DK teams!

[Multibocks]

Are you 80 yet? I am curious how the heroics are going! I have noticed now that my tank overgears heroics that I could definitely function without a healer on trash, but I dont know about bosses. So post a movie already! I'm lookin at you Fury and Zerocool!

edit: needs more !

[Zerocool2024]

hahah, sorry, I have been lacking with my leveling (all our 79) and are on their way to 80, I will Hopefully have all my videos up and running and new ones along with them. Last one I can record before I start hitting is Halls of Lighting (still kicking myself because I didn't have Fraps on when I cleared it)...

Been talking to Fury, and he is already hitting the Heroics side and last he said is that it was difficult this far (doesn't mean it's not doable, I think it just takes a little adjusting).

So those videos will be coming soonish... lol

[glo]

Are you 80 yet? I am curious how the heroics are going! I have noticed now that my tank overgears heroics that I could definitely function without a healer on trash, but I dont know about bosses. So post a movie already! I'm lookin at you Fury and Zerocool!

edit: needs more !My dk teams is 80 but I haven't really given any thought to PVE with them. They wreck stuff in WG and I've wiped and camped city raids with them.

[Multibocks]

hahah, sorry, I have been lacking with my leveling (all our 79) and are on their way to 80, I will Hopefully have all my videos up and running and new ones along with them. Last one I can record before I start hitting is Halls of Lighting (still kicking myself because I didn't have Fraps on when I cleared it)...

Been talking to Fury, and he is already hitting the Heroics side and last he said is that it was difficult this far (doesn't mean it's not doable, I think it just takes a little adjusting).

So those videos will be coming soonish... lol

I think if you took 5 of my "main" tank you could easily do some bosses in heroics. That frost guy in Drak is super easy if you time your heals right. Looking forward to some videos!

[Multibocks]

Forums are slow, I is bored. Furystrike, please advise.

[Souca]

Mine are 71 right now, likely to hit 72 tonight. Be a week or two before I get to heroics as I'll need to churn out a blacksmith and some ore to gear out. I'm really looking forward to seeing what I can add to this DK niche. I've done the solo thing on my belf DK so I'm pretty familiar with self healing and the class, I just need to see what transfers to 5 and multiboxing.

Do you gear and spec like a tank or dps? My instinct tells me to go the tank route on all 5 so that I can bounce aggro, but I wonder how the dps scales versus the mitigation. I.e. are you better doing way more damage and taking more or doing less damage and therefore healing but taking less. When I was soloing with my DK fights where all about endurance. Depending on the fight my dps might be as low as 900, but I could generate enough self healing to never go down. I also did this without blood aura, so I'm looking forward to the stacking aspect of that to make things even better.

Multibocks, if you can't tell, I'm bored at work as well.

- Souca -

[Mokoi]

bosses in heroics hit very very hard, its very tough to keep all the DKs alive without some really good tanking gear only healing themselves every 30seconds. IMO 4 DKs and a healer would be fine.

[Zerocool2024]

Lol, yes, go the tank route. Having one DPS is a bad thing because that person is going to at some point take the aggro and get itself killed, also, for AOE bosses, if that person is DPS speced/geared, that person is going to take a lot of damage, and you are going to have to Burn CD's to keep that said toon alive rather than keeping the CD's for the whole group.

The hardest boss I have ever fought is the 3rd boss in Halls of Lightning. And it took everyone second of my attention to all my CD's while bouncing the aggro around as much as possible, while timing Tap, Shield, Vampiric, IBF and making sure that I don't get the OWE so random BS (boss turns into several lighting bawls, then chases you around and the dot the boss puts on you does not go off and throw you right into them right after you just used Tap to get the health back up.

I really don't see Heroics being as much as a problem as I thought. I've cleared all the Dungeons a few levels lower than the "advised" level, and didn't have a problem. I know I died a lot, but that was just do to me learning the area, and knowing when the boss was going to do something and me learning how to counter it and not die at the same time. My gear was never right for the dungeon, my specs were a mess and I still managed to clear them. All my macros have changed and made things easier on me, so it just take a lot of trial and error to get what you want. While I will still advise to max out defense as quickly as possible, you don't have to if you don't want too. Just have enough HP to take the beating you are about to receive, lol.

[tinit5190]

Do you plan on making a guide of some sort Zero? Like gear guide or an strat guide for the instances? Or is that on a need to know basis, of which, only you need to know. :)

[Zerocool2024]

Do you plan on making a guide of some sort Zero? Like gear guide or an strat guide for the instances? Or is that on a need to know basis, of which, only you need to know. :) It will be whatever anyone wants it to be. It's going to have everything I think it needs to help explain DK Boxing to others.

Specs, Strats, Gear, Setups (IE, Innerspace, Keyclone), A mix of Castsequences vs multiple buttons. Really, just a good run down on everything. Even thought about redoing videos and having a voice over with it to better explain and so forth. I know I sometimes give a little tid bit of info, but some times it helps when someone is giving you a video/text/speech explaining in detail what is going on and why.

Also, whatever tidbits anyone can give will make it better. I get random messages, tells, AIMS, email/whatever asking certain things, and while I have no problem in answering any question people ask me, it might just be easier to have a place where I can look and answer, or others can answer and we get more than one set of eyes looking at it.

Of course none of it will be Mine is better than His, or anything, I Don't need a flaming/epennis stroking fest. But I would like to have different views/videos to back it up to better show others rather than saying "One time, at band camp...." and everyone jumping on the bandwagon and getting disapointed like a fat kid who found out twinkies were getting nerfed.

[pinotnoir]

Lol, yes, go the tank route. Having one DPS is a bad thing because that person is going to at some point take the aggro and get itself killed, also, for AOE bosses, if that person is DPS speced/geared, that person is going to take a lot of damage, and you are going to have to Burn CD's to keep that said toon alive rather than keeping the CD's for the whole group.

The hardest boss I have ever fought is the 3rd boss in Halls of Lightning. And it took everyone second of my attention to all my CD's while bouncing the aggro around as much as possible, while timing Tap, Shield, Vampiric, IBF and making sure that I don't get the OWE so random BS (boss turns into several lighting bawls, then chases you around and the dot the boss puts on you does not go off and throw you right into them right after you just used Tap to get the health back up.

I really don't see Heroics being as much as a problem as I thought. I've cleared all the Dungeons a few levels lower than the "advised" level, and didn't have a problem. I know I died a lot, but that was just do to me learning the area, and knowing when the boss was going to do something and me learning how to counter it and not die at the same time. My gear was never right for the dungeon, my specs were a mess and I still managed to clear them. All my macros have changed and made things easier on me, so it just take a lot of trial and error to get what you want. While I will still advise to max out defense as quickly as possible, you don't have to if you don't want too. Just have enough HP to take the beating you are about to receive, lol.


I am having some thoughts about bosses like that HOL guy. Boxing 4 melee means they are going to get aoe damage. I have a priest who will be the healer. Do you think if you had your team as 1 tank 3dps and 1 priest they would be easier to instance with? I have been thinking about specing them all tank at 80 if that will make instances easier.

[Zerocool2024]

There shouldn’t be any problem with having a normal group match up. I do have healers on the side for such a thing if I ever wanted to go that route. But I have not run into a brick wall yet with not being able to do any dungeon with a DK match up.

Having a healer would of course make it all the easier. And with having the other tree being blood spec for the Aura, then that would help the said tank get that little extra healing he or she needs. I would much rather use a Shaman for my healer because of the Totems/Chain Heal. But a Priest would do just fine. I just like the Totems from Shamans. They help a lot.

Give me an idea of spec ideas you are going to run with that match up and I can give some help if you want it, or others might be able to give you better help.

[Zerocool2024]

The guide is really meant for 5DK groups, but I have considered a heavy melee with healer group, which is harder than a normal caster group because you can spread them out, and his AOE crap is going to do nothing against you.

I can give a side guide explaining other group match ups and so forth.

[Multibocks]

Zero did you stop playing or what? I havent heard from you or Fury in a while, regarding heroics.

[Zerocool2024]

Lol, we are still here :)

Just doing a bit of "farming/strats" for Heroics. It takes a little getting used to.

So far, all the bosses that I have done (Nexus, UK, HOL, I have gotten down to about 30% or so before all my toons died).
I'm still sitting below the Defense cap to not be crited on in Heroics area, I need about 15 more. I still say it's doable but, we are going to need better gear (so more farming). With a healer, yes, it's doable, but it's not going to be easy as a 5man DK group.

[Zerocool2024]

Also, yes, the Aura does stack, it just doesn't show it.
Yes, Dungeons can still be done, only now, my attacks are weaker because I lost HB, but I will figure out a decent counterpart to it. Already ran into LOH and was able to do it, just was a little bit harder because of the loss of HB and some other talents I had going at the time.

Might be better if I had Glyphs for Death/Obliterate.
Going to mess around with other talents specs and see what I can turn up.

[Zerocool2024]

Also... Bloodworms.. Yeah, ALOT better. Getting 130 or so a tick from each, so.. yeah, a lot better than the 30's or so I am getting on Reg server.

[Souca]

Also, yes, the Aura does stack, it just doesn't show it.

Wait? Are you saying the PTR didn't get rid of Blood Aura? I thought they rolled it into Improved Blood Presence which either gives you 10% healing in blood or 4% in other presences?

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

Well, you still spec it of course, but it still stacks... Only, it does not show. You Stay in Frost, and the "Aura" Now Improved Blood Presence still stacks across the group, not sure on raid because I have not been in one yet, but as far as group goes, yes, it still stacks.

I ran LOH again with a new build and cleared it with no deaths. (Still testing builds)

4 toons (45/23/3 ('http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055021503000313230223101300305050510 1003000000000000000003000000000000000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9626'))
1 toon (41/8/22 ('http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055021503000313230213101000305000000 0000000000000000000205000325003110000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9626'))

Hardest part is not having all the Glyphs that you would normally have to get the best results. Though you can just sort of assume and get pretty close.

Using Heart strike, Death Strike, and Obliterate in the mix up. But missing Death Strike Glyph and Obliterate Glyph. Also, I have the Vamp Glyph which I don't really want to lose because that extra 10Seconds really helps on certain bosses.

Using one toon with a pet to see how things are stacking up with the new changes. So far, the DPS between the two builds is almost nothing. Doing a test dummy run (alot) of times to make sure things are as they seem.
I has the Pet Glyph so I would be maxing it.
So far, the best I can get is somewhere in the 160000's in 2 minutes with using multiple mobs (being only 2 because of Heart Strike).
Now, on the Normal server, my toons can get 220000's+ in 2 minutes (but of course, they are hitting 3 mobs) But the frost build on the normal server is still better than my current setup.
Even if I spam Unholy blight every 20 seconds, it does not make any difference in his dps overall. With the attack that my toon would be using (Heart Strike) I would be hitting 2 mobs for roughly 1K to 2K damage or more*2. Which in the end, is still more damage than Unholy blights 60's*20*X amount of mobs in the area.

Now of course, that is all Theorycrafting it. But take 60*20* let's say 3 mobs (the average I'm seeing) I get 3.6K damage in 20 seconds. Now in 20 seconds, I could have gotten off in my rotation 2 Heart Strikes which Average for 1K per mob, but can still crit for 2+K easily. That would be 4K 20 seconds, without crits.
While I'm still going to do some more testing on Multiple mobs, Unholy Blight is only used on trash and not bosses. So I just need to run around more and do some more Dungeon work and see how it goes.
I'm not dissing Blight, I think It's a great spell, but its more Situational than I'm used to.

[Akeldema]

What Ptr are you on mate?

[Souca]

Now in 20 seconds, I could have gotten off in my rotation 2 Heart Strikes which Average for 1K per mob, but can still crit for 2+K easily.

You should be able to get at least 4 heart strikes off per 20 second rotation. What else are you using blood runes for? Are converting blood runes to death runes for Oblit, Death Strike or Howling Blast?

When specced blood to solo old world raid bosses on my 80 DK I have the following rotation per 20 seconds:

Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Obliterate, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike

With Epidemic in the live servers the last Death Strike still has two diseases up to provide healing. The final two HS don't get any bonus damage as the diseases generally fall off by then. If HS is your strongest attack, you would want to maximize it. The only thing I can see replacing it with is a Pestilence to spread your plague, but depending on your spec you might not get the death rune conversion from it. Apologies for not looking at your specs right now, but I wanted to answer before I sleep. I'll try and look closer at the spec and play around with rotations tomorrow from work. Maybe I'll finally get off my ass and write that rotation simulator I've been meaning to code up.

Oh, and the DKs just hit 74 tonight. I plan to start working on instances sometime after 75 since I can start getting rep from tabards then and the more time I can avoid having to fly without an epic flier the better.

- Souca -

[Hachoo]

Now in 20 seconds, I could have gotten off in my rotation 2 Heart Strikes which Average for 1K per mob, but can still crit for 2+K easily.

You should be able to get at least 4 heart strikes off per 20 second rotation. What else are you using blood runes for? Are converting blood runes to death runes for Oblit, Death Strike or Howling Blast?

When specced blood to solo old world raid bosses on my 80 DK I have the following rotation per 20 seconds:

Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Obliterate, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike

With Epidemic in the live servers the last Death Strike still has two diseases up to provide healing. The final two HS don't get any bonus damage as the diseases generally fall off by then. If HS is your strongest attack, you would want to maximize it. The only thing I can see replacing it with is a Pestilence to spread your plague, but depending on your spec you might not get the death rune conversion from it. Apologies for not looking at your specs right now, but I wanted to answer before I sleep. I'll try and look closer at the spec and play around with rotations tomorrow from work. Maybe I'll finally get off my ass and write that rotation simulator I've been meaning to code up.

Oh, and the DKs just hit 74 tonight. I plan to start working on instances sometime after 75 since I can start getting rep from tabards then and the more time I can avoid having to fly without an epic flier the better.

- Souca -I don't think you get any rep from tabards until you enter a level 80 instance (utgarde pinnacle, halls of lightning, the oculus, etc). I ran instances all the way up to 80 with a tabard on and never got any rep until I hit UP for the first time.

[Varmon]

Interesting that blood aura is still obtainable from the improved blood presence talent, can you still get frost and unholy aura as well with those improved presences?

[Zerocool2024]

What Ptr are you on mate?Erm... the PVP one, Anasterian.

Toons names are Zerøein, Zerøzwei, Zerødrei, Zerøvier, Zerøfünf.




Now in 20 seconds, I could have gotten off in my rotation 2 Heart Strikes which Average for 1K per mob, but can still crit for 2+K easily.

You should be able to get at least 4 heart strikes off per 20 second rotation. What else are you using blood runes for? Are converting blood runes to death runes for Oblit, Death Strike or Howling Blast?

When specced blood to solo old world raid bosses on my 80 DK I have the following rotation per 20 seconds:

Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Obliterate, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike

With Epidemic in the live servers the last Death Strike still has two diseases up to provide healing. The final two HS don't get any bonus damage as the diseases generally fall off by then. If HS is your strongest attack, you would want to maximize it. The only thing I can see replacing it with is a Pestilence to spread your plague, but depending on your spec you might not get the death rune conversion from it. Apologies for not looking at your specs right now, but I wanted to answer before I sleep. I'll try and look closer at the spec and play around with rotations tomorrow from work. Maybe I'll finally get off my ass and write that rotation simulator I've been meaning to code up.

Oh, and the DKs just hit 74 tonight. I plan to start working on instances sometime after 75 since I can start getting rep from tabards then and the more time I can avoid having to fly without an epic flier the better.

- Souca -Yes, you can get 4 off in 20, sorry, I should have said in place of those 20 seconds and that "One" Unholy Blight being 20 seconds, I could get 2 Heart Strikes in place of it "Unholy Blight".


Interesting that blood aura is still obtainable from the improved blood presence talent, can you still get frost and unholy aura as well with those improved presences?Yes, they all stack. Just like before, only you won't see it. But there really is no reason to go that far into it (being frost) without HB...

[Souca]

Now in 20 seconds, I could have gotten off in my rotation 2 Heart Strikes which Average for 1K per mob, but can still crit for 2+K easily.

You should be able to get at least 4 heart strikes off per 20 second rotation. What else are you using blood runes for? Are converting blood runes to death runes for Oblit, Death Strike or Howling Blast?

When specced blood to solo old world raid bosses on my 80 DK I have the following rotation per 20 seconds:

Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike, Obliterate, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike

With Epidemic in the live servers the last Death Strike still has two diseases up to provide healing. The final two HS don't get any bonus damage as the diseases generally fall off by then. If HS is your strongest attack, you would want to maximize it. The only thing I can see replacing it with is a Pestilence to spread your plague, but depending on your spec you might not get the death rune conversion from it. Apologies for not looking at your specs right now, but I wanted to answer before I sleep. I'll try and look closer at the spec and play around with rotations tomorrow from work. Maybe I'll finally get off my ass and write that rotation simulator I've been meaning to code up.

Oh, and the DKs just hit 74 tonight. I plan to start working on instances sometime after 75 since I can start getting rep from tabards then and the more time I can avoid having to fly without an epic flier the better.

- Souca -I don't think you get any rep from tabards until you enter a level 80 instance (utgarde pinnacle, halls of lightning, the oculus, etc). I ran instances all the way up to 80 with a tabard on and never got any rep until I hit UP for the first time.Nope, you don't get any rep till the 80 instances. You need to be 75 to enter the 80 instances ;) Likely I was too sleepy to realize I won't be clearing anything at 75, so I might have to scratch that plan and do some lower instances just for XP. I shouldn't post when I'm that tired ;(

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

Well... You can Dungeon Grind, I did. I hated doing quests. I had no problem Dungeon grinding.

[Souca]

Well... You can Dungeon Grind, I did. I hated doing quests. I had no problem Dungeon grinding.Gear is the main thing. I have pretty good gear for surviving world PvP and quests, 14k health in frost at 74. I don't have any defense gear though, so I eat crits in instances. I'm going to have to level a blacksmith and miner no matter what, the question is whether I'm better off doing it now, or at 80? Level 77 will be the make or break point. I don't want to do Storm Peaks or Ice Crown without epic flying. I did it on my first DK and hated it. My druid was my second 80 and had epic flight form and I didn't have any issues with those zones. If I grind out the last few levels to 80 in isntances, then I end up with some gear and a bunch of quests to do for epic flight money. Just not sure I can do that without getting bored.

- Souca -

[Hachoo]

Why do you have to level a BS or miner? Nothing your DKs will need is BoP crafted - mining can be helpful but honestly its faster to just do dailies/quests and then buy bars off the AH then it is to farm the mats yourself.

[Souca]

Why do you have to level a BS or miner? Nothing your DKs will need is BoP crafted - mining can be helpful but honestly its faster to just do dailies/quests and then buy bars off the AH then it is to farm the mats yourself.True. It's not a necessity in the normal sense. I have a thing for self sufficiency. I like being able to do things on my own, it's the main reason I box. I don't' want to have to rely on mats or BoEs being on the auction house. another reason is that I'm planning on RaFing up a large number of characters. It will get prohibitive to buy everything even with access to endless dailies. I also enjoy end game proffesions to some extent. Mining can be relaxing when I just want to wander around looking for World PvP, same with herbing. If I don't feel like farming, I can always buy. But if I don't have the professions I can't farm when I don't feel like buying ;) I also like the BS sockets for my tanks.

As for buying things, right now my toons are pretty poor. I think I've got just over 10k in the guild bank and I've yet to buy flying and cold weather flying. My two 80s are on another server and are horde, so I can't easily get money from 80s quests from them. In the long run I'm not worried about money, I'm just trying to be careful about where I spend it until I have a team at 80. Gearing out 5 DKs to blood tank instances will require crafted gear. I'm not sure I want to buy it all and push epic flying out further into the future. Doing dailies without epic flying is possible, but I'm not sure I'd want to do it more than I had too.

Anyone know if there is a good list of gold rewards per zone for quests at 80? Something like Zul'Drak is worth 5k at 80, Grizzly Hills is worth 4.2k? something like this might be useful in deciding if its worth skipping a zone to quest for cash at 80. If there isn't I might have to create one. Would anyone use something like that?

- Souca -

[Multibocks]

Well my DKs are now pulling 1400dps, but so is my tank, lol. I cant figure out what I am doing wrong... /shrug. They are close to hit capped with highest having +12% hit, so good to go for raid bosses. Im pretty sure that means none of their spells miss in a heroic instance, but Im not positive. With that in mind I can use /castsequence, because I know nothing will miss. Anyways I've definitely noticed the improvement, most bosses I tend to hide my druid until I need a group heal =)

edit: of course there are those damn bosses that throw out massive AE damage and I just have to sit my druid in it =(

[Souca]

Hit cap for special abilities against a skull mob is 9%. Depending on what spec the DKs are this might be enough. I forget what the number is for normal melee swings and other abilities, but you should be good with 12%.

As for the 1400 dps, I'm curious what you attack power and rotations are like. If you are going a blood self heal route then the number is reasonable, but it feels low for a standard dps build. I would expect something around 1600-1800, but I could be off since its been a while since I've been dps specced on my 80 DK.

- Souca -

[jinx08]

I've managed to talk my brother into respeccing resto on his shaman. We will be instancing together, he on his shammy, me on 4 dk's.
Now do I respec unholy or stay blood? I really enjoy the blood tree, and love the extra heling you get from it. I've heard unholy is a superior tanking spec though? Frost doesn't interest me in the slightest by the way, so that's out the picture entirely.
Any suggestions would be appreciated :)

[Multibocks]

Hit cap for special abilities against a skull mob is 9%. Depending on what spec the DKs are this might be enough. I forget what the number is for normal melee swings and other abilities, but you should be good with 12%.

As for the 1400 dps, I'm curious what you attack power and rotations are like. If you are going a blood self heal route then the number is reasonable, but it feels low for a standard dps build. I would expect something around 1600-1800, but I could be off since its been a while since I've been dps specced on my 80 DK.

- Souca -

Icy Touch, PS, Blood Strike, Blood Strike, Obliterate, DC

edit: this is of course all specced into Bloodworms, Blood Aura and then into Unholy for perma ghoul.

[Multibocks]

Man I upgraded to T7 chest on all my guys and was severely disappointed in the "upgrade' compared to what they were wearing before.

They were all wearing Eck BP ('http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43310') with sta and hit gems. Armory seems to be down, but my guild is Vindication on Dentarg (US). Anyways going to T7 Lost Vanquisher ('http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39617') with +hit and +str gems... I really didnt seem to gain much. I dont count +haste as a gain as its a terrible stat for DKs. I lost a ton of hit, in fact all of my upgrades are taking away hit. I might have to gem solely for it now and ignore gem bonuses. Sucks.

[Zerocool2024]

Well... You can Dungeon Grind, I did. I hated doing quests. I had no problem Dungeon grinding.Gear is the main thing. I have pretty good gear for surviving world PvP and quests, 14k health in frost at 74. I don't have any defense gear though, so I eat crits in instances. I'm going to have to level a blacksmith and miner no matter what, the question is whether I'm better off doing it now, or at 80? Level 77 will be the make or break point. I don't want to do Storm Peaks or Ice Crown without epic flying. I did it on my first DK and hated it. My druid was my second 80 and had epic flight form and I didn't have any issues with those zones. If I grind out the last few levels to 80 in isntances, then I end up with some gear and a bunch of quests to do for epic flight money. Just not sure I can do that without getting bored.

- Souca -Eating crits is what I was best at doing Dungeons. I know you seen one of my vids, I never had decent gear for the dungeon, but I was still able to pull it off.
As to gear, Cobalt, running like 20/30 G a piece. I has no idea what it might be on your server, but you don't need to level anything as long as you has the money, and if you Dungeon grind, trust me, you are going to have the money. All the AH stuff you can sell, and Vendor trash, hell, my first tab in my guild vault is almost full with AH blues that I need to sell, mostly from doing LOH/HOS.

Also, all 5 of my toons have their flying mount, but only two have Wrath flying learned. Just enough to summon them to the next area (HOS/HOL) and get the flight path and that's all I needed. Also, SAVE THE MONEY once you get your gear for the mid 70's because I'm learning the hard way that for Heroics, YOU ARE GOING TO NEED 540 Defense or higher. Also, as much HP as possible. I did some runs, or a lot, and did some tests and in the end, my lack of defense hurt me, but the one thing that hurt me more was my HP. It's way to low. I mean, just from one Epix piece Tempered Titansteel Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Titansteel_Helm') has blue/meta gem slot with 165STA and my current one Tempered Saronite Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Saronite_Helm') has only 54 Sta, but has more Defense that I of course can make up in the end with a different trinket. But just from that one item, it would take me from 21000Hp to 32000+HP without geming it. Do I need say more?

Then also add in the Epix boots and thats an extra 500 HP, so I 'm looking more towards the 4K area with HP, which would alow for me to do Heroics, no problems what so ever. Get a few Heroics under your belt, or just run Nexus and kill that first guy and get a Heroic shard thing and get enough to buy some other Defense gear and you are set.

[Souca]

Well... You can Dungeon Grind, I did. I hated doing quests. I had no problem Dungeon grinding.Gear is the main thing. I have pretty good gear for surviving world PvP and quests, 14k health in frost at 74. I don't have any defense gear though, so I eat crits in instances. I'm going to have to level a blacksmith and miner no matter what, the question is whether I'm better off doing it now, or at 80? Level 77 will be the make or break point. I don't want to do Storm Peaks or Ice Crown without epic flying. I did it on my first DK and hated it. My druid was my second 80 and had epic flight form and I didn't have any issues with those zones. If I grind out the last few levels to 80 in isntances, then I end up with some gear and a bunch of quests to do for epic flight money. Just not sure I can do that without getting bored.

- Souca -Eating crits is what I was best at doing Dungeons. I know you seen one of my vids, I never had decent gear for the dungeon, but I was still able to pull it off.
As to gear, Cobalt, running like 20/30 G a piece. I has no idea what it might be on your server, but you don't need to level anything as long as you has the money, and if you Dungeon grind, trust me, you are going to have the money. All the AH stuff you can sell, and Vendor trash, hell, my first tab in my guild vault is almost full with AH blues that I need to sell, mostly from doing LOH/HOS.

Also, all 5 of my toons have their flying mount, but only two have Wrath flying learned. Just enough to summon them to the next area (HOS/HOL) and get the flight path and that's all I needed. Also, SAVE THE MONEY once you get your gear for the mid 70's because I'm learning the hard way that for Heroics, YOU ARE GOING TO NEED 540 Defense or higher. Also, as much HP as possible. I did some runs, or a lot, and did some tests and in the end, my lack of defense hurt me, but the one thing that hurt me more was my HP. It's way to low. I mean, just from one Epix piece Tempered Titansteel Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Titansteel_Helm') has blue/meta gem slot with 165STA and my current one Tempered Saronite Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Saronite_Helm') has only 54 Sta, but has more Defense that I of course can make up in the end with a different trinket. But just from that one item, it would take me from 21000Hp to 32000+HP without geming it. Do I need say more?

Then also add in the Epix boots and thats an extra 500 HP, so I 'm looking more towards the 4K area with HP, which would alow for me to do Heroics, no problems what so ever. Get a few Heroics under your belt, or just run Nexus and kill that first guy and get a Heroic shard thing and get enough to buy some other Defense gear and you are set.I hear you on the 540, and trust me, I know how to get there. I had my 80 DK at 540 defense before they put out 3.0.8 and handed everyone a free 25 defense or 125ish defense rating. I did the whole thing where I had to use daunting gloves and legs, tempered saronite and so on. Farmed the defense trinket from HoL.

Works been kicking my ass this week, so I haven't gotten to do much of anything. I'm trying to do some math to see how much money I'd get from questing if I skipped a zone like Grizzly Hills or Zul'Drak and grinded out in instances. I figure I can do both those zones without a flier, I've done it before, and it could give me a huge income boost if I need it after the grinding. Would rather know I can make X questing and then grind than grind and find out I still need some more money to get the epic fliers.

Once I figure something out, I'll keep everyone informed.

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

Well... You can Dungeon Grind, I did. I hated doing quests. I had no problem Dungeon grinding.Gear is the main thing. I have pretty good gear for surviving world PvP and quests, 14k health in frost at 74. I don't have any defense gear though, so I eat crits in instances. I'm going to have to level a blacksmith and miner no matter what, the question is whether I'm better off doing it now, or at 80? Level 77 will be the make or break point. I don't want to do Storm Peaks or Ice Crown without epic flying. I did it on my first DK and hated it. My druid was my second 80 and had epic flight form and I didn't have any issues with those zones. If I grind out the last few levels to 80 in isntances, then I end up with some gear and a bunch of quests to do for epic flight money. Just not sure I can do that without getting bored.

- Souca -Eating crits is what I was best at doing Dungeons. I know you seen one of my vids, I never had decent gear for the dungeon, but I was still able to pull it off.
As to gear, Cobalt, running like 20/30 G a piece. I has no idea what it might be on your server, but you don't need to level anything as long as you has the money, and if you Dungeon grind, trust me, you are going to have the money. All the AH stuff you can sell, and Vendor trash, hell, my first tab in my guild vault is almost full with AH blues that I need to sell, mostly from doing LOH/HOS.

Also, all 5 of my toons have their flying mount, but only two have Wrath flying learned. Just enough to summon them to the next area (HOS/HOL) and get the flight path and that's all I needed. Also, SAVE THE MONEY once you get your gear for the mid 70's because I'm learning the hard way that for Heroics, YOU ARE GOING TO NEED 540 Defense or higher. Also, as much HP as possible. I did some runs, or a lot, and did some tests and in the end, my lack of defense hurt me, but the one thing that hurt me more was my HP. It's way to low. I mean, just from one Epix piece Tempered Titansteel Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Titansteel_Helm') has blue/meta gem slot with 165STA and my current one Tempered Saronite Helm ('http://www.wowwiki.com/Tempered_Saronite_Helm') has only 54 Sta, but has more Defense that I of course can make up in the end with a different trinket. But just from that one item, it would take me from 21000Hp to 32000+HP without geming it. Do I need say more?

Then also add in the Epix boots and thats an extra 500 HP, so I 'm looking more towards the 4K area with HP, which would alow for me to do Heroics, no problems what so ever. Get a few Heroics under your belt, or just run Nexus and kill that first guy and get a Heroic shard thing and get enough to buy some other Defense gear and you are set.I hear you on the 540, and trust me, I know how to get there. I had my 80 DK at 540 defense before they put out 3.0.8 and handed everyone a free 25 defense or 125ish defense rating. I did the whole thing where I had to use daunting gloves and legs, tempered saronite and so on. Farmed the defense trinket from HoL.

Works been kicking my ass this week, so I haven't gotten to do much of anything. I'm trying to do some math to see how much money I'd get from questing if I skipped a zone like Grizzly Hills or Zul'Drak and grinded out in instances. I figure I can do both those zones without a flier, I've done it before, and it could give me a huge income boost if I need it after the grinding. Would rather know I can make X questing and then grind than grind and find out I still need some more money to get the epic fliers.

Once I figure something out, I'll keep everyone informed.

- Souca -Well, since I control the speed of my Dungeon runs, and I can do them pretty fast, I get money pretty fast. Right now HOL is on a 90% no death run, and if there is a death, it's just some crazy ass random fluke that the boss does some nasty dps and kills a toon or two, but even then, I usually still take the boss down. I did questing with the shamans, but with the DK's, I did straight Dungeon and a few quests for certain items, or to get a quest to do a Dungeon to get an item.

Not sure on my Money per hour per say, though I could run some numbers on a run and see what I get.

[Zerocool2024]

Lol woops, sorry, my math was Phuked up when I was doing it, I was not pay attention to my fingers when typing. So Yeah, not 32000Hp, lol. I meant 23000+ lol.

[Souca]

Yea, I was gonna say, thats impressive. My well geared 80 DK that solos old raids is at 29k unbuffed and I was impressed by that.

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

Soooo, just thought I would give a little "glowing hope for the 5boxer DKs". I did this a few minutes ago.

3 of the toons have 540 Defense, and the other two are in the 520's.
First boss, zero deaths, was easier that I thought. (not boasting) but I thought he would have pwned my face in harder than I thought. Probably just got lucky with the CD's and my timing.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030509_231328.jpg

And...second boss I had one death (Guess which one?) the one who didn't have 540 defense and managed to pull aggro and got his face rearranged with 2 crits that made me sad in the pants...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030509_233749.jpg

More to come :) I probably should have started off with an easier Dungeon for clearing "attempt". But, eh, I'm happy with my progress.

I Promised there would be more, lol.

3rd boss, the hardest boss in the freaking world, at least for me right now.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030609_010118.jpg

And now, the last boss, simple sauce, and I got the Timely Death Achievement with it, lol.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030609_010908.jpg

[Multibocks]

Very nice! I dont do HoL, that third boss annoys the hell outta me. I did Nexus yesterday as it was the daily and surprisingly I didnt wipe! I remember the last boss being a lot harder in a PuG, but I beat it down easily. Oh, however I did duo that whirlwind jerk (bonus boss) from 30% with my druid as he killed my slaves real quick. It seems there is a bug in his whirlwind though, if you tank him standing on top of the divider between the hallway and the ice area where he spawns, sometimes it will not hit even though he does the animation. (No I didnt dodge it, etc... sorry for the run-on sentence!)

[Zerocool2024]

Yeah, that is the one thorn in my side, I hate that boss ever so much. It's a fluke everytime I down him. One time I can have this perfect run on him, and then he gets this crazy ass combo and throws that dot on me that has a push back on it, well, it goes off and throws me right into his little static bawls thing and it kills me (not so much on normal now, but on Heroic, it's pretty bad), some times I live with the force field thing, other times I just used it and Rune tap so I have no way of surviving for the next 30 seconds.

I treat him like the first time with a girl (you have an idea where what is supposed to go where, but it dosen't always seem to go as planned ?(, and with the lights off, you better hope she's understanding 8| ) lol...

That is honestly the hardest boss I have ever faced. I know without any resilience gear, aoe bosses are so hard to do. But any boss that melee beats the piss out of you, I can find out ways to down them quicker than a caster.

[Souca]

Grats man!

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

Thanks Souca!, now I need to run off and attempt some other places. I assumed that with going backwards in the Heroic dungeons (hardest, or atleast, the hardest 5man) I should be fine in the other dungeons like UK and Nexus. But the second I get all my toons in the 23000+ HP range and with 540 defense, it's open game for me to do whatever, lol.

[Souca]

So after reading your post this morning I took a character to the auction house to pick up the cobalt stuff. It was around 20g each on my server, but sadly I cuoldn't get the entire set or even pieces for all 5. Looks like I might have to contact a BS through trade to get some stuff made. I managed to get 3 boots, 2 chest, 2 shoulders and a helm from the AH. This is why I wanted my own BS ;)

- Souca -

[Multibocks]

if you guys were on my server I would help ya out, lol. I just spent 5k on leveling JC on all my slaves =(

[Zerocool2024]

hehe, the gear will help a lot... What spec are you running?

[Multibocks]

me?


also, the last 10 points from 290-300 on JC can be as much as 100g per point. Im dead serious. Stupid, just stupid.

[Zerocool2024]

Erm, Souca :)

[Souca]

Haven't decided yet. Gonna play around and see what I can get with enough Blood to self sustain. Likely something blood/unholy. Got distracted on the tournament real playing 2s tonight and saw The Watchmen, so no time for DKs.

- Souca -

[Zerocool2024]

A little more hope :)

Used Army on this one, had too, lol. I did lose some people on it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030709_150345.jpg

EASY...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030709_151027.jpg

PAIN IN THE ASS... Died first attempt (got him down to 20% before I died. (used army to get him the second time.)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030709_152522.jpg

Lost 3 people on this fight, for whatever reason it kept screwing up and keeping me in skelly form, or it let me use my normal attacks while in skelly, then he would do his little transform thing and I would get stuck and his poison cloud would kill me because he would not stop with the channel, was kind of off.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/deadend2020/WoWScrnShot_030709_155036.jpg

[Multibocks]

With the last boss of Gundrak do not hit ability buttons during a transition. It seems DKs are especially vulnerable to this as when you do sometimes during skelly mode you will stay in DK form and then you get no lifetap button and your abilities are all wacked out. Basically you will most likely die before you get back to DK form for a group runetap. It's so annoying, but I just wait until my skeleton bar comes up fully before I touch any keys and this seems to help bugging the whole thing. (Also make sure to do the same thing when you transition back.) I dont have problems with weird deaths when I do this.

edit: I mean Draktheron, not Gundrak. Doh.

[Souca]

Well I managed to get some pieces of the cobalt gear off the AH, but only enough for one character. Started playing with trash in UK last night and got to Prince without a death. Died on Prince and it was getting late so I decided to crash. I'll need to get the rest of the cobalt set, but mostly I need to work on the macros and just put some time in on the bosses.

I'll try and write more later, but work is just insane lately.

- Souca -

[Multibocks]

Another note for you on the bosses you did: Using army of undead on Trollgore is asking to wipe. You will get lucky, sure, but he has an ability that makes him hit harder the more stuff that is in LoS of him. So Army of Undead, blood worms, and your pets will make him hit a % harder. When I finish him off, with just pets and worms, he has a 15 stack of consume going. I can't remember how hard it makes him hit, but it is definitely noticeable. I imagine Army makes him a bloody beast.
With the last boss of Drak, dont use Army on this guy either. It will just mess up the rotation from undead -> live and they all die in the first pool of goo anyways. Really its hard to wipe on him if you use the strat I posted earlier. When undead hit #4 button (lifetap), when you go live, runetap and beat him down. Repeat and loot! :D

edit: Oh btw I just skip the Trex boss. He is the ULTIMATE random boss. You can be fine and then suddenly he uses two of his abilities in a row and your "tank" is dead. I hate this guy.

[Zerocool2024]

Another note for you on the bosses you did: Using army of undead on Trollgore is asking to wipe. You will get lucky, sure, but he has an ability that makes him hit harder the more stuff that is in LoS of him. So Army of Undead, blood worms, and your pets will make him hit a % harder. When I finish him off, with just pets and worms, he has a 15 stack of consume going. I can't remember how hard it makes him hit, but it is definitely noticeable. I imagine Army makes him a bloody beast.
With the last boss of Drak, dont use Army on this guy either. It will just mess up the rotation from undead -> live and they all die in the first pool of goo anyways. Really its hard to wipe on him if you use the strat I posted earlier. When undead hit #4 button (lifetap), when you go live, runetap and beat him down. Repeat and loot! :D

edit: Oh btw I just skip the Trex boss. He is the ULTIMATE random boss. You can be fine and then suddenly he uses two of his abilities in a row and your "tank" is dead. I hate this guy.Yeah, I did remember you saying a little while ago about having a hard time with him because of the worms and such.
I've done him once without Army of Undead and I got him pretty low before I die.

Second attempt used AoD and I got him to 30% before all my pets were dead, then I just popped IBF,Vamp then in 10 seconds pop Lichborne and he was dead while I was all still alive and full health.
After that, the next 3 clears of that Dungeon I did it and have not died yet.

Even on Trexx, I did him without Army and I got him in the 20%'s before I died again.
Used AoD and I'vedropped him every time since.

Last boss I don't have because of using it on Trexx, but I still get that bug a lot. Lol.

But then again, with my current gear, I won't need AoD for him anymore, the second boss is a cake walk, AoD on Trexx because of his fear/wtfcrit, and the last boss is all about not bugging yourself.

[Multibocks]

yeah the fear wtf/crit, lol. I swear hes fine until about 20% and it's like he goes crazy on you. I even run undead DKs so I can negate one fear. I just gave up on him because it was so frustrating to get him low and die consistently. I didnt think of popping AoD on him though!

[Souca]

I really dislike the TRex boss. When I was running Nax 10 and some 25 regularly on my resto druid, I'd watch off tanks that stood up to Patchwerk get gibbed by that boss. He does a fear and by the time I get turned around and am starting to cast the tank would be dead. There are so many line of sight issues in that area too that the AOE fears is just wrong. It's likely easier to DK box since you self heal and if you live through the fear you don't have to worry about LoS.

As for my gals, they are all at least 275 mining and one is 300+. The blacksmith is around 390 and was able to make all the cobalt gear for them. I was having a hell of a time getting it off the AH, so I just blew a ton of gold and leveled BS. I'll need to make other gear evetually, so its worth it. As for the mining, having 5 Titansteel cooldowns will be handy when I start crafting the maces and epic pieces.

Arean tourny has been eating most of my time, so I haven't done much more than the mining and BS leveling. Hoping to get some time in on UK/Nexus this weekend. Even though I out level them a bit at 74, I am going to make myself do them for practice and to get my macros sorted out. I might even go back and do Steamvaults as well for the rep. After Nexus/UK, where should I head next and is there a level I want to be before I move on?

- Souca -