Auction House Prices will be drastically changing

[blast3r]

The software company that Blizzard filed suit against has shut down it's servers. They are saying it will be either for 3 weeks or a year or may never come back online. I am not going to mention the name of this software or what it does because we aren't supposed to do that here. :)

In any event, I imagine prices on the auction house will be greatly increased and availability will be decreased. Now we will get to see exactly how much of an affect this software had on the Warcraft Economy.

[Feardis]

im a numbskull and i read between those lines
but... was it really being used so widespread, still?

are you able to keep us up to date with figures without breaking the rules?

[Creazil]

I think you should explain the software (or provide links), cause I am kinda lost?

[Feardis]

he can't
but the lawsuit was talked about ALOT
mayb not in eu tho
8|

[Svpernova09]

A popular botting program closed its doors in fear it was violating a court order. It may be back, may not, its for the courts to decide. What this means is all the people using that bot are now unable to bot. This is what the OP is referring to.


No discussion of said bot, I only clarified this much so that people may get a better understanding of what the OP meant.

[blast3r]

A popular botting program closed its doors in fear it was violating a court order. It may be back, may not, its for the courts to decide. What this means is all the people using that bot are now unable to bot. This is what the OP is referring to.


No discussion of said bot, I only clarified this much so that people may get a better understanding of what the OP meant.

Thanks!

[Feardis]

if someone could record aution house prices and mayb formulate them for us all to cheer over
that would be awesome :)

[keyclone]

that would definitely be interesting to see if there really are any major changes in the pricing.

btw feardis... your avatar gives me the heebie jeebies... and i play undead :D

[Feardis]

do people still get the heebie jeebies?
:D

[zanthor]

Honestly I think that the Ah prices wont notably change. Yes, there are people that bot a lot and farm a lot doing it. But they aren't as successful as the real people doing the same thing and they compete against those people. All said and done you are dealing with a very small percentage of a VERY large pond, it's like saying that the oceans going to change because suddenly everyone stopped peeing in it when they swim.

[Feardis]

do people who use them get all items they obtain etc deleted along with their accounts?
as well as mailed items to low lvl alts?
coz if they don't i guess on some servers there may be a noticable decrease for certain items? i dunno

idea
if anyone knows a particular server where these knob ends are seen more then average
start scanning like crazy

hmm does anyone know the max accounts that can be saved to a single server?
is there a max? otherwise zanthor makes a point, well he does anyway
but im trying to justify my own ramblings here

[Ellusionist]

<Name Edited by Svpernova09> We're not allowed to mention the name of that software? Why?

I don't condone the use of it, but not being allowed to mention it would be insane! It *is* somewhat current WoW news, yaknow!

[Ellay]

It's because multiboxing and botting are so closely tied together we try to keep any association as distant as possible. I don't want to be able to google said botting program and see my site pop up :)

[zanthor]

The thing is there isn't any REAL money in farming this way. A botter will be caught, banned, and have to relevel another toon. I've known a half dozen guys who botted in wow - ya know what they all have in common?

Banned accounts.

Every last one of them.

[Svpernova09]

<Name Edited by Svpernova09> We're not allowed to mention the name of that software? Why?

I don't condone the use of it, but not being allowed to mention it would be insane! It *is* somewhat current WoW news, yaknow!No, don't use the name here. The reason is we don't want to feed them customers.

[Moorea]

What makes you think that the company doing botting software stopping its operations will make the software itself stop being used ? it's not like they can remotely erase every copy, not counting there are probably tons of pirated versions of said software ?

[Svpernova09]

What makes you think that the company doing botting software stopping its operations will make the software itself stop being used ? it's not like they can remotely erase every copy, not counting there are probably tons of pirated versions of said software ?Probably because the "valid licensed" copies require that they phone home to check and make sure everything is good. THOSE server(s) are the ones that have been shut down so the software errors out and will not run. As for the pirated copies, they'll still run, but without updates they'll be worthless after the next patch.

[blast3r]

What makes you think that the company doing botting software stopping its operations will make the software itself stop being used ? it's not like they can remotely erase every copy, not counting there are probably tons of pirated versions of said software ?

If they shut their servers down it shuts down their software. Software must phone home before it will run.

[blast3r]

See - I always felt "farmer bots" were a necessary evil in the virtual economy world.

I don't' like raw material farming. I'd rather go to the AH and buy what I need - instead of spending hours / days / week gather materials I need to make something.

But yes, it will be interesting to see what will happen.

How many think <said botting program> will just move offshore outside of US jurisdiction and re-open? I do!

Yea, I kinda understand what you are saying. I imagine not a lot of people spend their day farming mats to sell at auction. If they want gold it is easier to do dailies. So, 10 Gold for one Borean leather maybe?

I guess in the end it would balance back out a bit becauase if mats cost a lot more then people will start farming them more to make profit. Then the prices might stabilize. Maybe we can get Obama to help Blizz work this mess out!

[railz]

http://www.wowecon.com/

Good way to track AH prices over the next couple of weeks across all servers.

[blast3r]

http://www.wowecon.com/

Good way to track AH prices over the next couple of weeks across all servers.

Going to make this one of my home pages when i get home. Awesome site!

[elsegundo]

wow. im trying to make a stack of 20 borean leathers sell for 10 gold.



anyway i really dont see that why prices would skyrocket even with a small portion of the wow community gone. havent they, at least the large majority, arleady been gone?

[blast3r]

wow. im trying to make a stack of 20 borean leathers sell for 10 gold.



anyway i really dont see that why prices would skyrocket even with a small portion of the wow community gone. havent they, at least the large majority, arleady been gone?

wouldn't that be for 200 gold?

[Coltimar]

I run auctioneer on my level 6 rogue bank alt and I notice this same punk posting leather about every other day or so. He posts 20 stacks of heavy borean leather at half the going rate. I generally buy and resell it, or keep it, but this guy is selling 60-80 stacks a week! I couldn't farm 20 stacks of HBL in a day if I killed myself doing it. That's 20 X 20 X 6 = 2400 leather in two days. If all you do is farm maybe but someone has quite the factory going, IMO. My point is that I think it will have an impact if this program is really shut down.

[elsegundo]

wow. im trying to make a stack of 20 borean leathers sell for 10 gold.



anyway i really dont see that why prices would skyrocket even with a small portion of the wow community gone. havent they, at least the large majority, arleady been gone?

wouldn't that be for 200 gold?

no no. according to your estimates, if prices skyrocket, your borean leather would be 10 gold a piece. right now, im trying to sell all 20 borean leathers for 10 gold a stack. and they sometimes sell!! i have about 15-20 stacks left to sell. =[
maybe i should wait a month. lol

edit: maybe we're talking borean leather vs. heavy borean leather? also, i dont believe the prices will skyrocket as much as you do.

[Zzyzxx71]

If anyone is interested in reading the current court ruling regarding this, I've RE-hosted it (so the original domain isn't in the address) and ran this past Ellay to make sure I wasn't doing something not in the best interests of DB.com.

The doc can be found HERE ('http://www.ocmojo.com/zzyzxx/mar10_2009.pdf').

[Tombs]

I can't recall the last time I saw a bot farmer. I thought people used them to level. I do recall 6-9 months ago someone had a bot stationed at the neutral AH with auctioneer running to auto-buy up items that were drastically below their mean price.

[zanthor]

http://www.wowecon.com/

Good way to track AH prices over the next couple of weeks across all servers.Just curious how active/accurate this site was... so I searched for titansteel bar, which on blackhand goes for around 100g right now.

Price Stats (hide ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljVEKwjAQRO%2ByJzCtGrL58SbL2oSyUI00K%2F0oubt JUQg4n2%2BYeYwD7hktAvGkkp7gM5oLwpY2Eo0PClFZlgM7hFv NX8U4thNjupkE8FKRtc6dr219Qsjve6eplqys%2Bads369Vpkh fzGja7zAiaJrnJVJXU1h5Oxy%2BlPIBghBCBQ%3D%3D')) – Blackhand/Horde (All Horde ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljV0KwjAQhO%2ByJzD1J2Tz4k3C2i4lUI1kV%2FtQcne TohBwHr9h5iMccBO0CIFGjekBXtCcEda0hqh8DxMrxWXHDuFa8 1cRHtuJMd0sTuBjRdY6d7q09QFBXrdOUy2ipPJTtu9njiOHLyY 07XeonaZ5Xjh0dRDOb867xZdSPgp0QvA%3D'))
Last sale: 250http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxLtDKyqi62MrdSik9MLsnMz1OyLrYyBHKLM%2FPSc1Ljk %2FMz8%2BIzcxPTU0ESRoZWSg5AgEUyEW5QUnpyfk5%2BEUg9k KecBgYgnomVUkllQSqUmZ6fk6JkXVsLAOCeKi0%3D0http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxLtDKyqi62MrdSik9MLsnMz1OyLrYyBHKLM%2FPSc1Ljk %2FMz8%2BIzcxPTU0ESRoZWSg5AgEUyEW5QUnpyfk5%2BEUg9k KecBgYgnomVUkllAdggM5AFOWWpQFW1tQA3yyse0http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxLtDKyqi62MrdSik9MLsnMz1OyLrYyBHKLM%2FPSc1Ljk %2FMz8%2BIzcxPTU0ESRoZWSg5AgEUyEW5QUnpyfk5%2BEUg9k KecBgYgnomVUkllAdggMyul5PyCglSgqtpaADdXKxI%3D
(1) Blackhand, 13-Dec-2008 11:13:38 PM

So 3 months ago was the last time they saw the item sold on blackhand... Lets look for something more commons?

Heavy Borean Leather...
Price Stats (hide ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljUEKwjAURO%2FyT9CfoLWTjTcJ3yaUQDXSRLKQ3N2mK ASc5QzznkDhnTCCrMw5xAeZBD6BSiw2ZH%2B3zmcJ61FPoOuev 0mgG4S5uwXXLhcQ83ieBq0OwgBKr1un2k0pS04%2FbeM%2FtzB 7%2B60F3NhKg3JcltXbbrZuk0ImgE2t9QNMJ0K2')) – Blackhand/Horde (All Horde ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljVEKwjAQRO%2ByJ%2BimaO3mx5ssaxtKoBpJVvtRcne TohBwPmeY94QM7YkGApZJfXiATYQngi1s7NXdeXYqfj3qkeBa8 jcJ9RWC2Nz8XC8XAsThPHa9OQgdQXrdGlUxJRVNP23lP6OfHH9 rIaxsUzYNy7I6bmZOLr5dBOsJbc75A9XeQ6E%3D'))
Last sale: Never

Oh dear...

Hrm, how about runic mana potions?
Price Stats (hide ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljVEKwjAQRO%2ByJzApQbv58SbL2oSyUI00K%2FmQ3N2 kKASczzfMPEaL74xnBOJFJT3AZzQOoaRCovFOISrLduAZ4dryV zFO%2FcSYYSYBvDTkrJvdpa9PCPl1GzTNkpU1%2F5T9%2B7nLE umLGU3%2FtROCpnXdIg01hZ3L4fC11g9%2B10H9')) – Blackhand/Horde (All Horde ('http://www.wowecon.com/?l=eJxljVEKwjAQRO%2ByJzCVoN38eJOwtktZqEayq%2F2Q3N2 kKASczzfMPMIB34onhEiTSbpDUHQeYUtbFONbnNlI1h2PCJeav 4rw2E6c62YyQ5CK%2FOBHf27rA4I%2Br52mWtTI9Kds348sE8c vJnTtd6idpWVZOXZ1VM4vzrsllFI%2BBytC6A%3D%3D'))
Last sale: Never

Hrm...

Well then... this seems like a bust to me, neat site, neat concept, all the power of auctioneer, online, for a fee.

[Rin]

@Zanthor -

You're absolutely right. I looked at wowecon.com awhile back, but it seems as if their data is about 3-5 months behind the current trends. The Wowecon site is a good concept, but it's poorly executed.

[railz]

I think you have to pay for the up-to-date info. Sorry. Didn't know that.

[Creazil]

It's because multiboxing and botting are so closely tied together we try to keep any association as distant as possible. I don't want to be able to google said botting program and see my site pop up :)<said botting program> is quite alot of places on this site already.

Do a search "<said botting program>", and you'll find alot of threads! Maybe you should consider to edit those threads (can you add a filter?)?

[RobinGBrown]

Last year when there was a banwave of people using <said botting program> my server (Scarshield Legion EU) went from medium pop to 'recommended'...

There are a ton of botters out there.

[Ellusionist]

I am a paid user of wowecon, and it's pretty nice to have. For the price they charge ($3.33 per month or something?), it's worth it!

I get e-mails when certain items are listed for buyout below a set price, and the e-mails are within maybe 10 minutes of the listing -- sometimes less.

I would recommend it.

[kadaan]

You don't have to pay to get up to date info (at least not when I was using it in BC) but it's like wowcensus, and only gets its data from users of their mod uploading data. Unlike auctioneer, wowecon only saves data when an item SELLS and not just what it's listed at. This means that some joker listing 100 stacks of X for 100x the current price won't mess up the data at all (unless someone buys it). The downside is that it only records data if the buyer or selling is running the mod, not any random person scanning the AH.

[sqeaky4100]

What get's me about all of this is:

Blizzard has 1... yes, 1 employee that basically runs Warden. ( the program designed to catch botters,hackers,etc )

Yet, for this "said program" they hire a fleet of lawyers and spend tons of money to take the program down.



I honestly think it's going to be a huge wake up call to a lot of people.

I used to be involved in the botting world, and in the past months/years it's seriously gotten LARGE. Especially this said program.

People are going to be very surprised at the prices.... heck, even prices skyrocketed for several days when a large banwave swept through "said program" .

[heffner]

You know the saying, "When there is a will, there is a way". Stopping one botting program won't do anything, IMO. Another one will appear. When there is real $ to be made, someone will figure it out. Maybe the strategy they use will change or the items they sell, but they will adapt.

Perhaps they will just farm the AH. This would drive prices up. If you can corner the market you can dictate the price. I wonder what would happen if you bought every auction for a demanded item for two weeks non-stop and relisted it at 50% higher every time. Farmers run 24/7 so it's feasible. Now, would this result in a ban before you actually made any money?? Maybe.

[Iceorbz]

What get's me about all of this is:

Blizzard has 1... yes, 1 employee that basically runs Warden. ( the program designed to catch botters,hackers,etc )

Yet, for this "said program" they hire a fleet of lawyers and spend tons of money to take the program down.



I honestly think it's going to be a huge wake up call to a lot of people.

I used to be involved in the botting world, and in the past months/years it's seriously gotten LARGE. Especially this said program.

People are going to be very surprised at the prices.... heck, even prices skyrocketed for several days when a large banwave swept through "said program" .You can expect your prices on leather, primals eternals, cloth to go up along with enchanting mats. Thats pretty much about it, any super rare farmable pets.. dont expect to see them on the auction house to often. Evern seen 2 or more captured fireflys on your servers auction house in burning crusade.. yep that was probably a botter.

Prices did sky rocket last May, but hey stuff happens right. It won't be long till other companies create or redesign illegal software, just like napster and other peer 2 peer sites the can of worms has just been opened in my opinion.

[Feardis]

What get's me about all of this is:

Blizzard has 1... yes, 1 employee that basically runs Warden. ( the program designed to catch botters,hackers,etc )

Yet, for this "said program" they hire a fleet of lawyers and spend tons of money to take the program down.



I honestly think it's going to be a huge wake up call to a lot of people.

I used to be involved in the botting world, and in the past months/years it's seriously gotten LARGE. Especially this said program.

People are going to be very surprised at the prices.... heck, even prices skyrocketed for several days when a large banwave swept through "said program" .You can expect your prices on leather, primals eternals, cloth to go up along with enchanting mats. Thats pretty much about it, any super rare farmable pets.. dont expect to see them on the auction house to often. Evern seen 2 or more captured fireflys on your servers auction house in burning crusade.. yep that was probably a botter.

Prices did sky rocket last May, but hey stuff happens right. It won't be long till other companies create or redesign illegal software, just like napster and other peer 2 peer sites the can of worms has just been opened in my opinion.i dunno, blizzard have proved they have the money and the power to charge and fine these people
if anyone does make a new one it will be soo far underground not many will have access
or only keen programmers will make them for their own personal use
imo 8|

[Moorea]

I recently reported an obvious robot (some hunter killing yetis and skinning them - they still exist) and the GM said live he'll personally look into it - 3 days later the robot is still online botting... so...

[Ellusionist]

Yeah they unfortunately use the same e-mail template (and/or in-game mails) to respond to lots of situations.

I wish you really knew the result when you report someone. Of course, privacy is an issue I guess.

I always laugh at all the [2. Trade] chat where people say "don't do <action> or you'll be banned" when no one ever knows the outcome of reporting another player.

While I realize GM's have to keep a low profile amongst players, I'm very shocked that they keep everything as low-key as they do. I can't say I've ever heard someone say "my friend is a Blizzard GM".

[Moorea]

Unlike auctioneer, wowecon only saves data when an item SELLS and not just what it's listed at. This means that some joker listing 100 stacks of X for 100x the current price won't mess up the data at all (unless someone buys it). The downside is that it only records data if the buyer or selling is running the mod, not any random person scanning the AH.

Uh that seems extremely limited... What prevents some joker from uploading bogus data ?

Also you can't tell the difference between a joker cancelling an auction and an auction being bought out...

[Ellusionist]

Very very true... the only way I can see wowecon telling the difference between sales and auction expiration is if the item disappears before the listing length is up.

I've always used it and love it, but really that's the only way it can tell.

[Feardis]

Ok, so a guild mate online just informed me that this program was only 1 of many apps that do the exact same thing
and are still in operation...
how he knew that i didnt ask but yeh
if he's right then there is no hope :D

[glo]

Unlike auctioneer, wowecon only saves data when an item SELLS and not just what it's listed at. This means that some joker listing 100 stacks of X for 100x the current price won't mess up the data at all (unless someone buys it). The downside is that it only records data if the buyer or selling is running the mod, not any random person scanning the AH.

Uh that seems extremely limited... What prevents some joker from uploading bogus data ?

Also you can't tell the difference between a joker cancelling an auction and an auction being bought out...Wowecon doesn't work off auction scans, it goes by the mail you get from the auction hall when you buy or sell an item. That is what it means by it only collects auction data from people using the addon.

[Gadzooks]

Ok, so a guild mate online just informed me that this program was only 1 of many apps that do the exact same thing
and are still in operation...
how he knew that i didnt ask but yeh
if he's right then there is no hope :DIt's not hard to find the info. I browse and lurk at several sites where these types hang out, to see what scams and things they're up to, so I can avoid it - I know what phishing e-mails they're copy and pasting from each other, what new scams they have set up, and all of that. I do it from a Mac, that has never had WoW on it, and never will, so I'm pretty secure. Just google some of the terms, they don't do much to hide what they're doing.

Surprisingly, there isn't much discussion of the company that just shut down, I think most of them concentrate on phishing, because A. it's easier (they're lazy), and B. less likely to get their accounts banned. They know what's going on, there's a couple of complaint posts, but for the most part, they've moved on to other apps or other methods to steal from people.

Blizzard is WAY overdue for a ban wave, don't get frustrated if botters are still around - they will be gone after the next ban wave, no fear. I'm hoping the do one before the next patch, get it and the flood of QQ posts in time for the next flood of QQ posts about the patch. :) Blizzard has always moved slowly over issues like this, even way back in the Diablo II days, but when they do move, they hit HARD.

I had to laugh, recently, one of the more notorious sites for scamming and botting added member photos - seems being 14, and really ugly, is a requirement to join. :D

Visit these sites at your own risk - and please don't post their names or addresses here. Ever.

[Maxion]

Yeah they unfortunately use the same e-mail template (and/or in-game mails) to respond to lots of situations.

I wish you really knew the result when you report someone. Of course, privacy is an issue I guess.

I always laugh at all the [2. Trade] chat where people say "don't do <action> or you'll be banned" when no one ever knows the outcome of reporting another player.

While I realize GM's have to keep a low profile amongst players, I'm very shocked that they keep everything as low-key as they do. I can't say I've ever heard someone say "my friend is a Blizzard GM".
I had (while I played on a european server) about 3 of the people in my guild move to paris to work as GM's for a while a couple years back. But yeah, they weren't allowed to say much anything about what they did. And I don't think they are allowed to be GM on the server they play on themselves.

[Portal]

If they shut their servers down it shuts down their software. Software must phone home before it will run.I wouldn't be surprised if they removed that requirement and released the software 'as is' via anonymous sources (torrents etc) to spite Bliz in light of loosing their court case.

That being said, I was always under the impression that Bliz was good with detection and dropping the ban-hammer on the users of that program. It makes me wonder how many people really used it for long periods of time. What would we expect to be the biggest price change? Cloth, Leather and World Drops? Or were they farming everything (herbs, minerals etc)?

[Gadzooks]

If they shut their servers down it shuts down their software. Software must phone home before it will run.I wouldn't be surprised if they removed that requirement and released the software 'as is' via anonymous sources (torrents etc) to spite Bliz in light of loosing their court case.

That being said, I was always under the impression that Bliz was good with detection and dropping the ban-hammer on the users of that program. It makes me wonder how many people really used it for long periods of time. What would we expect to be the biggest price change? Cloth, Leather and World Drops? Or were they farming everything (herbs, minerals etc)?They farm everything - and they look at loot tables and concentrate on areas with higher drop rates of world epics and rep items and such. I havent run into any lately, but I saw one in operation in Storm Peaks grinding Relic of Ulduar.

They're fun to play with - tag the mob, let them kill it, you get the loot. :)

I don't think the code being released will accomplish much - trust me, Blizzard will be one of the first to nab it, they are not clueless when it comes to stuff like that. They can use the source code to make Warden spot any variations of the app that might be released.

In fact, the a-hole who wrote it is saying things that say to me he is NOT going to give away his work, and I would'nt doubt he'll be back in another form, from a country where they can't get him (good luck with that, the company Blizzard uses practices law everywhere, they're a global company), trying again. He made a LOT of money off that app, I guarantee he's not giving up. He could sell the source overseas for a lot of money, too.

What interests me is, now that the case is all but over, will Blizzard have their lawyers look into private servers, or go after the websites that host and discuss this stuff? The more notorious one actually had/has the balls to offer hosting and e-mail to pull off phishing scams, and they (the admins) said on their site they got Blizzard's attention when they started that, and moved the servers outside the US. Methinks they may get more attention now that the big case is done.

[Duese]

You know the saying, "When there is a will, there is a way". Stopping one botting program won't do anything, IMO. Another one will appear. When there is real $ to be made, someone will figure it out. Maybe the strategy they use will change or the items they sell, but they will adapt.

The difference is, Blizzard no longer has to go through any lawsuits with the company. All they have to do it point the finger and said new company is shutdown or the software removed.

That is why this ruling is scaring the hell out of me. If Blizzard comes out and says that the use of software to replicate keystrokes is now against the terms of service, Keyclone, AHK, HKN, etc., are all done. If they choose to create the program as a hidden process so that it still works with WoW, then Blizzard can go after them legally and shut them down. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. It doesn't matter if anyone even uses it in game or not.

With this ruling, it basically states that even though the authors haven't accepted Blizzards ToS, writing a program which does break the terms of service that evades Blizzard detection, whether intentionally or unintentionally, is a violation of Blizzard's copyright.

Before you cry out "the sky is falling" or that blizzard is going to actually do this, it wouldn't be very likely for blizzard to do this. However, what I'm more concerned about is future games because this ruling doesn't just apply to WoW or Blizzard alone. Now any company can do this. More frivolous lawsuits to burden the courts.


I don't think the code being released will accomplish much - trust me, Blizzard will be one of the first to nab it, they are not clueless when it comes to stuff like that. They can use the source code to make Warden spot any variations of the app that might be released.

Blizzard has had the program available to them ever since it went public but that hasn't stopped the program. Flat out, warden couldn't detect it because it was designed to run as a background program. Even in Windows vista, which supposedly made this harder for programmers to do, had it coded in within a week.

So many people are saying "good riddance" to the bots and every time I always question "have you ever seen a bot?" Most reply, yeah, I see them all the time. In all my time playing WoW, I ran into maybe 3 true botters on my server. If you wanted to "find" botters, you'd have to go out to the most remote places typically to find them. A lot of the botters that farmed high population areas found themselves banned pretty quickly. A lot of the guides on <Botting program>'s website would be based around target selection for what to kill. They would always prioritize killing non-quest related mobs in low traffic areas. Most of the scripts were built around these areas. Most of the "professional" botters as they called themselves, were never seen. They'd be hiding in Badlands killing whelps or along the northern end of Azshara killing demons.

I had a lot of issues with people blaming botting for the economy. Even back to my days in Asheron's call, where the anti-botting populous would go out on witch hunts in efforts of finding people botting. Either it's not going to have an effect on the population or it's going to have a negative effect on the economy by having a lot of the middle materials increasing in price.

[zanthor]

I recently reported an obvious robot (some hunter killing yetis and skinning them - they still exist) and the GM said live he'll personally look into it - 3 days later the robot is still online botting... so...How obvious? I got reported for "Botting" when I was farming WhipperRoot Tubers back in retail release... for 9 hours I picked up the same tuber every 25 minutes... I had a desktop timer set to 25 minutes, and was programming on my other monitor. I'd tab in, loot, tab out. After 9 hours I was contacted by a GM, told him what I was doing, and kept farming for another 4-5 hours.

[DallasWolf]

The Death of this program will not do much to the botting world due to the fact that there are so many other botting programs out there and they will continue to devolp more and more.. Gold buying is a Multi Million dollor machine that has to be feed..

[DallasWolf]

Honestly I think that the Ah prices wont notably change. Yes, there are people that bot a lot and farm a lot doing it. But they aren't as successful as the real people doing the same thing and they compete against those people. All said and done you are dealing with a very small percentage of a VERY large pond, it's like saying that the oceans going to change because suddenly everyone stopped peeing in it when they swim.


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-Fur

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[Moorea]

I recently reported an obvious robot (some hunter killing yetis and skinning them - they still exist) and the GM said live he'll personally look into it - 3 days later the robot is still online botting... so...How obvious? I got reported for "Botting" when I was farming WhipperRoot Tubers back in retail release... for 9 hours I picked up the same tuber every 25 minutes... I had a desktop timer set to 25 minutes, and was programming on my other monitor. I'd tab in, loot, tab out. After 9 hours I was contacted by a GM, told him what I was doing, and kept farming for another 4-5 hours.

It was a bot. it was actively auto targetting killing skinning mobs - at somepoint I had it attacking me - I was running in circle in/out range and it would just turn without moving and face me and shot me only when it can (without moving in range; or fleeing either) then a mob started attacking it in its back and it still trying to "finish" me (I was at least 20 levels above) while dying from the mob on its back. Also you could tag mobs and it would conciously kill them for you etc... anyone there would see it was a bot in how the sequence and tracking etc... was always exactly the same and lack of reaction to actual environment

[Dgc2002]

Ok, so a guild mate online just informed me that this program was only 1 of many apps that do the exact same thing
and are still in operation...
how he knew that i didnt ask but yeh
if he's right then there is no hope :D

Well, hes kind of right.

Theres a few other bots out there, none of them offer anything special from what i've heard. The one that just got shut down was the most developed by far. It offered a lot of features others lack, one of the main +s to it was its protection against warden(the software blizzard uses to detect bots). Other bots are pretty subject to detection if blizzard takes interest in it.

[Mooni]

One of the first people to ever speak to me once I downloaded Keyclone circa 2007 asked me
"are you familiar... with a program... called GIRDLE*?"

*name cleverly anagramed so I don't get b&

Naturally I flipped the fudge out and told them that that's a bot, and illegal, but keyclone is love.

All this is a way of introducing the point I'm going to make about auction houses: If they jack prices up even more, I'm just going to undercut even more. I've heard the arguements in Lineage II about how bots actually help the whole world and economy out, how farmable mats are available to the masses at rock-bottom prices because of the countless bots out there botting their bots botfully.
That's such a load though. Obviously it's in their best interest to drive the economy up, so that they can sell more gold for cash. So the people who sit in the auction house all day buying and reselling to jack up prices, I put them on the side of the gold farmers. Therefore they are an enemy and must be handled with an aggressive undercutting posture.
In the end, if anyone price-hikes our auction house (And Moon Guard has the most overpriced economy I've ever encountered) they can either buy my crap for a lower price to resell, or stare at it as it sells and wait till it's gone before they can sell another.
Talkin bout money homie, I ain't concerned.

[Dgc2002]

One of the first people to ever speak to me once I downloaded Keyclone circa 2007 asked me
"are you familiar... with a program... called GIRDLE*?"

*name cleverly anagramed so I don't get b&

Naturally I flipped the fudge out and told them that that's a bot, and illegal, but keyclone is love.

All this is a way of introducing the point I'm going to make about auction houses: If they jack prices up even more, I'm just going to undercut even more. I've heard the arguements in Lineage II about how bots actually help the whole world and economy out, how farmable mats are available to the masses at rock-bottom prices because of the countless bots out there botting their bots botfully.
That's such a load though. Obviously it's in their best interest to drive the economy up, so that they can sell more gold for cash. So the people who sit in the auction house all day buying and reselling to jack up prices, I put them on the side of the gold farmers. Therefore they are an enemy and must be handled with an aggressive undercutting posture.
In the end, if anyone price-hikes our auction house (And Moon Guard has the most overpriced economy I've ever encountered) they can either buy my crap for a lower price to resell, or stare at it as it sells and wait till it's gone before they can sell another.
Talkin bout money homie, I ain't concerned.

actually the botters i've talked with rarely try to drive up prices. If you woke up every morning with bags full of mats you wouldn't want the mats taking up bag space, you sell at the current market price(if you don't undercut). Its not about the price you sell the items for its about the volume of items you can move. Only a couple botters i've talked to do it for real life money, most do it to supply their raid materials or level an account from 1-80.