4 Boxing and story line

[Bloodcloud]

Hi,

I was doing some dualboxing for a while which works fine.
I remember there where class quests which you can only complete/do with your Companion out.

(recently got 2 more accounts and I am 4 boxing now)

If you 4box you always have a full group of 4 meaning no Companions allowed.

How do people level with that and do companion dependent quests ?

cheers

[Apps]

Three ways.

Option 1. Do them solo, "the hard way". Drop group, get companion. Drive The Struggle Bus.
Option 2. Level with 3-1 or 2-2 group make up. I.e. (1) toon isnt the same class. (The drawback here is that you have two storylines to do now.)
Option 3. Level two groups / teams at about the same pace, and interject to help one another. (the drawback here is obvious)

[maxcom]

I usually drop one toon out, then since I have to do the class quest 4 times anyway I summon one companion at a time (of the toon whos instance im currently in). Then when all 3 are done, i drop one and bring in the one i dropped initially. Hope that helps.

[mmmbox]

Hi,

I 4 box ToR, and you do not need to drop any char during class quest, once you "zone" you can summon companion even if you are in a 4m group as long as one stay out.

This goes for distance as well, given enough distance you can summon companion.

EU ToR boxer x4

[Bloodcloud]

Hi,

I 4 box ToR, and you do not need to drop any char during class quest, once you "zone" you can summon companion even if you are in a 4m group as long as one stay out.

This goes for distance as well, given enough distance you can summon companion.

EU ToR boxer x4
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What he said!

Works nicely, as i figured out yesterday.

* Just enter the quest instance with the first (owner of the instance)
* enter with the other Toons -1
* summon pet of the instance owner
* do quest
* exit instance
* rinse and repeat with next Toon

[OldRod_KS]

Is there a way to force your follower to enter a zone with you? When 2-boxing, even if it's a group phase, when I enter, the other toon stops at the entrance, forcing me to switch chars and bring him in too.

I know I have to do each one twice for class quests, but on normal heroics and other group phases, it's a real pain.

I've also noticed the same problem where a zoneline *used* to be, like in quests where you have to deactivate a force field, the followers still stop where the force field used to be.

[Pyro_box]

My main character uses the WASD for movement, and these keys are not passed; my slave has the arrow keys passed through for movement, so when I come to an instance/flashpoint barrier I hit my arrow keys to get my slave to run in.\

I dont know of another way to accomplish this; WoW had the same issue, as they used phasing.

[Bloodcloud]

practical problem is that:
a) the camera's are not aligned on the slaves, so they move in all directions ...
b) with class quests, if it is the same class, they get a menu offering them to JOIN or CREATE a new area

[OldRod_KS]

Yeah, the camera problem is a pain - have any Bioware people mentioned if that will be fixed someday? Since it really only affects boxers, they probably marked it low priority, if they care at all.

[Lyonheart]

All these issue affecting us boxers in this game really make me appreciate how easy it is in WoW. Unless another boxable MMO comes out that is as customizable and easy to box as WoW.. I'm not sure any game will keep me long term. I'n WoW, I always felt like i was one toon with the power of 5. The control is so exact..smooth etc.. I miss that when i BOX other MMOs

[balrog78]

I agree that the camera and face alignment of slaves is a problem but other than that to level up in SWTOR with 4 accounts is very easy. I think its even easier than in WOW (of course there is no RAF). I am not much slower compared solo leveling. E.g. yesterday I made 3.5 levels in 6h (29-32.5). I think that this is ok.

[mmmbox]

leveling 5 box team in wow was tedious even with RAFsince all you wanted was to max level.

Atm i dont find it tedious at all i rather make a point of doing all quests plus bonus on each level before i leave and i enjoy it.

I am in no hurry to reach 50.

also once you get your keymaps set and understand how the classes you play works its really easy.

where in wow having range was the norm i am finding to have 3 melee as i do now with one range healer to be super fun and efficient due to how the melee skills works.

[Apps]

leveling 5 box team in wow was tedious even with RAFsince all you wanted was to max level.

Atm i dont find it tedious at all i rather make a point of doing all quests plus bonus on each level before i leave and i enjoy it.

I am in no hurry to reach 50.

also once you get your keymaps set and understand how the classes you play works its really easy.

where in wow having range was the norm i am finding to have 3 melee as i do now with one range healer to be super fun and efficient due to how the melee skills works.

^ +1

[balrog78]

The really bad parts are:

- travel to dromund kaas
- travel to nar shadaa
- travel to blah-blah-blah
- travel to all places you have visited before to waste a maximum amount of time

Whenever I come to these stupid parts I am considering cancelling my subscriptions. Its even worse when boxing. Its similar to wow shaman totem quest - but it happens regualary.

[Bloodcloud]

Since we are into QQ , I have a couple of points to add:

<QQ>
1: Camera positioning is crap (no possibility to reset camera to face the same way as your toon.)
2: Elevators are bad (since every toon needs to click on them (also because of 1: )
3: most moving platforms break follow to that extend that slaves won't go on them and you have to move them manually
4: phased zones break follow, and you have to move the toons manually nto the zone (not just class zones and group instances, but also zones which are unlocked, by a keypad or so)
5: no target of target view (this is fortunately possible with VideoFX)
6: no macros (needed, ischanneling, target dead, assist...)

</QQ>
:)

[mmmbox]

This is going to come off as a bit arrogant perhaps.

But I don’t know how to put it otherwise.

---With IS boxer, this game, in its current state is the easiest MMO to multibox that I am currently aware of---

my references are 5box wow, 7box eve, 3box eq1, 5box STO and with IS boxer even those games are "easy" to multibox.

Remember, you are a multiboxer the word EASY is relative, complaining that you actually have to once in a while DO SOMETHING on the other chars besides the main is hilarious, YOU ARE A MULTIBOXER, what do you expect :)

only time I know of that I have to switch to other chars is

1 to x zone lines
2 to pick up individually dropped quest items
3 to click on lore objects (if you care about them)

you do not need macros in this game to multibox IS boxer takes care of that need.

For all its similarities this is not wow, stop applying wow boxing thinking, you can pretty much box just as efficiently as you can in wow and in some areas like combat EVEN BETTER due to how their ability system works, it’s like having the old /click system back but without the need to track "clicks" :)

Read the posts, Mosg compendium and others, it’s all there and once you get the hang of how swtor works from a boxing perspective you will have a blast :)

If you don't like the game you don't like it but that has nothing to do with mboxing or not.

In old vanilla wow macro system you could actually have a macro with /do ability 1 then 2 then 3 etc and so forth and the macro would simply jump to the next ability if the 1st was on cool down, this got nerfed later on so macros would "lock" if the 1st ability was on cool down hence it would not proceed to ability 2.

This is the state of the SWTOR ability system now, only,,, you do not have the option of making macros as such in game...

This is the biggest flaw in the ability system currently, and there are 4 ways this will go.

1 leave it as it is and the game will be ruled by G15, naga, IS boxers :) etc.
2 revise the ability system
3 revise the ability system and introduce macros
4 adopt the STO (star trek online) way of controlling button mashing, it’s really smart where butting mashing actually sort of cancel abilities out, i.e. if you press an ability GCD activates and if you press another ability before GCD has run it will cancel the previously activated ability.

[Bloodcloud]

http://www.nukewebsolution.com/images/forum_post.jpg

[Lyonheart]

This is going to come off as a bit arrogant perhaps.

But I don’t know how to put it otherwise.

---With IS boxer, this game, in its current state is the easiest MMO to multibox that I am currently aware of---

my references are 5box wow, 7box eve, 3box eq1, 5box STO and with IS boxer even those games are "easy" to multibox.

Remember, you are a multiboxer the word EASY is relative, complaining that you actually have to once in a while DO SOMETHING on the other chars besides the main is hilarious, YOU ARE A MULTIBOXER, what do you expect :)

only time I know of that I have to switch to other chars is

1 to x zone lines
2 to pick up individually dropped quest items
3 to click on lore objects (if you care about them)

you do not need macros in this game to multibox IS boxer takes care of that need.

For all its similarities this is not wow, stop applying wow boxing thinking, you can pretty much box just as efficiently as you can in wow and in some areas like combat EVEN BETTER due to how their ability system works, it’s like having the old /click system back but without the need to track "clicks" :)

Read the posts, Mosg compendium and others, it’s all there and once you get the hang of how swtor works from a boxing perspective you will have a blast :)

If you don't like the game you don't like it but that has nothing to do with mboxing or not.

In old vanilla wow macro system you could actually have a macro with /do ability 1 then 2 then 3 etc and so forth and the macro would simply jump to the next ability if the 1st was on cool down, this got nerfed later on so macros would "lock" if the 1st ability was on cool down hence it would not proceed to ability 2.

This is the state of the SWTOR ability system now, only,,, you do not have the option of making macros as such in game...

This is the biggest flaw in the ability system currently, and there are 4 ways this will go.

1 leave it as it is and the game will be ruled by G15, naga, IS boxers :) etc.
2 revise the ability system
3 revise the ability system and introduce macros
4 adopt the STO (star trek online) way of controlling button mashing, it’s really smart where butting mashing actually sort of cancel abilities out, i.e. if you press an ability GCD activates and if you press another ability before GCD has run it will cancel the previously activated ability.

Ok.. well I'll list ONE thing about WoW that makes it easier than any other game ( not to mention everything else ) a little thing called IWT. You can get quests..loot quest items off mobs....stick on a guy when in melee ( with all your guys ) you can do all these things and more from your lead toon and never have to switch to your alts. That alone makes it easier than SWG.. not to mention..macros. ( castsequences, /clicks.bla bla bla.) To say SWtOR is easier is just plane &^%$!

Is SWtOR boxable? Yes! It is in no way easier.

[Pyro_box]

Is SWtOR boxable? Yes! It is in no way easier.

However; having a companion scream " I WILL BATHE IN YOUR BLOOD" makes all the little nuances worth it.

[mmmbox]

Ok.. well I'll list ONE thing about WoW that makes it easier than any other game ( not to mention everything else ) a little thing called IWT. You can get quests..loot quest items off mobs....stick on a guy when in melee ( with all your guys ) you can do all these things and more from your lead toon and never have to switch to your alts. That alone makes it easier than SWG.. not to mention..macros. ( castsequences, /clicks.bla bla bla.)

you kinda made my entire case with that, to box wow you need all that (macros etc) to box efficiantly, jamba, IWT etc and so on.

I 4 box swtor just as efficiant without all of it because of the way swtor is designed, mouse repeat region for join conversation and you basically set for questing and you have achived what in wow you need jamba/macros etc.

but when it comes down to boxing none of that matters, what matters is efficiancy in combat, again here due to the ability design of swtor to achive dreamlike efficiancy in swtor from a boxing perspecitve is hillarious.

you refere to the tools wow gives you to achive your boxing goals (/assist name /cast sequence) etc.

I already told you, stop placing wow thinking on swtor, ISboxer is your uber friend here also swtor doenst respond the same way as wow does to input commands like follow, assist etc

ill give you an example.

you make a mapped key in isboxer, we call it E, to that key we map the follwing functions

step 1 - target char - follow char (we tell the game to target and follow what ever char is my main atm, yes with is boxer i have full FLT)
step 2 - assist char - (remember from follow we already have our "main" targeted
step 3 - press buttons 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 (now this is what i mean by saying the way swtor handles this input is hillarious and because of ability design)

(what you need to understand here is that the game tries to fire of ability 1-8 (you need to set que time to zero as well), meaning 1st ability in the order 1-8 not on cooldown will be triggered, wow doesnt accept input like that, sto has an inbuild filter that prevents it, EQ doenst work that way etc and so on)

the language of wow has 1 000 000 words, swtor has 1000, but you say wow is easier because you have spoken it for 7 years ;)

(i have a melee team which is why i put follow in there)

you just place your combat abilites in the order you want them to fire of as long as they have cool downs and last you place the ability with out cool down.

By some weird coincidence the abilites in this game (dps) that doesnt have cool down or "cost" are the ones you want last in a prio order.

because of how swtor works and how the game responds to the input of these commands you get an EFFECT in game i never dreamed of as a multiboxer would be this easy to achive iwt doesnt even come close, your chars will dance with you where ever you go, never facing the wrong way and so on, do this ingame and you will understand what i mean.

IWT for questing, i will give you that, but again, swtor doesnt even come close to the teidiousness of wow's gather 10 - 20 of x crap :)

I am not saying you cannot achive similar results in any other game, but no way near this easy with this near perfect efficiancy (from a boxing perspecitve).

[IMTrick]

you kinda made my entire case with that, to box wow you need all that (macros etc) to box efficiantly, jamba, IWT etc and so on.


I really have to agree here. With ISBoxer it's just dirt-simple to multibox melee in TOR; far easier than I ever found it to be in WoW. My setup looks a lot like you described the only major difference being a follow command after the assist, and it just works. No macros, no add-ons... and honestly, there's not much I used macros for in WoW that I've found I really need.

I'm having a blast with it incidentally. But yeah, just wanted to throw my two cents in say this is probably about the most boxer-friendly game I've tried it on.

[Mercbeast]

you make a mapped key in isboxer, we call it E, to that key we map the follwing functions

step 1 - target char - follow char (we tell the game to target and follow what ever char is my main atm, yes with is boxer i have full FLT)
step 2 - assist char - (remember from follow we already have our "main" targeted
step 3 - press buttons 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 (now this is what i mean by saying the way swtor handles this input is hillarious and because of ability design)



Actually, step 3, wow works exactly the same way.

If I have ISboxer send 10 keys strokes all at once, the first input in the list is what WoW reads first. It is how I setup my DK DPS rotations and it worked 100% exactly the same way SWTOR currently does.

[Apatheist]

I agree with Merc. That's how I had my DK's set up, too.

SWTOR is not as easy to box as WoW was. It's not difficult by any means (though the setup is much more complicated). However, it doesn't have the ease of access that WoW has. IWT, addons like Jamba that automate quest dialogs, flight paths, etc. The SWTOR client is much less responsive than the WoW client, which makes click healing and target swapping (focus, target of target, etc) much more difficult. Lack of WoWs complex macro system is an obvious hinderance.

The thing SWTOR really has going for it is how low the player skill cap is. The game is much, much simpler to play well on a class level than WoW is. You have significantly fewer abilities to utilize, less complicated abilities, fewer cooldowns, vastly simpler rotations. An easier game means there's less difference between a boxed character and one that's being individually micromanaged.

I suppose it evens out. The game is easier but the client limitations make it less convenient.

[Mercbeast]

I agree with Merc. That's how I had my DK's set up, too.

SWTOR is not as easy to box as WoW was. It's not difficult by any means (though the setup is much more complicated). However, it doesn't have the ease of access that WoW has. IWT, addons like Jamba that automate quest dialogs, flight paths, etc. The SWTOR client is much less responsive than the WoW client, which makes click healing and target swapping (focus, target of target, etc) much more difficult. Lack of WoWs complex macro system is an obvious hinderance.

The thing SWTOR really has going for it is how low the player skill cap is. The game is much, much simpler to play well on a class level than WoW is. You have significantly fewer abilities to utilize, less complicated abilities, fewer cooldowns, vastly simpler rotations. An easier game means there's less difference between a boxed character and one that's being individually micromanaged.

I suppose it evens out. The game is easier but the client limitations make it less convenient.

This depends on the class you play.

Marauders/Sentinels require 30+ keybinds that they constantly use. Commandos/Mercs require like 3 for their DPS and only a few more that they will constantly use beyond that.

[Apatheist]

This depends on the class you play.

Marauders/Sentinels require 30+ keybinds that they constantly use. Commandos/Mercs require like 3 for their DPS and only a few more that they will constantly use beyond that.

The what? I'd be surprised if Sentinels even have 30 abilities if you combine all 3 talent trees and target hotkeys.

[Apps]

This depends on the class you play.

Marauders/Sentinels require 30+ keybinds that they constantly use. Commandos/Mercs require like 3 for their DPS and only a few more that they will constantly use beyond that.

Sorry, but that's just not right. I'm operating melee wars, and I definitely don't have that problem. And even if I had a ton of skills to use, I'd use ISBoxer to deliver dps rotations and other combo keybinds.

[Mercbeast]

Sorry, but that's just not right. I'm operating melee wars, and I definitely don't have that problem. And even if I had a ton of skills to use, I'd use ISBoxer to deliver dps rotations and other combo keybinds.

Actually it is right. Here is the proof. You can run rotations sure, but the vast majority are not running ISboxer. You can also tie everything together, that doesn't make it efficient. For your DPS rotation you will run 5 or 6 abilities together, the rest should be manually handled for optimal control and expenditure of rage. Even by macroing them together you are going to be extremely wasteful with rage. You don't need to drop a 5 point spender to do 5k on someone who has 500 hp left. Running a macro will do that.

Here is the list.

DPS

Smash *
Ravage *
Deadly Throw *
Sweeping Slash (focus/fury builder) *
Vicious Throw
Deadly Saber
Annhiliate
Battering Assault
Rupture
Vicious Slash
Force Scream *
Assault

Five of those should not be on a macro rotation, they are marked with an asterix. If you are playing well, you are using ALL of those abilities.

Utility Abilities

Force Charge
Predation
Berserk
Bloodthirst
Frenzy
Disruption
Crippling Slash
Unleash (CC break everyone has)
Force Choke

That is 9 abilities. None of those abilities should be linked. Frenzy can be linked to Bloodthirst, but it should be on seperate keybinds because Frenzy also needs to be free for Predation or Berserking on demand.

Defensive Cooldowns

Force Camoflage
Undying Rage
Cloak of Pain
Saber Ward
Obfuscate
Intimidating Roar

6 abilities. At most saber ward and cloak of pain can be linked. The rest no.

Universal items.
2x Relics
1x Adrenal
1x Health kit

4 more abilities. You should actually be running 5 hotkeys for this. One hotkey that is tied to Frenzy/Bloodthirst and all of your cooldowns, and then each cooldown independent of each other so you don't waste cool downs in situations you don't need to. Blowing a power adrenal to finish someone in a close fight is a better choice than blowing a relic and a power adrenal when you don't need to.

Total number of abilities/items that have to be used constantly, 31.

By running macro's this can be condensed to about 23 keybinds without getting extremely lazy and actually killing your overall effectiveness. Also, for non-boxing people not running a macro program, it is 30+ keybinds if they want to play an annihilation marauder at level 50.

[Lyonheart]

Actually it is right. Here is the proof. You can run rotations sure, but the vast majority are not running ISboxer. You can also tie everything together, that doesn't make it efficient. For your DPS rotation you will run 5 or 6 abilities together, the rest should be manually handled for optimal control and expenditure of rage. Even by macroing them together you are going to be extremely wasteful with rage. You don't need to drop a 5 point spender to do 5k on someone who has 500 hp left. Running a macro will do that.

Here is the list.

DPS

Smash *
Ravage *
Deadly Throw *
Sweeping Slash (focus/fury builder) *
Vicious Throw
Deadly Saber
Annhiliate
Battering Assault
Rupture
Vicious Slash
Force Scream *
Assault

Five of those should not be on a macro rotation, they are marked with an asterix. If you are playing well, you are using ALL of those abilities.

Utility Abilities

Force Charge
Predation
Berserk
Bloodthirst
Frenzy
Disruption
Crippling Slash
Unleash (CC break everyone has)
Force Choke

That is 9 abilities. None of those abilities should be linked. Frenzy can be linked to Bloodthirst, but it should be on seperate keybinds because Frenzy also needs to be free for Predation or Berserking on demand.

Defensive Cooldowns

Force Camoflage
Undying Rage
Cloak of Pain
Saber Ward
Obfuscate
Intimidating Roar

6 abilities. At most saber ward and cloak of pain can be linked. The rest no.

Universal items.
2x Relics
1x Adrenal
1x Health kit

4 more abilities. You should actually be running 5 hotkeys for this. One hotkey that is tied to Frenzy/Bloodthirst and all of your cooldowns, and then each cooldown independent of each other so you don't waste cool downs in situations you don't need to. Blowing a power adrenal to finish someone in a close fight is a better choice than blowing a relic and a power adrenal when you don't need to.

Total number of abilities/items that have to be used constantly, 31.

By running macro's this can be condensed to about 23 keybinds without getting extremely lazy and actually killing your overall effectiveness. Also, for non-boxing people not running a macro program, it is 30+ keybinds if they want to play an annihilation marauder at level 50.

HOLY SHIT!!! that's a lot of keybinds! My SWs are only 15 atm.. i started my jug+3 sorcs and love them! but yea.. this game has way too many abilities and not enough hotbars!!

[Bloodcloud]

.. this game has way too many abilities and not enough hotbars!!

^^^^^^^^^^^ What he said

[Apps]

Definitely not contending the number of skills / attacks the melee group has... but we may be talking two different types of fruit here.

I think perhaps im doing something different. I simply dont use everything. Not every fight uses skills anywhere near that number... and 95% of the time, while boxing, I rarely get to use everything, simply because stuff dies before I can get to all the different skills. Perhaps in PVE there might be a boss somewhere, where a player would need to use every skill they have.. dunno. I do have Slam in a macro with other abilities.. and I do also have Ravage in yet another DPS Spam.

PVP is a whole another story of course.

The point I was pushing was the comment about ".. they constantly use." I was saying that I have never constantly used all skills. Of course the total number of skills is significant, as is for all other classes.

And perhaps its also a factor of MBing a group, doing missions, world PvP, a lot of PvE Heroics... and very little FlashPoints. Doing that, I definitely never use more than 3-5 dps macro keys, with about 5 skills in each ~ 15 skills. Stuff is dead well before I need more.

[cichard]

Definitely not contending the number of skills / attacks the melee group has... but we may be talking two different types of fruit here.

I think perhaps im doing something different. I simply dont use everything. Not every fight uses skills anywhere near that number... and 95% of the time, while boxing, I rarely get to use everything, simply because stuff dies before I can get to all the different skills. Perhaps in PVE there might be a boss somewhere, where a player would need to use every skill they have.. dunno. I do have Slam in a macro with other abilities.. and I do also have Ravage in yet another DPS Spam.

PVP is a whole another story of course.

The point I was pushing was the comment about ".. they constantly use." I was saying that I have never constantly used all skills. Of course the total number of skills is significant, as is for all other classes.

And perhaps its also a factor of MBing a group, doing missions, world PvP, a lot of PvE Heroics... and very little FlashPoints. Doing that, I definitely never use more than 3-5 dps macro keys, with about 5 skills in each ~ 15 skills. Stuff is dead well before I need more.
He has it right at level 50 in hardmodes boss fights you are going to want to use a proper rotation.

[MiRai]

He has it right at level 50 in hardmodes boss fights you are going to want to use a proper rotation.
A "proper rotation of skills" does not necessarily mean use every single skill you have available.

[cichard]

A "proper rotation of skills" does not necessarily mean use every single skill you have available.


no you are correct but what the guy listed includes those skills in a proper rotation.

[MiRai]

no you are correct but what the guy listed includes those skills in a proper rotation.
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