Why am I also getting steamrolled? (video)

[gitcho]

in the spirit of Ellusionists's PVP post "Why am I getting steamrolled (video) ('http://www.dual-boxing.com/forums/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=20342') " i thought I would come out and admit my utter suckage with my main team on my first time in utgarde keep at lvl 71.

I can clear up to prince keleseth, but got rolled 6 times in a row ... my best attempt got him down to about 76% health. Here's the video of my 6th attempt ('http://rmck.com/fraps/utgarde_keep_prince-kelethas-wipe06.wmv') .

Disclaimer: I recognize I should have waited till my pally had more aggro on the prince, but he did on my first 5 attempts, and I still wiped fast ... i also should have used divine shield earlier to get out of the ice tomb, but i'm getting rolled pretty bad. I need to figure out how to effectively and quickly deal with the ice tombs, the adds, and keep the prince aggro on my pally.

Advice for my Pally, sPriest, 3x frost mage team? (please don't say roll shamans or DK's)

Armory: Pally ('http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bonechewer&n=Team%C3%A2wesome')
Armory: Priest ('http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bonechewer&n=Team%C3%A4wesome')
Armory: Mage ('http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bonechewer&n=Team%C3%A5wesome') (all 3 are same gear)

EDIT: in talking with a friend, I also realize i had no consistent DPS on the prince ...
edit2: also not happy with my unit-frames setup ... using a bad pitbull theme .. some recommendations would be appreciated

[Rin]

Whew... this one is tough:

I don't think your DPS is the issue here, as you were able to get him down to about 76% before your entire party wiped. A significant problem that you're having is that your Paladin is getting ice blocked. You should be able to remove this via the skill Every Man For Himself (human racial), Divine Shield, or via AOE nuking. The other issue that I see is that your entire team is taking significant damage throughout all points in the encounter. May I ask why your priest is spec'd Shadow? I doubt that you'll be able to simply dps this fight without heals until you completely over level/gear the encounter. In an eventsuch as this, where your entire team will be taking large amounts of damage, you're going to want to at least try to aoe heal during it. Circle of Healing will provide a small boon, and you should be able to follow that up with the Prayer of Healing. Next, when the adds come into the room, you need to round them up... run up to them, drop a consecreation and use avengers shield (it should hit 3 of the 4 skeletons). The goal here is to control the agro so that you will be able to reduce the amount of AOE healing required. You're going to want to make sure you kill the skeletons in one spot as well, so that when they rez, you'll be able to repeat the consc + avengers shield strategy.

Good luck!

[Kayley]

Bunch all characters up against the paladin, keep consecration down at all times. If a mage/priest gets frozen, consecration will break them out quick. If the paladin is frozen? Either racial or just have the mages do an AOE. When the adds spawn it doesn't matter who they go for, consecration will lead them right to the paladin :P (again, provided all characters are standing right near each other)

Pretty much what Rin said.

[Feider]

Either arcane explosion or set up some short casts like arcane blast or fire blast on a '/target ice tomb' macro button if you can set them up to always face the ice tomb.

With that said. Remember that the ice tombs are frost immune. I did not realize this for the first few wipes in regular as my frost mage was just wasting mana.

[Feider]

(Your video also makes me sad about my setup. I'm running at between 15-4 fps on my one machine. Your horrible wipe looked so nice. B^ ) You've pushed me one step closer to dropping the dough on a better setup.)

[gitcho]

Thanks for the replies ... i'm feeling a lot better about taking another shot. I suppose I should respec to Holy if I'm going to be running the WOTLK instances (quest grinding is too hard right now) ...

@ Kayely: Thanks for the idea on grouping my toons all together - makes sense. Question - do the adds only respawn if all are killed? Can I kill all but 1 and continually poly the last one so they don't all respawn?

@ Feider: I'm using a new core i7 920 processor with 12GB of ram and a single Asus 4850. I'm running all 5 on this PC using this layout ('http://www.solidice.com/keyclone/layouts/kc_1920x1200x1_5regions.jpg') (on hotkeynet). I have settings on lowest for all 4 windows on the right, and medium settings on my main window with view distance all the way down. Soon as I turn view distance up on my main window (only outside tho, not in instances) , it lags ... can't be my processor, as I've got the fastest you can reasonably get and plenty enough ram - must be my video card.

[puppychow]

respec the priest to holy, you can't do instances without a healer unless you have passive heals (shaman totems) or massively overgear/overlevel the instance. You should have buttons to heal every member of the party with big heals, and buttons to perform group heals (CoH, POH, etc). Most of the time your priest will just be healing the tank, but you will heal targeted players occasionally. So for example if mage#2 is tombed you want to alternate between heal tank, heal mage#2, heal mage #2, heal tank, etc.

think long and hard how you want your keys to be setup. for example you may want to use 8 keys:

1 = tank initial attack sequence, does nothing on healer
2 = tank/dps spam macro, does nothing on healer
3 = another dps button, does nothing on healer
4 = whatever
shift-1 = heal tank, does nothing on tank/mages
shift-2 = heal party1
.. etc

that way you start fights with a few presses of 1 (just tank attacking) and shift-1 (healing tank), then just switch to mashing 2 and shift-1 (dps, tank, and heal tank) for the rest of the fight (pressing shift-2, shift-3, etc as mages need heals).

There are a million ways to set it up, I have about 10 keys that are exclusively used by my tank (rftgyzxc + shift-same), 12 keys used by my DPSers (2-8, shift2-8, alt2-8), and 5-6 keys used by my healer. it lets you tackle pretty much anything and adapt quickly.

[offive]

Frankly i think Prince is the hardest boss in UK. So much spell damage so fast can be tough for tanks (except maybe a DK).

The adds are skellys so poly wont work. Shackle would be a waste of time. You can holy wrath with the pally to get agro on them and do some damage. Just pop AOE a couple times on the mages and you should be fine with the adds. If the timing is correct it will kill the tomb as well. Just watch your mana when spamming arcane explosion.

You will definately need a dedicated healer for instances. The holy priest is the easiest to box, just macro a circle of healing / prayer of healing targeted on the preist to a key so you can quickly get your followers healthy with a simple key press.

Prince is a pain with the shadowbolt spam, make sure you have shadow protection on. If your tank can keep agro and you have some TBC shadow resist gear it makes the fight easier. Matter of fact shadow resist gear is just nice in UK. Too bad blizzard doesnt really have any end game resist gear anymore.

Pop mirror image before the skellys come so they focus on Prince.

Good luck!

[EaTCarbS]

Just keep all your guys next to your tank, and add this to the front of your spam macro

/target Frost Tomb

Adding that makes the fight laughable :D

Good Luck!

[Powerwar]

You are doing the same mistake that I did the first tries on this boss.

Make your toons follow your pala.
Have the pala spell that stuns undead for a couple of seconds on hand. you will need it if the mana tomb is up and the skeletons respawn at the same time. Come really handy in this fight and later in the instance.
I personally just AoE nuke when mana tomb or the skeletons are up.

This boss is relatively hard at the beginning, but once you get used to him it's not that difficult encounter.

[wowphreak]

Also what would help is if yeh go all the way to the left of the room then engage em that way the skellies have to cross yer consecrate
Then have all yer guys within consecrate range might as well park em right next to yer pali.
or instead of fighting em in that room park yer guys just outside the archway run the pali in then run back around the corner to yer guys wait for em then move to t he center of the arch way that way the skellies have to run thru yer consecrate save holy wrath for when they respawn dont bother try to kill the skellies they hardly do any damage to yer pali





/stopcasting
/target Frost Tomb
/cast Fire Blast

on all mages for when yer pali gets iceblocked if everyone bunched up together then the palis consecrate will kill the iceblock on anyone else

[pinotnoir]

I found it better to arcane explosion when someone got frozen. That way they are all doing damage to the frozen target plus the boss. If there are any skellys up they die fast too. I always arcane explosion the skellys when they spawn with my 3 mages. Oh and watch the uk video so you can see where to pull the boss. You keep your guys behind a wall at the entrance and pull the boss back with your pally. The video shows it pretty well.

[Starbuck_Jones]

You can read my on going ordeal with UK here
Utgarde Keep boss one down! ('http://www.dual-boxing.com/forums/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=20118')

What made the first boss doable was luck and putting in the /target frost tomb into my druids macros. Even now I can kill him consistently but if I mess up im toast. Also the last 10k of hp its usually just the paladin going at it as the druids are oom and what little mana they regen goes to heal.

[maxel]

The biggest thing I found for this particular boss was to just slow down. I came right from tbc, hit 71, then hit the instance as quick as I could. In TBC I got used to burning things down as quickly as possible, so for this first boss I was trying to do the same. And, I was burning him for sure, but I wasn't keeping up with incoming damage properly and dropping left and right. I can't watch your video at work, but imagine you're probably doing something similar.

Just slow down, make sure your heals are landing effectively, and prioritize breaking the ice blocks before they can do to much damage. Once I started doing this the fight became 200% easier and I haven't wiped since. This carries through most of Wotlk bosses. Slow down, get the tricks down, and then get back to dps. It was a hard lesson for me to learn.

Max

[Xorn]

I can remember that one quite good since I used to wipe there myself as soon as Wrath came out and I was all about running into instances up to Level 80. Didn't work at all, I got killed in every instance I tried with my setup (Paladin, Priest, Mage, Warlock, Shaman) and I was that frustrated that I stopped multiboxing for some months after reaching level 80, playing only my paladin in that time.
Just don't give up like I did! :D

[HPB]

It took me many wipes to do Utgarde on my Paladin team. I did fine out that the first boss, Prince K, is OPTIONAL. You can kill the adds, wait for him to pat left and sneak through the door. At least you can clear more if you're having trouble with Prince K until you get a little higher level and get some gear.

Big tips: Yes stay right behind your paladin. Take a big swing right turn into the room from the left side, so that you drag your followers behind you. This way your Consecrate is between the followers and the doorway that the skellies come in from. Losing aggro on the skellies? Use your AOE vs Undead spell: Holy Wrath. Your other AOE abilities (in my case Consecrationx5 and Divine Stormx5 - I was 5x Ret at the time) should take care of the Ice Tombs. The skellies repop where they fall. Since your AOE will kill them right near you, soon as they pop, re-cast your AOE's. Save all AOE for skellie repops.

[Dominian]

What settings are you rendering with? Cant get such a sharp picture on my movies for some reason, and the size is even bigger then yours.

Anyway to the encounter i suggest you pull him to this spot, aka concentraion will hit everyone. This is were i tank him: http://www.wegame.com/watch/Utgarde_Keep_Multiboxed/ I heal trought the frost tombs, but that aint realy a good idea with one healer.

Apart from the tips you already got i would like to add:

1. Your priest aint healing, or atleast using heals with a cast time. Are you clicking your chars to do a /assist main/Tank /cast heal? (bind a key to certain chars and use flash heals or greater heals) I also added hand of protection from my paladin whenever my healer needs healing. Its rarley needed,but thoose times when my healer reeeeealy needs meele protection its gold.
2. This encounter screams for prayer of mending, It will make this alot easier if you use it. Trow a renew on your tank aswell.
3. This is a short fight and i doubt mana will be a issue, switch to blessing of kings on your slaves atleast untill you get better control.
4. You lose aggro straight away, bind taunt and taunt the prince back when you lose aggro.
5. Always start with Avengers shield, its awsome aggro and ranged. A great way is to trow avengers shield on trash then sheep them, when it breaks it will go straight for your tank instead of the mages.
6. Always keep concentration up on this encounter.
7. Auras are great tools to migate damage, im not sure if the frost tomb damage can be migated. Try frost resistance aura and if it doesnt work use concentration/devotion aura atleast.
8. Try to use "tab" instead of clicking the target, clicking takes attention away from your health bars and the overall picture. (Im not planning to start a clicker debate its just what i feel works best)
9. Only use divine shield if your paladin is left alone and can kill the target.(or to remove stacking debuffs, then you have to click it off thought and taunt the mob back) Divine shield drops all aggro from the paladin and gets your slaves instant zerged. Use divine protection as it reduce all damage with 50% on your paladin!
10. Use seal of vengance(called something differet for the alliance) for tanking (the one that gives a holy debuff to the target)
11. Tomb damage is frost damage, aka use frost ward on your mages.

About your gear,specs etc:

Dont gem your paladin with spellpower, and dont be cheap with the enchants on your tank. It will cost you more in wipes!!
Your Protadins talent tree is weird: Get touched by the light,combat expertice and deflection atleast. Either use 5 points in Blessing of kings or none. Drop imp blessing of might,seal of command and divine guardian.(get vindication instead, its good vs trash mobs.)
I noticed now that your priest is shadow so respeccing him to holy or disc is the first step. Im not a priest expert but maybe something like http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/priest/talents.html?tal=500000000000000000000000000023150 103230215253035031051000000000000000000000000000

Once again gem your gear, green gems costs nothing!! There are loads of cheap enchants to get aswell so leveling enchanting would be a good idea! :)
Do you use Blizzard on your mages since your specced imp blizzard? If not drop it and use it somewere else!
Im not a mage expert either but i would try http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/mage/talents.html?tal=230025000100000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000533030310233133230152201 351 instead for pure pve!

[Rin]

As with other encounters, with high enough dps you can just steamroll this, even at level 70 (yes, lvl 70). I tried this last night with my new team (in quest greens and Nexus blue shoulders), each of my damage dealing characters posted over 1200 dps (druid, 2x ele shammy - with about a 33% crit rating each and only 500-600 spellpower). I did not use elemental mastery, or trinkets, nor did I use druid trees. I did use 2 fire elementals though to help burn this dude down. I will say that I did a ton of healing w/ my resto shammi for this fight though, and my Healing Spring totems each heal for 100-110 health per tick (~150 avg healing per second w/ 3 totems down). As others have mentioned, when the skeletons come, toss an avengers shield at them.

Edit: seems like part of my post went poof - but for the attack, I simply ran straight into this guy (didn't put totems down until I was already engaged in combat), and proceeded to kill him from there.

Cheers

[Catamer]

i used a pally and 4 elemental shaman and I couldn't do it (at 70) until I converted one of my shaman to resto and dedicated the resto shaman to only casting heals. I don't think I was using magma totems back then
I would suggest a dedicated healer. if you do a good enough job of holding aggro on your tank, then hopefully you only need to cast most of your heals on the tank.

get as much set & forget AoE going as you can ( you can use arcane explosion but I would only use it in a pinch ). I'm guessing you need to use flame strike.
my shaman use magma totems ( so much easier to cast than flame strike ), for my pally/shaman I have the hole team on top of the boss so the concecrate and the magma totems burn through any ice blocks or adds I get hit with.

the healer should probably have a heal the tank macro and a group heal macro for a minimum, the max would be a seperate heal button for each character.