4x Melee Discussions

[Mosg2]

With Kromtor's success in 5's I'd like to take a minute and talk about the viability of other 4x melee setups that could potentially work. With that in mind, here's what I've got:

Paladins: With Kromtor breaking 2200 in 5's *by himself*, the viability of 4x Paladins is not debatable. I guess the question is if another 4x melee is as competitive or even more competitive than the Paladins are.
Pros: Lots of burst, great survivability
Cons: No snare, No MS effect

DKs: Personally I'm less inclined towards the DKs than the Paladins. Shrug.
Pros: Great sustained damage, better than average survivability, 4x Deathgrip + 8x Chains of Ice available
Cons: Burst potential is lower than other classes, no MS effect

Warriors: I've been kicking the idea of these guys around quite a bit. You're gaining MS at the cost of survivability compared to the other melee classes.
Pros: Good burst, MS effect, snare, Bladestorm, Charge+Intercept
Cons: Probably lowest survivability, no healing available

Rogues: I could see these guys going both ways. One one hand, you're basically guaranteed to be able to insta-gib whatever player you open on. Are the survival cooldowns you have good enough to mitigate the fact that once they're gone you're just a leather-wearing melee class?
Pros: Great burst, MS effect, best snare, great defensive/offensive cooldowns
Cons: Bad survivability once cooldowns gone, no healing available

I'm not really considering 4x Ferals or 4x Enhance shaman. Other specs for them I think are more competitive. So what does everyone think? I'm seriously debating boosting up 4x Warriors... Just the thought of getting Charge/Intercept humped up and down the field while you're perma snared and MS'd sounds hard to deal with. Rogues seem really interesting to me too due to the MS+Snare+Burst potential.

I would love to get this discussion going and get some feedback!

[Ellay]

I think a mix and match would work well.

1 DK / 1-2 Rets/ 1 War / 1 Feral Druid

With this combo you get all the DK buffs, Might buff / 10% AP / Group heal / 20% group haste. A Snare and a Deathgrip
Warrior provides MS / and Commanding Shout
2 Rets provide 2 blessings/judgments - pick whatever is crucial to you
Feral Druid gives you the crit bonus and heal + Mark.

With some nifty clickmacro's I'm sure there is a relatively decent macro to spam out for each character without too much focus, and if any 1 class gets a nerf it isn't as big of a deal - if this combo actually works it has the good long term viability instead of a flavor of the month style.

[David]

Paladins: With Kromtor breaking 2200 in 5's *by himself*, the viability of 4x Paladins is not debatable. I guess the question is if another 4x melee is as competitive or even more competitive than the Paladins are.
Pros: Lots of burst, great survivability
Cons: No snare, No MS effect
I did some pvp in av while leveling and I found out that 4x paladin alone are not good. People run away from me, tho my stun rotation din`t work for some reason.


DKs: Personally I'm less inclined towards the DKs than the Paladins. Shrug.
Pros: Great sustained damage, better than average survivability, 4x Deathgrip + 8x Chains of Ice available
Cons: Burst potential is lower than other classes, no MS effect
Last time I played DK chains of ice had a cooldown:)


I'm not really considering 4x Ferals or 4x Enhance shaman. Other specs for them I think are more competitive. So what does everyone think? I'm seriously debating boosting up 4x Warriors... Just the thought of getting Charge/Intercept humped up and down the field while you're perma snared and MS'd sounds hard to deal with. Rogues seem really interesting to me too due to the MS+Snare+Burst potential.
IMO these 2 setups will be way way better then warriors and rogues. I think many will agree with me that enhancement shamans would be a great setup.

[Multibocks]

I think any of those combinations you can gib one person, after that you need survivability to continue on and thats what I think rets bring (lots of passive healing). In that respect I wonder if enhance shamans could be awesome. Imagine gibbing one person and doing instant chain heal x 4! (or do heals not count for the instant cast?)

[Mosg2]

@Ellay:
I agree that a mixed set up, on paper, brings all of the necessary parts but I think that in actuality your efficiency is going to go through the floor. I don't think there's any way that you can effectively manage cooldowns on 3 or 4 classes while maintaining decent dps.

@David:
Yeah, it's been awhile since I've been on my DK :)
I wasn't trying to say that 4x Enhancement wouldn't be competitive, just that if you're already going to be doing Shaman you may as well be Elemental. I think it'd be easier to be competitive at higher levels with Elemental than Enhancement is all :)

[Multibocks]

Enhancement shaman can rip people a new one, I've been on the receiving end before lol. Plus you can all start out with ilvl 226 weaps! (Those mugs from the dire brew event.)

[Ellay]

I think DK's may warrant another shot at looking into. Their heyday was when auto interact didn't exist so the true potential was never shown.
They have a group heal ( or you can space it out) that totals 100% every 30 seconds.

Overall though Paladins look like the strongest, as playing them first hand I feel a huge difference in power. Than when I was leveling the DK's.

[Mosg2]

I'm assuming that you've got an independant healer for your trips into arena :) I'm just leery about the lack of MS with the DKs. It seems like the Paladins just have more small tricks than the other classes do.

4x Enhance does look awesome but... I'm trying to break new ground :)

[heyaz]

I'm surprised no one has really seemed to discuss 4x enhancement shaman. Yes they are definitely softer than ret paladins against melee, but not against magic, with grounding totems. You also carry over all the benefit that elemental shaman get with totems, plus a way to get out of root, and the ability to root people from 30 yards with Frost Shock. They are also not completely locked out of damage during a BoP. 8 pets with random stuns, 30% run speed increase and 30% reduced damage could be pretty brutal.

I think it would take a lot more gear vs ret paladins, but I still see it as having potential. I know the geared enhancement shamans I see on my server just tear people in half - nearly any class/spec.

Depending on the length of this season I may be able to get the 1800 weapons for enhancement and see how that goes. The other pieces of gear are easy to fill in

[Ualaa]

With click castsequences, you can macro in all of your dps moves and cooldowns.

However, you're not able to cast a cooldown on demand, at least not for a lot of classes at once.
Too many things happening.

So, we basically combine all of the buffs, focus fire on a single target etc.
And a strong PvE dps sequence.
But don't have the ability to click this ability in response to that move etc.
If you can dictate play, you can probably anticipate what will happen and have your macro's set for their responses.
If play is incredibly variable, the macro's become weaker.

[heyaz]

One fear I have in investing a lot into a melee team is that Interact with Target gets changed. One keybinding makes this all possible, what if they suddenly changed it to work on Interactive NPCs only? I have a feeling the key bind was not added to help keyboard turners in pvp.

[Mosg2]

So, my Paladins are 70 now and I'm debating starting another team of 4 somethings while they collect some rested experience. My Shaman're 69 and getting the same treatment. DK's are the most likely choice but I'm not sure if I have the patience to PvP-gear out multiple sets of toons and not go crazy.

I wonder if Kromtor has any comments on a melee team considering his experience :)

[Kromtor]

DK's could be great. I might make a team of them myself.

[Ogloo]

the rogue idea sounds just nasty.. i mean one rogue can ownn my guys, like just because they stun and sometimes when i play solo i can die before im out of stun in 1000 resil.. its liike wtf ;-0 lol.. i could see bursting instant own one, then use defensive CD, and just slow the crap out of whoever is getting killed so they cant run away or get heals because of posions.... just i dont really like the melee thing... i like my shammies ;0

[Ualaa]

With the rogues, you could burst one, hit preparation and burst another.
At that point, its 5 on 3, but you're out of cooldowns which means you're very vulnerable as a rogue.

If its 4 rogues and a healer, you might be in good shape 5 on 3, especially if the two you took our were DPS toons. With all poisons on all targets (Fan of Knives x4), you could be in decent shape.

I'm messing around with a macro for focus, but going Round Robin and FTL on it, via InnerSpace. So press 1 has Toon A set the current target to their Focus. Press 2 has Toon B set the current target to their Focus etc. Mine is for Cyclone to multiple targets at once, but this could work for melee targeting too... not sure how well though.

You could possibly go with a macro to target your focus, and then spam Interact along with an interrupt click sequence featuring Kick, something for combo points and then Kidney Shot... with two rogues on each healer.

Not really sure how viable this would be, but it could be fun.

[Void]

hard enough to vanish 1 rogue and get away id really like to see someone vanish 4-5 rogues and get away to reopen on another target

[Ellay]

I gotta say though, this has really invigorated my interest in WoW and it's all about having fun. Sorry to disappoint any by not playing my Shamans more and going for gold. After 4-5 Seasons of pure Ele Shamans ( I barely play alts) it's the same old thing.
This is new and quite ironic more relaxing.

[Fat Tire]

Pickering around with melee more and more here myself. I have been theorycrafting about a number of different combos.

[Mosg2]

I agree Ellay. I'm looking for something new and fun and I think melee are a largely unexplored area.

We know that Paladins work. What else is the question.

I think DK's, Enhance Shaman, and Rogues are going to be the most likely prospects. Warriors and Feral Druids are just going to get CC'd and destroyed.

Thoughts?

[Fat Tire]

I agree Ellay. I'm looking for something new and fun and I think melee are a largely unexplored area.

We know that Paladins work. What else is the question.

I think DK's, Enhance Shaman, and Rogues are going to be the most likely prospects. Warriors and Feral Druids are just going to get CC'd and destroyed.

Thoughts?


I dont know, I think feral have their place, they have passive group healing and +5% crit for group with I Lotp and they get talents that allow immune to fear for 15 sec. They cant be poly'd. and atm they do insane dmg. They get a snare off their main attack and get an interupt thru maim.

Managing shifts would be the hard part maybe or macroing in general, of course I have no proof of them being viable. I am just spit-balling here. ;p

[David]

I agree that some mixed setups would work and in the long run some people might learn how to do it without to much automation by macro`s. Tho that road will not be easy.

Good macro`s are the shit anyway. I don`t know much about deminishing returns or whatever they are called but with the right macro`s rogues can do good things stunwise.

Btw just a bit off topic. When you guys use interact with target I assueme you also check Click-to-move?

And another bit offtopic lol. Someone please explain what this strobing does for a melee team? I know my jamba has it but what does it do?

[Mosg2]

Hmmm, maybe Druids *would* be the best then? No fears or Polys or roots or snares means you can save your trinket for uh... Cyclone? Blind? Stuns?

They get base run speed too, which is nice.

More thoughts? :)

[Multibocks]

I agree that some mixed setups would work and in the long run some people might learn how to do it without to much automation by macro`s. Tho that road will not be easy.

Good macro`s are the shit anyway. I don`t know much about deminishing returns or whatever they are called but with the right macro`s rogues can do good things stunwise.

Btw just a bit off topic. When you guys use interact with target I assueme you also check Click-to-move?

And another bit offtopic lol. Someone please explain what this strobing does for a melee team? I know my jamba has it but what does it do?

yes click to move is the only way to make interact with target work.

[Kromtor]

Hmmm, maybe Druids *would* be the best then? No fears or Polys or roots or snares means you can save your trinket for uh... Cyclone? Blind? Stuns?

They get base run speed too, which is nice.

More thoughts? :)

druids have no way out of fear afaik

[Fat Tire]

druids have no way out of fear afaik

Berserk-51pt Talent

Instant 3 min cooldown When activated, this ability causes your Mangle (Bear) ability to hit up to 3 targets and have no cooldown, and reduces the energy cost of all your Cat Form abilities by 50%. Lasts 15 sec. You cannot use Tiger's Fury while Berserk is active.

Clears the effect of Fear and makes you immune to Fear for the duration.(15 secs)

[Kromtor]

hmm yes that would be interesting. i just dont know enough about geared feral druids and what they can do as far as burst. i know with the instant big ass heals or instant cyclones you can really do some tricky, tricky stuff.

you're really going to be eating up your globals shapeshifting against a good mage though i think.

[heyaz]

hmm yes that would be interesting. i just dont know enough about geared feral druids and what they can do as far as burst.

Their burst is absurd, and it hits multiple targets at once. They rip my priest in half twice as fast as a rogue. If we see a feral they are the #1 target in both 3v3 and in 5s even if there is an ele shaman.

[Ualaa]

I wouldn't expect an all feral druid team to excel.
However a feral druid in cat form wouldn't be terribly hard to macro.
And that adds a few buffs to your team as well as the heal on melee crit.
And you can stealth for a bit of surprise off of the open.

Then again, the more classes we add, the harder it is to be optimal.
A BG or PvE all melee team could work quite well.
But when going against live opposition in the arena, simpler is likely stronger.

Still a team with an Enhancement Shammy, Cat Druid and three more melee could work.
Not sure how far you'd get, but then prior to Kromtor trying Pallies, pallies were theoretical as well.

[Fat Tire]

I wouldn't expect an all feral druid team to excel.
However a feral druid in cat form wouldn't be terribly hard to macro.
And that adds a few buffs to your team as well as the heal on melee crit.
And you can stealth for a bit of surprise off of the open.

Then again, the more classes we add, the harder it is to be optimal.
A BG or PvE all melee team could work quite well.
But when going against live opposition in the arena, simpler is likely stronger.

Still a team with an Enhancement Shammy, Cat Druid and three more melee could work.
Not sure how far you'd get, but then prior to Kromtor trying Pallies, pallies were theoretical as well.


I dont think ILotP stacks(confirm?) so a full feral team wouldnt be that great. SS out to heal would suck.

I think you could make it a 5vs4 real quick but I dont have any idea after that. Pounce>SP>Shred or skip SP if that would 1 shot.

Thing that sucks about using enhancement + Dks in a melee team is that Unleashed Rage and Abomination's Might dont stack. I guess you dont have to spec AB if your using a EH shaman though. /shrug

[Mosg2]

I think any 4x Melee should be able to make it 5v4 with your opening salvo. The question is which class(es) are going to be able to win the 5v4?

Ualaa, I'm not sure why you don't think Druids would work. If their burst is the same as a Paladin's or a DK's, and they have 15 seconds of Fear immunity plus static immunity to snares, roots, and polymorphs... I think they'd be really really strong. The biggest problem would be the lack of survivability.

I'm just not into a mixed team. Yes, on paper it makes more sense but the more classes you add the less optimal performance you get out of each class.

So, Druids, DKs, and Enhance Shaman are at the top of my list so far. Hmmmmm.

[Ualaa]

Well cats have mobile stealth, like a rogue but not quite as good.
They can open with Stun just like a rogue.
Once they've opened, they don't have anything like Vanish to regain stealth.
And they don't have Preparation to refresh all of their cooldowns.

You should have a pretty good chance to outright take one thing out, with either five rogues or five cats.
With Leader of the Pack, you'll be getting some small amount of healing on criticals.
But you cannot get a heal from a crit more often then every few seconds.
So multiple druids is no bonus here, over a single druid.
As far as buffs go, one druid gets the whole group as many as five druids does as well.

I do like their burst, but they have no protection against casters while in cat form.
And if you're a feral druid, you can shift a few times but its a mana drain so you'll not want to rely on shifts. And when you're not in cat/bear form, a ton of your power is gone.
In BG's, cats die fast and easily (and are dangerous), but when they become bears they're not much threat... much harder to kill, but very low dps too.
They do have stuns, but a rogue has more.
I don't see a 5x rogue team as being the best, but I could be wrong.
I'd imagine 5x feral cats would have some bite, pardon the pun, but do not see them as a top team.

I could see a feral cat on a mixed team, with a PvE click style macro, so they provide the team with buffs and procs, while putting out sustained dps, which could include the odd stun.
But with a mixed team, the fewer things to manage the better.
You could go with the I-WIN button, which is Berserk on the cat, Heroism/Bloodlust on the shaman and whatever on the others. I really like the idea of a cat on a team, and enhancement makes melee so much stronger in PvE raids, but its harder to run multiple types at once, especially in arena.
I might be very wrong; I wouldn't have picked 5x Paladins as a strong team, even though 1x Paladin has a lot of strengths.

[Iceorbz]

I would think 4 rogues + 1 druid would rape pretty hard, considering the rogues would make it 5 vs. 4 and then the druid can cc one person so its really 4 vs. 3

[yaki]

By that same argument, two druids could cc two people, making it 5 vs. 2, and so forth. Assuming it goes to plan.

[asonimie]

Guys - PTRs are up, go test this shit out like I'm doing.

[Mosg2]

Ualaa I guess we're on different wavelengths. I'm assuming you're doing a 4x Melee with a dedicated healer partner.

[Fat Tire]

Guys - PTRs are up, go test this shit out like I'm doing.

What melee are you testing out?

[asonimie]

pallies obviously, and I tried warriors so far. I was surprisingly unimpressed with wars, I'll give them another chance, but my roommate and I did some testing against his premade DK, and 4x bladestorms took him to ~15-20%.... grrr.... Single target dmg might be better, but bladestorm is the main thing they bring to the table and I was disappointed.

[Fat Tire]

pallies obviously, and I tried warriors so far. I was surprisingly unimpressed with wars, I'll give them another chance, but my roommate and I did some testing against his premade DK, and 4x bladestorms took him to ~15-20%.... grrr.... Single target dmg might be better, but bladestorm is the main thing they bring to the table and I was disappointed.

If it was obvious, I wouldn't have asked. I am trying out feral myself.

[asonimie]

If it was obvious, I wouldn't have asked. I am trying out feral myself.

obvious wasn't in reference to you, but the fact that everyone is toying with them somehow.

[Fat Tire]

obvious wasn't in reference to you, but the fact that everyone is toying with them somehow.

Oh, my apologies then.

What did you think of the paladins?

[asonimie]

They are great and rather easy to play compared with warlocks shamans who have 15 spells to worry about. Facerolling ftw. Hard to tell in BGs cause I've always got 12 people dpsing my main pally down so fast, but they do great dps. Gonna try to do some PTR 5v5s today and see if we can practice a bit.

I think I'll make a rogue team and start testing the ability to stealth > 1shot someone.

Edit: the nice thing about the PTRs - everyone is full 1100 resilience geared, so you don't accidently get a false sense of security by 1 shotting scrubs on live realms.

[Ellay]

Opinion on 4-5 DK's with any spec as well. Interested to hear how they do with full gear.

[asonimie]

Ok I might do that for my 4th team.

[Ellay]

alright 4 Enhancement Shamans, reviewing it with Mythaniel and it seems like it would work out well, the only issue is possibly not enough passive healing. I think not having a Judgement of Light might do it in. Anyone else think their healing is enough? The wolves do passive healing for 45 seconds while they are out, your burst is insane, you have added protection from the grounding totems. Multiple fear breaks, some instant to close to instant healing via Maelstrom weapon. Shamanistic rage provides 30% reduced damage...

With the 10% ap you gain, you can grab Hungering Cold for the main DK for another aoe cc.
Throwing down Earthbinds is group freedom everytime you drop one and the snares from Frostshock is huge, if they are 15 yards or more away it's a 5 second root.

[Ellay]

Someone try 4 Enhance Shammies!

The wolves will be able to lock down a target with the stun as well. I'd guess you can try 1-2 targets within the time frame that they are up, Constant purge will drop the BoP's so no need for target switching, the only lacking part the combo has is possible not enough passive and active healing to keep yourself up.

[asonimie]

I would still run 4x enhancement with a healer, and ya it does sound really really stupid good. I'm out of character premades on PTR tho /cry.

[Mosg2]

Downloading now. I've copied over Druids. Once I've tried them I'll give the DK's a shot.

[Fat Tire]

Someone try 4 Enhance Shammies!

The wolves will be able to lock down a target with the stun as well. I'd guess you can try 1-2 targets within the time frame that they are up, Constant purge will drop the BoP's so no need for target switching, the only lacking part the combo has is possible not enough passive and active healing to keep yourself up.

You can look at it this way, if you dont win by the time BL/wolves go down you are going to lose. ;p

[Void]

I really wanna pick up a set of weapons next week since im still above 1800 and enhance just sounds awesome. Question is would it be 2k+ rating worthy. Guess it will give me somthing to do with my honor besides gems

[asonimie]

Ok I'm playing 4 rogues/druid healer and its amazing. 2 shotting plate dps and below on the opener. we healer and I are headed to IF to kill some nubs and I'll be frapsing :)

[Multibocks]

lol? Wow cant believe someone has put this much effort into rogues =)

[Mosg2]

Yeah, Rogues seem like they'd be a lot of fun :) Let's see the videos!

[Ualaa]

Pretty much we have 4x Shaman as a combo proven by several of us, over a lot of seasons.
Since Interact with Target came out, melee is an option.
We know 5x Paladins can work.
But other melee options are untested, at least so far.
It will be interesting to see what others can succeed with.

[Multibocks]

actually its 4x paladin and 1 dk. Im not sure 5 paladin would work just because you have no way to pull kiters in to your melee spam nor the ability to chain snare people.

[suprafro]

Have you any of you guys with melee teams tried the old BC battlemaster enchant? Probably not worth using over berserking in arenas, but seems pretty decent for BGs and PVE (each proc is a 180-300 party heal, can crit also)...seems like 4-5 of them would be pretty cool for a boxer, also its cheap mats wise ;)

[Trons]

How do you deal with procs like maelstromx5 or art of war where some of the toons might have it and others don't and you want to only cast it if its an instant cast? I know a /stopcasting underneath a /cast will prevent any timed cast from going off but on the other hand it also resets melee swing timer.
If the melee swing timer resets that means if its spammed no white damage will ever land right? not totally clear on that

[Multibocks]

I didnt know that, maybe some testing is in order.

[boxblizzard]

pallies obviously, and I tried warriors so far. I was surprisingly unimpressed with wars, I'll give them another chance, but my roommate and I did some testing against his premade DK, and 4x bladestorms took him to ~15-20%.... grrr.... Single target dmg might be better, but bladestorm is the main thing they bring to the table and I was disappointed.


thanks for the heads up, i be ditching this 5 im doing then :mad:

[Mamut]

Seeing all the buzz about pallies and rogues, got me thinking about druids. They have a built in snare but no MS effect and i think getting behind people for shred would be tough. I somehow doubt mangle spam would be enough.

I wish druids had a mutilate rip off instead of the reliance on back positioning for shred.

With a fast start making it 5v4 then proper macro for cyclone they might work, but its looking like pallies/rogues are easier to face roll.

Just some early morning musing while i wait for my stuff to copy stuff to the PTR :P

[asonimie]

Seeing all the buzz about pallies and rogues, got me thinking about druids. They have a built in snare but no MS effect and i think getting behind people for shred would be tough. I somehow doubt mangle spam would be enough.

I wish druids had a mutilate rip off instead of the reliance on back positioning for shred.

With a fast start making it 5v4 then proper macro for cyclone they might work, but its looking like pallies/rogues are easier to face roll.

Just some early morning musing while i wait for my stuff to copy stuff to the PTR :P

PTR!!! I'm off today boostin my rogeez.

[Mosg2]

I returned some equipment and tried some other stuff out and settled on my keyboard and mouse and I've got to tell you that things worked out *much* better with my guys as I got more and more familiar with my keybinds. I was raping face in BG's last night like I never had before.

Pro tip: Just use a /click macro for DPS with the Rets. It's just plain going to be more efficient than you can be. I saw immediate results. Plus it opened up tons of keybinds for other things that I needed. I think I may fraps some BG stuff but it's AV weekend and there aren't a lot of great opportunities in AV for good footage. It's usually a faceroll either way :)

[asonimie]

I returned some equipment and tried some other stuff out and settled on my keyboard and mouse and I've got to tell you that things worked out *much* better with my guys as I got more and more familiar with my keybinds. I was raping face in BG's last night like I never had before.

Pro tip: Just use a /click macro for DPS with the Rets. It's just plain going to be more efficient than you can be. I saw immediate results. Plus it opened up tons of keybinds for other things that I needed. I think I may fraps some BG stuff but it's AV weekend and there aren't a lot of great opportunities in AV for good footage. It's usually a faceroll either way :)

What's your spell priority with that click macro?

[Mosg2]

Ack, I meant to post that in my Ret thread but oh well :)

Judgement, Divine Storm, Crusader Strike, Exorcism, Hammer. I also have Hammer bound to another key that I can hit easily so that I can force it to go off. I haven't had it mess with the sequence if I do that yet, so I think I'm safe.

[Gares]

The only problem I see with that sequence is what if Art of War doesn't proc? Your /click will get stuck on Exorcism because of it.

I run a lone ret pally solo so I know about all this and I'm rocking decent gear with around a 1500 rating so I am in decent pvp gear and I know that Art of War doesn't proc as much as you want it to.

[Mosg2]

I ran it for 3-4 minutes on all toons against the boss dummy in Stormwind and didn't have any problems. /shrug

[Kromtor]

/click doesnt get stuck
castsequence does

art of war procs a lot, exorcism on the other hand is on a 15 second cooldown

[Mamut]

Well for pure laughs the 5 feral druids were a hoot. Very hard to get any real testing in wsg but thats all that is popping on the PTR, well some WG and world PVP in ironforge lol.

Very hard to get shred to go off so its alot of mangle spam but i did almost shoot beer out of my nose when i was getting overrun and i popped dire bear with berzerk and mangle spammed down a buncha hordies. I cant really see this being excellent in arena by yourself, but would be fun with a healer as the druids dont feel too squishy. Having feral charge helped alot for runners comboed with infected wounds.

The carebear tanks running around with 55k hp's were the biggest pain but you dont really see that too often. Frost mages were less a pain then on my rogues, i can shift in and out many times without concern for mana with ilotp and innervate if needed.

On live i have 5 druids already to 80 as boomkins with secondary spec as 3boom/resto/tank for heroics. I might try and gear em up abit for some BG fun as ferals while i decide if i wanna try and RAF some rogues or stick with my level 70 rets.

All in all i think IAWT has made for some fun diversions from the usual teams and has kinda rekindled my interest in wow.

Peace

[Iceorbz]

/click doesnt get stuck
castsequence does

art of war procs a lot, exorcism on the other hand is on a 15 second cooldown


lol cant get my damn /click to work using innerspace right now :(

---- Problem fixed with /click, (PICNIC) Problem in Chair, not in computer.


Although the timing seems a bit off, some spells dont seem to fire really as soon as they are coming back up. So im not sure if I need to spam faster or what I can do to alter this.

[Iceorbz]

What's your spell priority with that click macro?


I tried using the /click macro from stealthys post. Its not as efficient as I would be at least on one toon in pvp thats for sure. Making me think I want to just use 6 keybinds for dps.

[Mosg2]

I tried using the /click macro from stealthys post. Its not as efficient as I would be at least on one toon in pvp thats for sure. Making me think I want to just use 6 keybinds for dps.

What you've got to keep in mind is that his /click macros are based off of HIS click speeds. The ratios of commas to each other is right where they should be--You need to decrease or increase each and keep them at the same relative proportions so that they match YOUR speed.

I sat and watched it on 4 toons for 15 minutes all together and there's no way I could be more efficient across four toons. Even on one toon I bet it would be ~95% as efficient as someone only playing one toon. Once I got the right amount of commas for my button mashing speed down it would click each ability in succession as soon as it came off of cooldown and never caught up. It totally frees me up to focus more on healing, cleansing, etc.

I should be getting my games in tomorrow night. I'm going to fraps them and post them up. No promises about the skill or gear level but at least there'll be videos :D

[Fuzzyboy]

What about a hybrid team - like 2x classA + 2x classB (+ dedicated healer)? That could possible alleviate some of the management problems of a mixed team while not impossible to micro. Not sure what classes would complement eachother though. Perhaps feral druids and rogues? Warriors and DKs? Enh. shaman and paladins?

Another option (though not melee and no MS mechanic) is 2x warlocks and 2x shadow priests. That team would also have the added advantage of being able to do heroics with a tank (shaman + paladin could do that also, though).

[Fuzzyboy]

I would still run 4x enhancement with a healer, and ya it does sound really really stupid good. I'm out of character premades on PTR tho /cry.

That reminds me, how are your rogues doing at the moment? Do you still think they're viable?

[asonimie]

That reminds me, how are your rogues doing at the moment? Do you still think they're viable?

almost 80 :) Yes I do think theyre viable still. If they can't compete once I have some gear, I'll let everyone know for sure.

[Iceorbz]

My paladins just hit 80, so ill have some stuff soon I guess. Doing bg's and grinding honor.. gotta get a healer to run some instances with me so I can buy more pvp gear with badges lol.

Thankfully we are winning wintergrasp like a champ, 5 times in a row on defense so ill have gear soon.

[Fat Tire]

almost 80 :) Yes I do think theyre viable still. If they can't compete once I have some gear, I'll let everyone know for sure.


Mad props on lvling rogues so fast. I told a buddy about rogues and guessed that they couldnt do heroics,but he said that they have a rogue who can tank heroics. Others just have to be smart about aggro. /shrug

IWT has really opened up boxing in wow for me since I am doing a bunch of melee teams.(nothing to do with IWT but) I dropped a shammy from my quad and put in a destro lock. I love the difference shadowfury makes and I can actually get my casts off much better than with 4 shamans.

[Crel]

Glad this topic is still kicking around.
I will add my input as i have a 3dk 2pally melee team at around 75

I started this team a while ago but stopped working them as DK was getting nerf bat every other week. The great thing about this team, and perhapes the most underestimated is the ability to pull players into you.

It works extremely well, as the second the offending person enters your mob they are almost instantly exploded. This team would work best i imagine with the right pally/dk ratio. I went for that extra pull so no one can ever escape me. Dont get me wrong I love chasing that feral around a pillar all day, but the pull lets me get more time in killing instead of playing grab-a**. Dont forget that glyph blood spec heal, it really helps in a pinch!

[asonimie]

Glad this topic is still kicking around.
I will add my input as i have a 3dk 2pally melee team at around 75

I started this team a while ago but stopped working them as DK was getting nerf bat every other week. The great thing about this team, and perhapes the most underestimated is the ability to pull players into you.

It works extremely well, as the second the offending person enters your mob they are almost instantly exploded. This team would work best i imagine with the right pally/dk ratio. I went for that extra pull so no one can ever escape me. Dont get me wrong I love chasing that feral around a pillar all day, but the pull lets me get more time in killing instead of playing grab-a**. Dont forget that glyph blood spec heal, it really helps in a pinch!

I play a "for fun" team on a different server (to play 60-70 BGs with RL friends). 4x DKs. We regularly do WSG / AB with one friend healing and my 4 DKs. They are quite a beast to be honest. If they had MS, they would be unstoppable. They can tank the shit out of everyones damage, and hit very hard, with grip and a great snare it makes for some fun. I can grip anyone into the circle of death, chains them in mid air, and they die in 2 hits (disease+blood strike or w/e). In order to be competitive in arena I think you would need the mortal strike somehow, but they are still very fun to play. And who can argue with starting at 55! for those of us without RAF. Great team for BGs!

[Ualaa]

What about a hybrid team - like 2x classA + 2x classB (+ dedicated healer)? That could possible alleviate some of the management problems of a mixed team while not impossible to micro. Not sure what classes would complement eachother though. Perhaps feral druids and rogues? Warriors and DKs? Enh. shaman and paladins?

Another option (though not melee and no MS mechanic) is 2x warlocks and 2x shadow priests. That team would also have the added advantage of being able to do heroics with a tank (shaman + paladin could do that also, though).

The 2 + 2 (or 1 + 3) could work, especially if you can effectively click sequence a lot of their dps.
A "Mortal Strike" ability in the composition would be especially huge.

The more abilities we have to manage, the harder a combination of classes becomes.

Kromtor proved 4x Shaman + an independent healer is not the only viable option for high-end arena.
Never know what the next successful combination will be.

[Fuzzyboy]

The 2 + 2 (or 1 + 3) could work, especially if you can effectively click sequence a lot of their dps.
A "Mortal Strike" ability in the composition would be especially huge.

The more abilities we have to manage, the harder a combination of classes becomes.

Kromtor proved 4x Shaman + an independent healer is not the only viable option for high-end arena.
Never know what the next successful combination will be.

I must admit being kind of dense about melee classes in general, but now that I think about it, 2 x DK + 2 x WAR could be nice. Please correct me if I'm wrong (I know most about caster types), but it seems that warrior abilities like spell reflection, mortal strike, charge, intercept etc. combined with some of the DK abilites like AMZ and grip might work nicely. I think I'll setup some chars on the PTR to test :-)

[GS4Clagg]

Kromtor you inspired me to try five melee. Since my DK's were highest lvl without raf, that's what I went with. They are currently lvl 72. I stopped by WG yesterday with them, since I just got my flyers yesterday, and was delighted to find some lvl eighties fishing. So I swooped down and rolled some faces. Man, when you spam your iwt button it's like a buzzsaw. I took out an 80 hunter, 80 druid, 80 dk maybe another one or two. Think most I took at once might have been three? Ended up with 15 HK after that incident and 130ish honor. Haha, I was stoked. Even took out a prot warrior with over 40k hps and a rogue who tried to gib one of my guys after I took the warrior.

I was also inspired by the fellow who put the video of the four rogues on youtube, seeing your guys like a buzzsaw on that one dwarf pally in wsg ally base was awesome.

All of my dk's are currently blood all the way with the extra healing glyph. Thinking of spliting up some spec's later on for all the different buffs. Just easier right now to manged keybinds with this.

I have them on a /click macro atm. I know I've heard some of you guys talk about click macros sucking for pvp and they very well probably do, however I'm doing well to be able to get my other maxamized screens shifted to main screen without overlapping them on one of the others. When that happens and I now have four little screens with no main screen I dont know how to get it back, but that's another thread. Long story short I'ma keep my /click with my /castsequences for now.

So thank you all you mb'rs who tried this melee bit out earlier, prega, krom, mr. four rogues.

I'm also going to try rogues and feral cats too.

Capped team:
Ivas-prot pally
Plate-ele shaman
Dishe-ele shaman
Spoone-ele shaman
Kildo-ele shaman
<GTFOT> Blade's Edge Server

[Iceorbz]

The 2 + 2 (or 1 + 3) could work, especially if you can effectively click sequence a lot of their dps.
A "Mortal Strike" ability in the composition would be especially huge.

The more abilities we have to manage, the harder a combination of classes becomes.

Kromtor proved 4x Shaman + an independent healer is not the only viable option for high-end arena.
Never know what the next successful combination will be.

I dont like /click sequences. I think being able to time your burst is important not knowing where your people are in a series of macros doesnt work for me I guess.

[Ualaa]

I don't really like the click sequences for pvp either.

However, running two class types at once, makes it quite hard to effectively micro manage both classes actions in a competitive way. Even one click sequence on class A, as you micromanage class B might be an option.

Two class types gets more power and diversity, but it harder to play each optimally at once. I'm just saying, if you are playing more then one class at once, in arena (either 1 + 3, or 2 + 2) with a healer played by someone else as the 5th toon, you might need a click sequence to have a chance.