Software Choices

[Row199]

Hello Dual-Boxing.com Community!
I am new to these forums. I started dual-boxing yesterday after much deliberation, and am finding it tremendously entertaining. WoW gets pretty repetitive playing only one toon at a time. This is a new challenge!
Anywho, I have been doing research today at work (very work-related, I swear!), and I was wondering if anyone could assist me in picking software.

I see that Jamba and MBv2 are good WoW add-ons for general stuff, but a third party (FULLY WoW LEGAL!) program would really save me a lot of hassle.
I am leveling a Druid and a Shaman on a single Vista computer with a single monitor. My graphics card and memory are quite adequate and I am not encountering and lag whatsoever.
Up until now (got them to level 8 last night), I have to alt tab between the two WoW screens (accounts) to target and cast spells, etc... Very tedious.
It seems silly - both cast nature ranged attack with the "2" key, and "1.5 sec cast heal" with the "4" key.

Which of the following programs would be best?
I have seen:
Keyclone
Autohotkey
Mubox
Hotkeynet
Mousecloner
InputDirector
Octopus

Any guidance on what would fit my specific setup (one Vista PC, one monitor, two characters simultaneous with similar abilities) would be enormously appreciated.

Thanks!
Row199

[Ogloo]

Keyclone, it is the most used hear, because it is easy to setup, and all of us have a lot of knowladge how to set it all up.. You will need all the required macros once it pressed both 2's or 4's in both windows.. for example for a mage

mage 1- bob
mage 2- billy

mage 1's macro

/cast fireball

mage 2's macro

/assist bob
/cast fireball

[Ogloo]

This will take some of the studying out.. a old post I made


hat you will need-
keyclone addons- automaton, jamba, pitbull macro's (which are simple! once u learn how to do them)1. Download automaton, jamba, and pitbull (or a UI that allows u to bind any keys to any spells in wow)..
2. Keyclone- keyclone is a program used (19.99$) that can be downloaded off this site. What keyclone does is, it links whatever key presses you do on wow1 and wow2 (different wow's open on ur computer)... There are several things you need to do to become advanced at keyclone. But most of the things come already started for you. Once you install keyclone and your set, and have 2 accounts open ur first wow. Go into your game options and select windowed mode. Move ur size of ur new wow window to fit half the screen or however u want to set it up. Then, open a second wow, make another character and split the screen again to have it set as you want it...
3. u have ur characters made-- dont get carried away.. keep ur characters at the starting spot because all the keys are bound, and this gets realllllly messy...
4. is it working?- before you get moving around.. press spacebar while on "wow1", you should see both "wow1", and "wow2" jump at the same time.. this means that keyclone is working and ur set and ready for the more complicated stuff.. if not working.. going back and makesure keyclone is open, and keyclone has noticed you have opened wow.
5. Do-Not-pass- in keyclone, there is a tab called, "do not pass" go into this window. click the area that says "<click here and hit a key>".. dont hit a key please... (these are the keys that will not be transfered from "wow1" to "wow2".. ) you will want to have keys like, C, H, L, M, O, P, Enter, /,... ect.. while your running around and trying to open different windows, its very difficult to have all of the windows opening and closing.. whenever u see a problem with things opening.. just go to hear and put them in thedo-not-pass...
6. keybinds-- in wow settings- while on "wow2" go into ur settings and to keybinds.. this is another way that u can use make it so the alt does not do what the main is doing.. This is where ur going to go to "movement keys" and unbind the keys w,a,s,d,.. or up, down, left, right keys.. whichever u use to move.. This is so that you can have the main move and not the alt. (if u want to get fansy, you can have the movement keys for the main w,a,s,d.. and for when u just want the alt to move (for getting out of aoe or something).. u can use the arrow keys..)... Some more items that u might want to unbind are "enter" and "/" because u dont want them all talking at once!.
7. Macros--the most important part!!!-
follow- when u just start a character say the first "free" button is "3" because u have like 2 spells at the start.. On "wow1" you will leave this space blank forever.. on "wow2" you will make a macro.. and place it on the button 3.. this is what the macro should look like.. ..... /follow wow1 (wow1= the name of ur main character name.,.. which i do not know).. place this on the button 3 on the alt, and leave it blank on the others.. Shoot- now that u are running around and jumping at the same time and ur figuring it out, now its time to kill a mob. (dont do quests yet please).. (pretend ur a mage...) the only spell u have at the begging is fireball.. on ur main, you will leave button "2" as fireball, and then on the alt, you will create a macro place the macro on button 2.. replacing the normal spell please!!!- the macro should have the same picture to make it easier.. you will need a macro that looks like this /assist wow1 (now press enter to go down a line)... /cast fireball
again-- do this step again for all spells that you get.. but do not use them for self cast things like frost shield.. because u want to give that to urself..8. addons- and finally, you will need to setup macros. which are self explanatory..
Jamba= a addon that links that accounts so that they auto accept groups, trades, quests, focus, follow (pulsates every 1 sec.. different settings can make variables).. and all that (go into the main settings.. add all the alts names that will be included in this addon on "wow1" and the mains name on "wow2"'s addon..
Automaton= skips all the unnessisary things in quests, group invites, summons, deaths, trades, says ding! which is funn in guild!, and more auto thinggs like going into BG. and passing on
Pitbull- a new UI that allows u to put spells anywhere on the screen and bind them to keys.. So for example, if u want to bind 1, 2, 3, 4, to spells,, and cntl 1, cntrl 2, cntrl 3.. to buffs you can do that..!!

[Row199]

Hi Ogloo,
Thanks very much for your recommendations and set-up guide.
This looks very simple.
Does this program also move mouse clicks over? For instance, if I am working with two mages, and cast an AoE spell on my main wow1, will my main wow2 character cast an AoE spell in the same spot?

Thanks,
Rowan

P.S. Most importantly, this is fully legal according to Blizzard, right? I know it says so here, but a few other websites have said that Keyclone is "questionable"...

[Ogloo]

Keyclone does not fully support the mouse clicking thing.. Most of the time you really do not have to do this, but if you want to there are some programs that can do it, but I am not very familiar with, but there are some macros that set the view and mouse to center of the screen and then click.. thats how i did druids once.

[zanthor]

Keyclone
Autohotkey
Mubox
Hotkeynet
Mousecloner
InputDirector
Octopus

Keyclone - Highly utilized and easy to setup, cheap. - limited performance on Picture in Picture swapping (though improved over older versions) and limited functionality of mouse broadcasting. This used to get very frequent updates but they have slowed down a lot (Jun 2008 to May 2009 saw only 2 releases). Good author and community support.

Autohotkey - This is a very powerful tool which will require LOTS and LOTS of custom coding. It is free but support is limited.

Mubox - Never used it, haven't looked into it beyond seeing the website claims some pretty exaggerated things.

Hotkeynet - Another highly utilized tool thats free - very good community and author support. I can't say much about performance here as my experience is limited - it did work quite well for the testing I did.

Mousecloner - Banned from this site.

InputDirector - not a multiplexor last time I checked, this is a tool to connect multiple computers together much like Synergy.

Octopus - Another high utilization mod however the authors disappeared and it is what it is - you are stuck with community only support and no future for the software.

Innerspace ('http://www.lavishsoft.com') and ISBoxer Toolkit ('http://www.lavishsoft.com/wiki/index.php/IS:ISBoxer') were not listed. Innerspace by it's self is very powerful but hard to configure, when you add the ISBoxer Toolkit you have a quick and easy way to deploy your multiboxing team and configure them for any configuration you can dream of using (within the scope of what a multiboxer can accomplish.) I've personally configured my system using everything from Hardware, Keyclone, Autohotkey, Hotkeynet and Innerspace, and I can comfortably say the most power and configuration as well as author support has come from Innerspace and Lax. An IS subscription is $36 for 365 days, this covers 5 computers.

[zanthor]

100% legal.. most of the blizzard employies use keyclone and multibox.. Keyclone does not fully support the mouse clicking thing.. Most of the time you really do not have to do this, but if you want to there are some programs that can do it, but I am not very familiar with, but there are some macros that set the view and mouse to center of the screen and then click.. thats how i did druids once.This is completely unsubstantiated. I know some GM's have mentioned they use it, but this is far from a provable statement.

[zanthor]

Hi Ogloo,
Thanks very much for your recommendations and set-up guide.
This looks very simple.
Does this program also move mouse clicks over? For instance, if I am working with two mages, and cast an AoE spell on my main wow1, will my main wow2 character cast an AoE spell in the same spot?

Thanks,
Rowan

P.S. Most importantly, this is fully legal according to Blizzard, right? I know it says so here, but a few other websites have said that Keyclone is "questionable"...Keyclones mouse support is questionable in combat situations - if you are looking for a rock solid mouse broadcasting solution i'd highly recommend Innerspace. Note: for ANY mouse broadcasting you are dealing with some woojii magic of setting cameras facing the same way and hoping that the clicks line up in the 3d world.

Blizzard has been quoted from a forum blue name that KeyClone is OK to use. Keep this in context it was a VERY early version of KeyClone - back when it ONLY did keyboard/mouse broadcasting, and did not have any of the higher functions it does today (such as KeyMaps, PIP, etc.) Blizzard has gone to great lengths since then to ensure they do not endorse ANY 3rd party solution to multiboxing including pure-hardware based solutions. What they have done is stated time and again that if you stick to the 1 action = 1 action per client you are 100% OK in their eyes.

[Eldi]

theres a new one to pwnboxer like keyclone more userfriendly but i use keyclone and mousecloner

[zanthor]

pwnboxer and mousecloner are the same company and both are banned from being discussed here.

[Row199]

Hi Zanthor,
Thanks very much for your post. I am impressed with the members of this community. I ask a question, and get a few experienced people to respond within a few hours :-)
KeyMaps?
PIP?

It seems like the simplest option for my setup (one computer, one monitor, two characters with similar abilities) would be Keyclone.
The one-time fee of $20 is acceptable, and the ease of setup and ease of use make it quite desirable.

When I get home from work, I will try it out.

Thanks very much!
Row199

[zanthor]

Hi Zanthor,
Thanks very much for your post. I am impressed with the members of this community. I ask a question, and get a few experienced people to respond within a few hours :-)
KeyMaps?
PIP?

It seems like the simplest option for my setup (one computer, one monitor, two characters with similar abilities) would be Keyclone.
The one-time fee of $20 is acceptable, and the ease of setup and ease of use make it quite desirable.

When I get home from work, I will try it out.

Thanks very much!
Row199KeyClone IS very simple to setup, I would say for a new guy who hasn't touched either, ISBoxer isn't any harder to setup now. The real decision you need to make is do you want mouse broadcasting... if so, then ISBoxer would be your best bet.

[Ualaa]

I was recently given an email ad from pwnboxer.
Is it banned from dual-boxing because it uses features against the wow ToS/Eula?
Just curious... why something cannot even be discussed.

[zanthor]

I was recently given an email ad from pwnboxer.
Is it banned from dual-boxing because it uses features against the wow ToS/Eula?
Just curious... why something cannot even be discussed.The author/owner of the company has mad himself an enemy of this community through his actions here, and his behavior in the past. Mousecloner in it's first release was found to be violating the TOS (it was fixed immediately but the lynch mob already lynched.)

[Row199]

Hmmm well maybe you can help me decide.
DO I want mouse broadcasting via ISBoxer? Do I need it / will I want it?
Essentially, I want to be able to run my characters around without constantly alt tabbing from one screen to the other giving distinct (slow) commands to heal, cast a spell, etc...
When I move my druid, I want my shaman to move - the MBv2 addon utilizes this follow function pretty well.
When I cast a spell (healing or offensive) I want my shaman to cast his equivalent spell on that same target.
That is pretty much it.
Unless there is more down the road that I should be prepared for (post level 8 :) )

Thanks!
Row199

[Jheusse]

The main use of mouse broadcasting to my knowledge is when you are using multiple chars that can cast ground targeted AE spells.

Mage's Blizzard is one of the easiest examples of this. When you press your cast button you then have to click where it will be placed. Mouse broadcasting will duplicate the location you clicked to cast in your main window on your slave windows.

Since the addition of the interact with target many of the other benefits of mouse broadcasting are less of an issue, like quest interactions.

Hmm if you are spending talent points on multiple toons of the same class is another case where mouse broadcasting shines.

You can do what you want with either (or any of the solutions listed above), arguably the Jamba addon does half the work of what you need, with auto-following the slave to the master.

I was able to grasp Keyclone myself and put it into play, Innerspace is still quite frustrating to me (non-coder) even with ISBoxer, but it's a very powerful program and is in a more active development cycle.

Keyclone is $20 lifetime for one computer. IS has a 7 day free trial and 35 or 36 dollars a year for a sub on up to 5 computers if memory serves.

The developers of both options are active on these forums. Zanthor is a very knowledgeable IS guy and very patient and helpful.

edit: and regarding the above-mentioned verboten topic, the site is extremely careful about not even allowing the whisper of skirting the ToS here. Multi-boxing is a hobby that gets a lot of scrutiny and is constantly accused of cheating or botting by the ill-informed. Hosting a party that was known to be involved in breaking the ToS would allow those people to smear the entire multi-boxing community with that brush. So they are extraordinarily careful about that here. For example many multi-boxers self report themselves to advise the GMs that they are boxing and the software they are using.

[Ogloo]

all the normal casting and focus, and folliowing is done by keyclone, but the part for the clicking is being able to have the few aoe spells that require you to click (for example blizzard) that a couple wow characters have. This is where you will need it, but a lot of the time the people who run those characters dont even have a need to use them

[Row199]

Yeah, it sounds like Keyclone will take care of all the basics for me.
I think I will get that and try it out. Given that I am leveling a druid and a shaman (non identical classes), I will not worry about aoe dual casting.
I will be sure to let everyone know how it goes over the next couple days.

Thanks!
Row199

P.S. By the way... would you recommend that I self-report myself to a GM ahead of time? Seems somewhat dangerous, even if there is nothing technically illegal.

[Jheusse]

It's not dangerous at all, Multi-boxing is legal. If you are at the keys playing multiple toons that all the accounts are in YOUR name and you're following the 1 keypress=1 action rule you're fine.

Some people self report just for clarity or "be on the safe side", there is no requirement to do that whatsoever.

Eventually if I can work out the kinks in IS, I plan to see the fun of 5 hurricanes from 5 boomkin some day.

[Row199]

Heh, very cool.
I saw a video on youtube of a guy controlling 5 chain lightning shamans in Arena... He decimated people. It was hilarious.

[zanthor]

Self reporting is an exercise if flatuation in my opinion.

Mouse broadcast was something I personally lived without for over a year, and now (even with "Interact with target" keybinds) I can't imagine living without.

I take portals.
I eat fish feasts.
I piss on bonfires.
I click hotbars I don't bother keybinding.
I click-heal on unit frames (OpenRDX + Mousebroadcast)
I use items in my inventory.
I answer dialog boxes.
I select quest rewards.

I do all this, without ever switching which character is the main character. I play 5 as if I played 1, it's really amazing how transparent my multiboxing is with the exception of using 5 guys on /follow. I've even 5 boxed 3 of the 4 wings in Naxx with no problems (didn't do DK since we had only 1 priest in raid.)

[Jheusse]

And you wonder why I incessantly try to pick your brain Z.

Wonder how viable it would be to just put skills on quickbars normally and click with mousecasting as the primary control method rather than keymaps


edit: And being from Pennsyltucky I definitely need to get things configured because pissing on bonfires is a birthright.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

Self reporting is an exercise if flatuation in my opinion.

Mouse broadcast was something I personally lived without for over a year, and now (even with "Interact with target" keybinds) I can't imagine living without.

I take portals.
I eat fish feasts.
I piss on bonfires.
I click hotbars I don't bother keybinding.
I click-heal on unit frames (OpenRDX + Mousebroadcast)
I use items in my inventory.
I answer dialog boxes.
I select quest rewards.

I do all this, without ever switching which character is the main character. I play 5 as if I played 1, it's really amazing how transparent my multiboxing is with the exception of using 5 guys on /follow. I've even 5 boxed 3 of the 4 wings in Naxx with no problems (didn't do DK since we had only 1 priest in raid.)Same here (minus Naxx), and using Octopus for my needs. ;) Lots of viable, free, alternatives to the for-pay stuff.

[Row199]

Well, I got keyclone last night and I must say it is pretty sweet.
It saves so much of the headache of alt-tabbing between the screens to cast every single spell!

I was wondering if someone had any good tips for druid-shaman keybinding that will keep things making sense?
I don't mind writing (simple) macros on my alt account or main account.
Got both toons to 14 last night, and the number of spells is increasing quite dramatically.

Thanks,
Row199

[Ualaa]

I've found with Keyclone...

If I have four windows (quarters) on a screen, PiP swaps between them are almost instant.
If I have five windows (one large, and four small), PiP swaps are slower, but still playable.

I personally have a few different keyclone folders, and a shortcut to each.
Basically just a differing number of Maximizer layouts.
Keyclone (2), Keyclone (3), Keyclone (4) and Keyclone (5).

Mouse broadcasting from Keyclone is functional.
If I'm on my five druid boomkin team, Force of Nature or Hurricane is close enough to the target that it works.
It's definitely not strong enough to reliably take portals, eat fish feasts or select talents across toons.

[Zerocool2024]

Use which ever you see fit.

Both have basics, and more. You can only limit yourself by what you don't know how to do with each program.

Since I use Jamba, I can use any program to link all my toons together and do whatever it is I want to do.

I fully support Keyclone and Innerspace. I have not used anything else because both of these programs and the respected authors have helped me with whatever problem and or need I had.

When it comes to the most simple and easy to start up, sure, keyclone probably has IS beat by, say, 10 minutes. You can't go wrong with either program, or any other alternative.

DL the demo of both and try it out, what are you going to lose, 20 minutes of your time testing out each program?

There are plenty of videos/guides showing off both programs.

I wont go out of my way and say "keyclone is better, or IS is better". I like both programs and Authors. :sleeping:

[Vecter]

I agree with the above poster about both Keyclone and ISBoxer being very viable solutions. Both have tremendous support and are used by many so someone is always around to lend a hand if needed. I started with Keyclone and enjoyed using it thouroughly, and then I tried ISBoxer. At the time the PiP swap alone was enough for me to change, it really is instant. However having the ability to create and setup macros outside of Wow really was a bonus for me as well. I am sure the difference is negligable once you have everything setup, however that setup was smooth and quite enjoyable to do.

Good luck on your adventures! I know you will have a blast.

[Mubox]

[quote='Row199',index.php?page=Thread&postID=211619#post211619]Keyclone

Mubox - Never used it, haven't looked into it beyond seeing the website claims some pretty exaggerated things.



Awe :( no exaggeration, I'm nothing if not Honest. Besides, if something isn't what you want, full source is available and I'm more than willing to change things to meet everyone's needs. Things like mouse cloning, border removing and window repositioning are things I don't need (and can't actually put to use) but they were requested.

Keyclone has a huge following, if you want lots of help and/or are just getting started, IMO, you should go with Keyclone. Once you have your feet wet you can make more informed decisions. You won't really know what the limitations/benefits are until you give everything a try at least once. ;)

[zanthor]

And you wonder why I incessantly try to pick your brain Z.

Wonder how viable it would be to just put skills on quickbars normally and click with mousecasting as the primary control method rather than keymaps


edit: And being from Pennsyltucky I definitely need to get things configured because pissing on bonfires is a birthright.Certainly as viable as being a keyboard turning noob is ;). Some would argue this playstyle, but in the real world even the hardest of the hard core MouseMovers have keyboards bound for movement on some level.

[Jubber]

I think for the quickest startup and the newest boxer Keyclone is great. $20.00 one time fee, upgrades for life. From their you can move onto the other softwares as your boxing needs change. I started off with Keyclone and have since moved to hotkeynet which is currently free. Love both. At some point I would like to switch to innerspace but for now Hotkeynet is doing everything I need and I know I will always have Keyclone if I ever need to fall back to. All 3 authors are active in this community and will help you out with anything.

One awesome thing about the support is that Rob is a phone guy. He will talk your ear off. I think that's great cuz sometimes there's only so much you can convey thru the forums. Being able to talk to someone is really nice when you got that one question that you can't figure out and need help immediately. Just don't go calling him at 4am or something cuz he needs some sleep too. lol.