a perfectly fine activity for multiboxers.

Other than that, you can pursue your PvE progression without noticing what you may be missing. They would have been a better PvE player, but you can PvE without it.

[ebony]

Without /follow it's pretty ridiculous. You'd like to help your team, move with them, organize which extractors to take, play what Trion calls their take on "Open World PvP like environment", and then they say that Multiboxing is still perfectly fine to participate in World PvP. But you can't. You can't move properly as a team and travel the zone like you should be able to. They say they removed /follow because of Free-To-Play, and and beeing afraid that free-to-play multiboxers would flock to their game with free accounts to do PvP. Well, I'm a subscriber and none of that applies to me. So why did they disable follow in CQ for all their loyal subscribing customers?

Hate.

It doesn't affect their bottom line whatsoever. Any hateful person still wouldn't quit Rift because of multiboxing. There's so much more to hate. And eventually he has a meltdown and quits Rift, for whatever random reason he hated at the time. Had it not been Multiboxing, it had been one of the other hundred complaints he had.

Maybe Rift is actually winning by getting rid of the irrational haters. They would just pester the rest of the players anyway and spread the hate.

In any case. Removing /follow in Warfronts doesn't change very much. This lets you get PvP gear only and has no impact on PvE.

Removing /follow in CQ, on the other hand prevents you from gaining/maintaining CQ Power. This gives you PVE benefits: Faster mount, and higher PvE stats like Spellpower. You also won't be able to get the PVE BIS trinket. CQ also gives some PvP gear.

So you if won't get any PvP gear, so you won't be able to participate in any World PvP events on the servers, which they said was a perfectly fine activity for multiboxers.

Other than that, you can pursue your PvE progression without noticing what you may be missing. They would have been a better PvE player, but you can PvE without it.


same as wow follow got removed from bg's yet we can do wpvp and arena. there game there choice.

[Korruptor]

Ah Ok, I see the need for doing Conquest but can't. Yeah that seems to be something I need to consider before sinking additional time and money into Rift.

[moog]

that seems to be something I need to consider before sinking additional time and money into Rift.
Easy, don't spend a penny and try it F2P.
If you enjoy it, invest in some serial numbers to get the extra bags/char slots.

I'm loving it, purely 5-boxing PVE.
Slightly clunkier than WoW was and with much more limited addon availablity but you can't beat the price :)

[Korruptor]

Easy, don't spend a penny and try it F2P. If you enjoy it, invest in some serial numbers to get the extra bags/char slots. I'm loving it, purely 5-boxing PVE. Slightly clunkier than WoW was and with much more limited addon availablity but you can't beat the price :)
Hi Moog -
To clarify, I had played Rift with a single account quite some time ago and then started boxing a reroll with 4 more accounts long before the F2P. I had quit for some time but always kept my eye on the game and eventually found the expack for $20 and bought 2, then found 1 online for around $10 and a fourth for around $13.

So if I bother with a fifth I'm not sure but I'm primarily playing a 5-man arbiter build so the new souls haven't factored in yet. The main is back to my original main but mentored down to the group level.

I enjoy the more flexible/dynamic game play over WoW and SW:TOR (and the art style is really nice) but I guess I will hold off a bit to see if I will stick with this a bit before getting mounts for my alts as we currently have to run everywhere.

[Ualaa]

So is the PvE lacking to such an extent that the removal of /follow in war-fronts enough of a reason for many of you to leave Rift? I'd just like an idea of whether or not it worth leveling a team if the elder/end-game isn't worth the play time.

I haven't actually started Rift, but definitely left Wow because of the Follow removal in battlegrounds.

For me, arena was never fun.
But battlegrounds were a blast.
Sure you can queue for rated battlegrounds, and get a win every fifteenth match or so by having the other side not show up.
But that's not exactly a fun way to get the Conquest Points, to be competitive in world pvp.
World pvp wasn't really that exciting either; it might have been on a balanced server... but always seemed like one side stomped the other completely.

Rift, as a free-to-play game was intriguing.
However, without follow in battlegrounds, the most/only really fun aspect of the game is gone.
So I see it as a superior option to Warcraft, in that its not going to cost a monthly fee.
But without the pvp, it's not a great option either.

Then again...
The Sony games don't really have pvp either.
But I could lose myself in Everquest I for a year or more, considering I had basically as much time in EQ I than I did in Wow.

Free to play is nice.
But, for me, PvE isn't really that exciting.
I can PvE, against the computer, in a one-player game... and once you win a few times... it gets old.

[Korruptor]

Then again...
The Sony games don't really have pvp either.
But I could lose myself in Everquest I for a year or more, considering I had basically as much time in EQ I than I did in Wow.


Thanks Ualaa, I clean forgot about jumping back into EQ as an option. I'd prefer a progression server (I did play on Fippy Darkpaw; it was awesome) but I won't pay for that again.

Despite trying multiple times I can't stand the queue and delay game mechanics for fighting in EQ2, pity really.