Question about account sharing with a child

[Talamarr]

So, I know it's OK to share your account with one child who is under 18, but does it matter what toon he plays? Can he play one of mine?

Here is why I ask; you can't share with your spouse but you can with a child. If a GM will ban you for sharing with your spouse, how do they distinguish that from sharing with a child? What's the deciding factor? Best judgment or do they look closer at who is playing what toon (i.e. ToonA, ToonB are being mutliboxed on Friday but appear to be playing by different people on Saturday)

My son is only 7 so I only let him play an hour or two a week but I think it would be fun to let him play one of my toons during an instance run. I just want to make sure that's ok, and/or it is not going to look suspicious.

[Talamarr]

I went ahead and just asked on the official forums just to be sure

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=15234891189&postId=153427164098&sid=1#0

[Vyndree]

So, I know it's OK to share your account with one child who is under 18, but does it matter what toon he plays? Can he play one of mine?


You represent that you are an adult in your country of residence. You agree to these Terms of Use on behalf of yourself and, at your discretion, for one (1) minor child for whom you are a parent or guardian and whom you have authorized to use the account you create on the Service.
Note: The key word here is 'and'

I know some have argued that, should you let your child play on your account, that you should not play on the account since you are only being the 18+ year old signature on the agreement. However, I see nothing in the ToU that defines this as a limitation -- the account is owned by you, and only you AND your minor dependent can use it. They didn't specify how or what part of the account you can use -- since the ToU governs the account as a whole, not each individual character, it makes sense that you may also share it in its entirety.

Of course, if you look at the customer support page ('http://us.blizzard.com/support/article.xml?articleId=20460&categoryId=2691&parentCategoryId=&pageNumber=1') (they contradict slightly)...

You may not share your Account or password with anyone, except that if you are a parent or guardian, you may permit one (1) minor child to use the Account instead of you (in which case you may not use that Account at the same time). (Section 1A of the ToU)
Notice the difference between the ToU -- there isn't even a Section 1A in the ToU. The correct statement is in section 3 - Eligibility.

However, you did not agree to accept the customer support page. You agreed to the ToU. So as long as you're behaving within the lines of the ToU, I don't see it as a problem. I would probably bring it to Blizzard's attention that their legalese doesn't completely match what they're trying to say in the support page, and likely that would end up with them altering the ToU to match their intent -- but until then, I see no wrongdoing as long as you follow the legal agreement you hit "I accept" on. There is nothing in the ToU that I can find that explains that, should you authorize your (1) minor child to use the account, you are prevented from using the account yourself. Until then, you haven't agreed to the statement made in the support page.


Here is why I ask; you can't share with your spouse but you can with a child. If a GM will ban you for sharing with your spouse, how do they distinguish that from sharing with a child? What's the deciding factor? Best judgment or do they look closer at who is playing what toon (i.e. ToonA, ToonB are being mutliboxed on Friday but appear to be playing by different people on Saturday)
For one, we don't discuss any way to dodge the ToU, so you won't get an answer from these forums.
And two, Blizzard doesn't say how they find people (probably to prevent them from finding ways around it). Logic tells us that, as humans, we are fallible -- and there are cases where Blizzard must be fallable as well. Multiple times on these forums we've heard of accidental bans, reinvestigations, and reinstations. Likewise, I'm sure there are folks signing "I agree" to the ToU/EULA and finding ways to break it.

The limitation here is that your spouse is (hopefully) of legal age to sign a license agreement (ToU/Eula). Your MINOR child (note that minor is specified) does not have the legal capacity to do the same without parental/guardian permission. That is the difference, and why your minor child is an exception to the rule. The moment your child becomes un-minor, they will have to make their own account (and you can email account administration in order to transfer his character(s) that you would like him to take onto his new, adult account).

[Caspian]

I went ahead and just asked on the official forums just to be sure

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=15234891189&postId=153427164098&sid=1#0nice clear answer there, it leaves no doubt.

[Ualaa]

*edit*
Read the link, guess they changed their views from the classic wow eula.

[heffner]

It seems to be that every time I did a PUG the parents also let their 7 year olds play their toons :P

It's nice to see that Blizzard isn't so hard up to at least allow you to share with your own children. Honestly, it's pretty sad that this is even a question someone has to ask. Blizzard really needs to lighten up a bit and open up sharing a lot more.

[Coltimar]

I did H MgT with a 7 year old healing once :)

[Frosty]

It seems to be that every time I did a PUG the parents also let their 7 year olds play their toons :P

It's nice to see that Blizzard isn't so hard up to at least allow you to share with your own children. Honestly, it's pretty sad that this is even a question someone has to ask. Blizzard really needs to lighten up a bit and open up sharing a lot more.
My son is 3 and he plays. ;)

He just can't respond to you.

[gantell]

Of course, if you look at the customer support page ('http://us.blizzard.com/support/article.xml?articleId=20460&categoryId=2691&parentCategoryId=&pageNumber=1') (they contradict slightly)...



You may not share your Account or password with anyone, except that if you are a parent or guardian, you may permit one (1) minor child to use the Account instead of you (in which case you may not use that Account at the same time). (Section 1A of the ToU)


Notice the difference between the ToU -- there isn't even a Section 1A in the ToU. The correct statement is in section 3 - Eligibility.

However, you did not agree to accept the customer support page. You agreed to the ToU. So as long as you're behaving within the lines of the ToU, I don't see it as a problem. I would probably bring it to Blizzard's attention that their legalese doesn't completely match what they're trying to say in the support page, and likely that would end up with them altering the ToU to match their intent -- but until then, I see no wrongdoing as long as you follow the legal agreement you hit "I accept" on. There is nothing in the ToU that I can find that explains that, should you authorize your (1) minor child to use the account, you are prevented from using the account yourself. Until then, you haven't agreed to the statement made in the support page.

You have misinterpreted the section there is no contradiction here. This section prevents you from using the account at the same time as your child. This is referring to a moment in time not all time everlasting. The section grants your child the right to use the account in your place. The limitation is that the child replaces you (they act in your stead) in using the account. There for you are not allowed to log on to one server and play while your child logs onto another server, if that where somehow possible. This section places no limit on switching back and forth; the limitation would be only that both are not allowed to use the account at the same time.

Hope your son has a good time.

[Vyndree]

This is referring to a moment in time not all time everlasting.

Then why is the document I linked called "Unauthorized Account Access Policy" and, additionally, why doesn't it simply say "You cannot log into the same account more than once at any given point in time?"

The "you cannot log in twice" argument applies to folks without kids, too. I've actually seen the question asked (particularly when people are curious if they can multibox with their single account) -- many people don't even realize that you're limited to one login at a time. So why limit that statement to just folks with minor children sharing their account? The login rules aren't limited to children and their parents. Given context, I believe my interpretation is correct (or, at the very least, the document is ambiguous).

Furthermore, they are out-of-date on their sources, since the EULA no longer contains subsections in Section 1, and the particular attributed ToU section that applies to that statement is Section 3 -- so it would make sense that this document is simply out-of-date and hasn't been updated to current policy.

Regardless of the cause, they should update their official support documents to reflect current, accurate, and unambiguous policy.


Unauthorized Account Access Policy
...
Limitations placed on Account Access
The ToU speaks extensively about what you may and may not do with a World of Warcraft account. This section highlights a few passages from the ToU that are most relevant to this policy. The core message is that you, and only you (with the exception of a minor authorized to use an account by a parent or guardian), should be accessing an account registered in your name.

Blizzard Entertainment does not recognize the transfer of Accounts between individuals. (Section 1E of the ToU)
You may not share your Account or password with anyone, except that if you are a parent or guardian, you may permit one (1) minor child to use the Account instead of you (in which case you may not use that Account at the same time). (Section 1A of the ToU)
You are liable for all activities conducted through the Account, including any activities which may be conducted by your minor children that you allow to use your Account. (Section 1A of the ToU)
You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your User Name and password, and you will be responsible for all uses of your User Name and password whether or not authorized by you. Security of your account is your responsibility. (Section 1D of the ToU)

(emphasis mine)

[gantell]

This is referring to a moment in time not all time everlasting.Then why is the document I linked called "Unauthorized Account Access Policy" and, additionally, why doesn't it simply say "You cannot log into the same account more than once at any given point in time?"

The "you cannot log in twice" argument applies to folks without kids, too. I've actually seen the question asked (particularly when people are curious if they can multibox with their single account) -- many people don't even realize that you're limited to one login at a time. So why limit that statement to just folks with minor children sharing their account? The login rules aren't limited to children and their parents. Given context, I believe my interpretation is correct (or, at the very least, the document is ambiguous).

Furthermore, they are out-of-date on their sources, since the EULA no longer contains subsections in Section 1, and the particular attributed ToU section that applies to that statement is Section 3 -- so it would make sense that this document is simply out-of-date and hasn't been updated to current policy.

Regardless of the cause, they should update their official support documents to reflect current, accurate, and unambiguous policy.




It is called "Unauthorized Account Access Policy" because that is what it is discussing. With in the policy it is granting an exception for a minor child. It does not simply say "You cannot log into the same account more than once at any given point in time?" because that statement would not grant the child the right to use the account.

The policy says "you may permit one (1) minor child to use the Account instead of you (in which case you may not use that Account at the same time)” This statement does two things. First the statement grants the child the right to use the account in place of you. Secondly limits the usage so both can not use it at the same time, this limit is clear from the phrase in parenthesis.


This section has to be careful in granting an exception for the minor child so as to not also grant an exception that allows both to use the account at same time. Had this point not been clearly spelled out where the exception was granted one could argue this point. It is not limiting the simultaneous log in rule to accounts with minor children; instead it is making it clear they are included.


I would agree there is some ambiguity but it is not over the use of "instead of you" that is clearly a reference to a temporary replacement that can change back and forth at will. The ambiguity is in the use of "permit one (1) minor child". The term "Permit" is a more permanent term and normally would include the right to revoke permission, but that is not clearly spelled out. Once you permit one child to use the account can you revoke that permit and grant it to a different child? Normally, with out clear definition the answer would be, yes you can as no restriction has been placed on that right to grant or revoke permission. So the ambiguity comes for a lack of clearly spelling out the right to revoke the permission to use the account.


As to the entire document being out of date clearly true, but not relevant as to weather this section is in conflict. Cleary a more verbose and detailed explanation with matching references would be nice.

Sorry to pick nits but I do like these sort of legalese discussions of the meaning of words and phrases. It makes one think. ;)

I wish I could insert quotes and stuff as well as you do.

[Marious]

This is silly, as you can see the support page people do the same as a lot of others do they don't even read the EULA/ToA they just scroll down to the bottom and wait for the Accept button to turn so they can use it. That's where people like us have to be careful and I appreciate Vyn and some of the others that really pay attention to this and can point us to the right place, most of the time it is ambiguous or poorly worded and it takes some one with more knowledge with these types of documents to interpret what they mean to the rest of us that just get confused. Or at least they can expand on the meaning of these poorly worded sections since to me it says you cant log on two characters from the same account at the same time, which as this point is not possible and will probably never be possible, my 7 year old likes to ask me if she can play also so this is of interest to me as well, and I think I will have her play a healer on my next instance run see how she does, she can't do any worse than some of the people I have PUG'ed with since I PUG'ed with a fully epic druid tree and he could not keep me alive and a priest in blues and a few heroic epics had no issues keeping me alive.

[Vyndree]

It is called "Unauthorized Account Access Policy" because that is what it is discussing.

Multiple logins from teh same account simultaneously can never be unauthorized access -- there is no possible way to EVER access the account that way -- whether it was authorized or not.

See? I can nitpick too ;)