How is WoW nowadays?

[Pycno]

I played wow a lot in the first expansions and lost interest when Cataclysm was released.

I had a team of 4 mages and 1 priest, I enjoyed doing battlegrounds, world pvp, low level instances and raids.

I also enjoyed collecting vanity items, and also collecting heirloom items to make imba alts. My highest rating in arena 5v5 was 1600, I didnt spend much time on it.

Im thinking of returning, perhaps try 10 box.

Did Cataclysm and MoP add new fun things for multiboxers? How is boxing nowadays compared to during WotLk?

[Pycno]

I just read Activision-Blizzard disabled /follow command from Battlegrounds, and their lead systems designer labeled multiboxing as a problem.

Since they dont want our money, can anyone recommend other fun games? What about Tera Online? :)

[rfarris]

He didn't say it was a problem. What he actually said was that multiboxers love BGs and have a lot of fun but that nobody else was enjoying the BGs when multiboxers were around. What he said was a problem was that bots were mostly dependent on /follow and that by removing /follow it would get rid of the bots and all around make the non-boxers happy. There's more of them than there are of us. :)

[Pycno]

He is basically saying that when multiboxers are having fun it is often at the expense of too many other players, and that this is a problem.

"The problem is when multi boxers are having fun in PvP, everyone else often is not." - Ghostcrawler

https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/status/322396622594125824 (https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/status/322396622594125824)

One thing to note is that this is an observation from their lead systems designer, it does not matter if he is right or wrong. What matters is that is his opinion, and he is the lead system designer, and he will not suddently change his mind because someone playing the game disagrees with him.

Multiboxing makes your characters stronger than other players and many players find that unfair. The ingame accepted way of becoming stronger than your opponents is to spend more time playing, divorce your wife and give up a career. Its completely unfair that having a job and income should give you an advantage in any way.

Another perspective is that the playerbase is becoming more and more casual and less tolerant of hardcore gamers such as multiboxers. Its probably a combination, and multiboxers seem to make everyone pissed off.

[Alge]

Since they dont want our money, can anyone recommend other fun games? What about Tera Online? :)
RIFT is free-to-play and not too dissimilar to WoW to make things hard to pick up.

[Palee]

Does anyone know where GC plays, on what realm and faction? I would like to roll a few characters there and destroy him as many times as I can find him.

[Pycno]

Boomly_Orcsbane: "The biggest issue is that this change has utterly destroyed a play style that has been accepted for 8 year's!!"

Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler: "Nevertheless, do you think it was fun for the solo players on the receiving end?"



Another quote from the same link. He is right, many players find it more frustrating to be beaten by a multiboxer than normal players.

[zenga]

Multiboxing makes your characters stronger than other players and many players find that unfair. The ingame accepted way of becoming stronger than your opponents is to spend more time playing, divorce your wife and give up a career. Its completely unfair that having a job and income should give you an advantage in any way.

Because to stand a chance in random battlegrounds you need to be a no-lifer? Your statement seems flawed in pretty much every possible way.


Another perspective is that the playerbase is becoming more and more casual and less tolerant of hardcore gamers such as multiboxers

Since when are multiboxers hardcore gamers? Hardcore gaming doesn't seem to fit with a wife, income and career as you said before.

[MiRai]

One thing to note is that this is an observation from their lead systems designer, it does not matter if he is right or wrong. What matters is that is his opinion, and he is the lead system designer, and he will not suddently change his mind because someone playing the game disagrees with him.
Or he's making a factual statement based upon years of forum and in-game ticket feedback.


Another perspective is that the playerbase is becoming more and more casual and less tolerant of hardcore gamers such as multiboxers. Its probably a combination, and multiboxers seem to make everyone pissed off.
I think you're giving too much credit to too many multiboxers who PvP'd. :p

Either way, there are still a handful of players out there doing world PvP on a grand scale.

[Pycno]

zenga, Players feel that time invested in the game should be rewarded with increased power. Someone playing hours every day and raiding 7 days a week should be rewarded with better items than someone who logs in once a week. They consider this fair.

Note that "fair" means "the advantage I can make use of", and since most wow players would rather play more than to multibox they consider multiboxing to be unfair.

If you invest time and money into playing wow many people will already think of you as a hardcore gamer. If you have the hardware, software, dedication, time and number of wow-accounts to multibox then you are a hardcore gamer. You can use other terms if you like, but casual gamer would be very misleading.

MiRai, Sure, he probably has his reasons. It doesnt really matter if he personally likes multiboxing or if he is multiboxing himself, he has said its a problem in the game.

I think there are enough multiboxers around for many players to have formed an opinion about us, and players do notice multiboxers. Certainly seems to be a lot of activity on the official forums about boxing and there has also been several official (blue) posts about multiboxing.
It started out as a rare thing and now its becoming increasingly more common.

[rfarris]

Put you're missing the point. They didn't get rid of /follow because of the multiboxers. They got rid of /follow because of the bots. The quotes mentioned above happened in response to the boxers complaining about losing /follow.

[ebony]

Put you're missing the point. They didn't get rid of /follow because of the multiboxers. They got rid of /follow because of the bots. The quotes mentioned above happened in response to the boxers complaining about losing /follow.

ya and that's why they added follow back into arena.

Saying that If you find a way round follow in bg's using ITW/Ctm or just ctm. Then you get temp/full banned, so it is aimed at us now..

[Pycno]

The thing is Activision-Blizzards hands are much more tied than players realize, they actually cant do what they want. For instance they can not stop boting and cheating, even if they attempt to. As long as the players want to buy gold there is nothing the developers can do without losing revenue. Massive bans on everyone who buy gold would solve the problem for good, but the developers would lose their jobs so they can not do this.

As for multiboxing, its never been (officially) supported and is not a core game feature, it can easily be removed by taking away some core functions of the game. For example, imagine minimizing the game would instantly log you out in order to prevent AFK and alt-tabbers in battlegrounds. Multiboxing would then only be possible with one computer and monitor each toon. Ouch.
And next step, follow gives you debuff that instantly kills you if you receive damage, and decreases your damage dealt by 90%.

Its easy for them to break multiboxing, and they just did it with multiboxing in Battlegrounds. It never happend before so it was not a likely scenario, now it can happen at anytime. Buy a new $10k computer and accounts, level them up and wake up the next day only to discover Innerspace and ISBoxer got your accounts banned.


Now that people have stopped complaining about multiboxers in battlegrounds, expect complaints about them in Arena, World PvP and dungeons. Players may find it unfair that some can "solo" content they need to collect a group to do, and that this is an unfair advantage that saves multiboxers the time and trouble of dealing with random groups.

The mentality many players have is that if they worked hard for something, then everyone else should have to work at least just as hard to achieve the same thing.

And also, most players realize that multiboxing is in no way overpowered, they just find it annoying and frustrating. Annoying to lose because your teams multiboxers is not carrying his own weight and frustrating to get one-shotted even if their 2-3 friends mop the floor with the multiboxer afterwards.
This is why multiboxers currently are not welcome in battlegrounds.
Imagine you are playing paintball, everyone has a standard cheap paintball gun and you have a fully automatic 10,000 dollar super sniper machine gun - its unsocial and the players might find it in everyones best interest to say "hey, you are welcome to play with us but please leave that supergun at home so we can all have fun".

I was considering returning to WoW and now I probably never will, unless Activision-Blizzard apologizes and somehow can assure multiboxers that they will not be shafted again later on.

Im surprised at how much I care about this, I guess really wanted to play Cataclysm and MoP this winter, anyway Im glad I quit when I did. There are many fun games out there and games arent really that much fun anyway.

[Pycno]

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7788408896#1
Wrote my thoughts on the forum, it will probably get ignored :P

[MiRai]

As for multiboxing, its never been (officially) supported and is not a core game feature, it can easily be removed by taking away some core functions of the game. For example, imagine minimizing the game would instantly log you out in order to prevent AFK and alt-tabbers in battlegrounds. Multiboxing would then only be possible with one computer and monitor each toon. Ouch.
The game does not accept any input when it's minimized to the task bar and nobody has ever multiboxed like that.


Its easy for them to break multiboxing, and they just did it with multiboxing in Battlegrounds. It never happend before so it was not a likely scenario, now it can happen at anytime. Buy a new $10k computer and accounts, level them up and wake up the next day only to discover Innerspace and ISBoxer got your accounts banned.
Nobody got their accounts banned unless they were circumventing something that was purposefully removed from the game. If multiboxing was to be completely disallowed at one point in time, I'm sure Blizzard would let everyone know ahead of time because they're well aware how many people enjoy everyday multiboxing outside of griefing other players.


And also, most players realize that multiboxing is in no way overpowered, they just find it annoying and frustrating. Annoying to lose because your teams multiboxers is not carrying his own weight and frustrating to get one-shotted even if their 2-3 friends mop the floor with the multiboxer afterwards.
This is why multiboxers currently are not welcome in battlegrounds.
Imagine you are playing paintball, everyone has a standard cheap paintball gun and you have a fully automatic 10,000 dollar super sniper machine gun - its unsocial and the players might find it in everyones best interest to say "hey, you are welcome to play with us but please leave that supergun at home so we can all have fun".
You, yourself, said that you've been gone since the beginning of Cataclysm and I think you're underestimating how effective multiboxing in PvP is these days. You left during an era when multiboxing in battlegrounds reigned supreme, but since then, it's effectiveness has been cut in half thanks to resilience, bloated stats, ridiculous CC, and whatever other little changes Blizzard made.

That's why I found it amusing that you called multiboxers "hardcore". In one sense, they are hardcore for spending extra money on their computers and taking the time to set everything up so that they can do what they wan to do (which is, multibox); but in another sense it also means skill, which is the way that I think of hardcore when associated with gaming, and most multiboxers weren't very good beyond killing one person and then ending up being rendered useless while they're stuck in CC or being kited around while the rest of their team bitches about it. After WotLK, multiboxers had to stop using the mindless comma-based timing macros and had to start using their cooldowns and their class CC. This new level of 'difficulty' that had been introduced turned a lot of people off to the the playstyle and only the hardcore multiboxers stuck around and pushed through -- The ones that were either good from the beginning or the ones that wanted to try hard and improve upon their weaknesses.


Im surprised at how much I care about this, I guess really wanted to play Cataclysm and MoP this winter, anyway Im glad I quit when I did. There are many fun games out there and games arent really that much fun anyway.
You're obviously not alone and there was a huge mega-thread (http://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/49047-Follow-In-Battlegrounds-Broken-After-5-2) on the matter, but many people have moved to other games

[rfarris]

Saying that If you find a way round follow in bg's using ITW/Ctm or just ctm. Then you get temp/full banned...

You gotta source for that claim? Because that's exactly how boxers are doing BGs now. Who has been banned?

[Pycno]

MiRai, I meant if the instances of wow are inactive or in the background, since only one window can be active at any time.

This action by Activision-Blizzard creates precedence. They did something that had never happened before, now its hard to tell if an option is off the table or not. They probably wont ban you but who knows what they could come up with tomorrow?

The hardcore label is deserved, and I mean as in taking the game seriously. I think most multiboxers should re-think what they are doing with their lives, if they are really not overdoing it and investing too much time and effort into a game. Not because multiboxing is sad, I think its really cool, but all things with moderation.

I feel for you though, its really cheap for them to support multiboxing for all these years and suddently overnight change their minds.

[ebony]

You gotta source for that claim? Because that's exactly how boxers are doing BGs now. Who has been banned?

me...........

full ban at email level sc2/d3 7 wow accounts can not log in even to battle.net can not do anything was a few days after my video i made
942[



or though i have started wiring to blizzard eu as email was getting me nowhere just we stick by the ban.

some of the cs's i talked to says its coming back but they need to make smaller (10+ was to many for bg's) some say its not but they all say i should not be banned for what i was doing. so my accounts are temp banned as there still working out what to do


to be fair last time i just said "keep it stops me spending anymore silly money on your silly game i have a life now."


and yet there is players out there still using ofollow!

[Kruschpakx4]

It started out as a rare thing and now its becoming increasingly more common.


really? I've got the feeling that our numbers dropped massively since cataclysm and tbh I dont see where multiboxers are a "problem" nowdays, we could be considered as a problem in bc and cata when multiboxers made it in the top 0,5% of an arena bracket but nowdays wer're just doing little more than nonrated bgs and arena/rbg sub 2k rating and I dont believe that our numbers are increasing since mop.

I dont think that it was really in their intention to "nerf" us in battlegrounds by removing follow but if they think that it helps in the war against bots then well ... they've always said multiboxing is not beeing supported and now they activated follow in arenas again that means they're somehow supporting us as long as bots dont benefit from it

[ebony]

really? I've got the feeling that our numbers dropped massively since cataclysm and tbh I dont see where multiboxers are a "problem" nowdays, we could be considered as a problem in bc and cata when multiboxers made it in the top 0,5% of an arena bracket but nowdays wer're just doing little more than nonrated bgs and arena/rbg sub 2k rating and I dont believe that our numbers are increasing since mop.

I dont think that it was really in their intention to "nerf" us in battlegrounds by removing follow but if they think that it helps in the war against bots then well ... they've always said multiboxing is not beeing supported and now they activated follow in arenas again that means they're somehow supporting us as long as bots dont benefit from it


this is all true but in random game play on the big boxers 10+ it was unstoppable in random play. so ya they not done it to "nerf" or have plans to stop in anywhere else in the game you find they are happy without us in random play bg's and my ban was for "unfair play in random game play"

maybe if the new RBG works when you can que in groups of 5 comes in it might make boxing more fun for the ones that liked pvp. and they bring follow back for rbg's

[Kruschpakx4]

but still they didnt say your not allowed to multibox in bgs, i did an eye of storm just with interact and after a fight i mounted on chopper and mounted two toons into two choopers and then switched bettwen the two drivers to get to the next zerg, I guess thats a lot harder for a 10 boxer to do but at least for quad boxer I dont see where the follow remove was just little more than an annoyance, yet I could still win the bg easily

it was more like a bad solution to harden our live so we're supposed to do more than spam damage buttons for a win x)

[ebony]

but still they didnt say your not allowed to multibox in bgs, i did an eye of storm just with interact and after a fight i mounted on chopper and mounted two toons into two choopers and then switched bettwen the two drivers to get to the next zerg, I guess thats a lot harder for a 10 boxer to do but at least for quad boxer I dont see where the follow remove was just little more than an annoyance, yet I could still win the bg easily

it was more like a bad solution to harden our live so we're supposed to do more than spam damage buttons for a win x)

this is the point am getting at blizzard using tools that's in the game not cheating no hacks or anything just full itw/ctm and even only 3 just i can not get in a building very well hell i would even get http://www.wowhead.com/item=38050 but other players said they got temp banned for this as well.

[Blubber]

[...]
I had a team of 4 mages and 1 priest, I enjoyed doing battlegrounds, world pvp, low level instances and raids.

I also enjoyed collecting vanity items, and also collecting heirloom items to make imba alts. My highest rating in arena 5v5 was 1600, I didnt spend much time on it.


Sounds like BGs was a pretty small part of your overall activities, apart from the /follow nerf in BGs the whole game has gotten better for boxers. At least in my opinion, although I enjoyed cata more then mop, I still have a lot of fun boxing.

It sucks that follow got nerfed in BGs, but there is plenty of other stuff to do in game.

[candlebox]

I warned you guys but no one listened to me.

http://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/47473-Taking-the-heat

Where are all those people now?

They ran my ass under a bridge and made me look like an idiot. Hope you enjoyed your "They are the dbags not me im fine." theory. It was wrong. Now you all are on rift, and i am still boxing wow.

Get some.

[thefunk]

I warned you guys but no one listened to me.

http://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/47473-Taking-the-heat

Where are all those people now?

They ran my ass under a bridge and made me look like an idiot. Hope you enjoyed your "They are the dbags not me im fine." theory. It was wrong. Now you all are on rift, and i am still boxing wow.

Get some.

Welcome to politics, where right and wrong are irrelevant. you can take solace that your original post may not have have much impact even if everyone agreed with you as there are a few MB's that don't frequent these forums that act like brain farts. For what it's worth, I do agree with you in principle - people sometimes forget we live in a civilised society and this takes effort for people to live together. The "it doesn't affect me because I'm independent/isolated/special" argument doesn't work on the principle it is self-centered and therefore anti-society (from the viewpoint of changing behaviours). Maybe you got shot down as you made an assumption everyone felt part of a community, when some people MB for exactly the reason NOT to belong :)

[Fat Tire]

I warned you guys but no one listened to me.

http://www.dual-boxing.com/threads/47473-Taking-the-heat

Where are all those people now?

They ran my ass under a bridge and made me look like an idiot. Hope you enjoyed your "They are the dbags not me im fine." theory. It was wrong. Now you all are on rift, and i am still boxing wow.

Get some.

I posted my thoughts in that thread too.

The game is in a better place now with all the AV heroes gone.

[candlebox]

To many bots to farm honor anyways. If Russia keeps from nuking us back to the stoneage and the stockmarket stays bloated like a fat pig, I think I might move to some single crap till a better game comes out.

[MadMilitia]

It sucks that follow got nerfed in BGs, but there is plenty of other stuff to do in game.

yeah....

I wish I could agree with that.

The 5 mans in MoP sucked bad. Zero challenge. There were oodles of ground collect quests that only counted against the collector when I did 5 box. I despised questing MoP because of that. Gathering is boring. Tradeskilling is boring. Flipping the AH is boring.

I do agree as crazy as it sounds Cataclysm was more fun than MoP. I didn't think I'd ever say that. I long for the days of WotLK or BC. Back at the height of Cataclysm all I ever did was 5 man the end time runs. Those were a lot of fun!


Sometimes I want to come back just to do arena but you can only go so far in arena multiboxing. Yes, leveling/gearing up new characters is oddly the most fun thing to do but that's because the game is abysmal in every other department. Maybe challenge modes? I don't know.

[Pycno]

What I liked in WoW was PvP.

In TBC with flying mounts world pvp went downhill, it was still possible to pvp however around meeting stones and places like azjol nerub / old kingdom. Not to mention gurubashi arena which was always fun.

Now with random raids there is no need to use meeting stones or at any point in time leave sanctuary zones where you can not be attacked.

Without battlegrounds there really is no reason for me to play the game. Get better items? And use them to do what?

Nah, I had a good time multiboxing in WoW but right now Im having more fun building a space rocket that will reach the moon :D