new poster, long time boxer, TOS question

[Sean582]

Hi guys, I've been dual boxing WoW for about a year know and I LOVE IT, i can never go back. I play a prot warrior and a lock, pure tank and spank.

Question, I wanna start using rapid-fire on my xkeys, so i can hold keys down instead of tapping them over and over, would this be against blizz TOS? I'm still holding the button, I don't see them throwing a fuss if they catch it.

Thanks guys, great forums.

[Crayonbox]

I think this goes in the gray area which you should avoid.

Putting in delays in your macros is considered automation even if you are pressing the button, thus I believe this is also considered automation and should not be used.

[elsegundo]

i do see where this can be a problem. i wouldnt do it. but if in doubt, open a ticket.

[Vyndree]

I think this goes in the gray area which you should avoid.

I actually read a blue post that confirmed that holding down a repeating keypress was a no-no. I'll find the quote... sec...



Hello Blizzard,

After unsuccessfully attempting to get clarification via an in-game ticket, I would like to see if the rules can be clarified regarding key repeating software. In light of recent bans, it is unclear what is or isn't allowed, and bearing in mind the majority of players want to follow the rules, it would be of great help if a statement could be made regarding key repeating software.

Previously, the apparent community understanding had been: if it doesn't automate gameplay, and requires you to be present at the keyboard playing the game, then it is legal. It seems with recent bans, this may not actually be the case.

My specific question is: is it okay to use software (or hardware drivers, or external hardware devices) that continually repeat ("spam") a key bound in-game to a macro or ability while another key is held down and while a player is present at the keyboard playing the game? For Hunters, for instance, spamming our shot rotation macro. I'm sure other classes have similar needs, perhaps not 10-20 times per second like a Hunter, but the same idea. Many aspects of the game make key spamming desirable, but is it legitimate to use external drivers/software to achieve it?

I'd love to not have to break my keyboard, fingers, and wrist to achieve maximum DPS, but I would also hate to wake up one morning and find I was banned for using a repeater. Please help myself and other Hunters follow the rules :)

Thanks.

This is not okay. One hardware function = one action, according to standard macro rules. A hardware function is a keypress (including press/release) associated with movement and an ability/item. Obviously, our default macro rules enable you to use 'modifying' trinkets or abilities, such as nature's swiftness, plus a single spell all in a single press.

To clarify: No, you may not use hardware or software to auto-spam your shot rotations - period.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=6762551711&pageNo=1&sid=1#8

[Sean582]

ok thank you for clarification.



I had another button that I make open my bacpack and cast shield bash at the same time (don't ash), since those can both be done in one macro if I wanted to then I guess I'm good.



thanks all!!

[algol]

I had another button that I make open my bacpack and cast shield bash at the same time (don't ash), since those can both be done in one macro if I wanted to then I guess I'm good.
If you do it in a macro, sure. If you do it with a "keyboard macro"...well, that depends how well they programmed Warden.

It's not just what you do, it's also often how you do it.

[Vyndree]

If you do it with a "keyboard macro"...well, that depends how well they programmed Warden.

Out-of-WoW macros are perfectly fine, as long as they do only what can normally done with an in-game /macro.

See the "GM Conversations" in our wiki for quotes, or go to the customer service forums and check the general sticky for G15 macro questions.



Gota love Vyndree and her Blizzard blue post smack downs!

/flex ;)

[badashh]

Gota love Vyndree and her Blizzard blue post smack downs!

I wonder if when her and Suvega have a argument she has a blue post to counter anything he says...

[Tidomann]

According to the blizzard gm YOU DO THE DISHESSSSSSSSS

[Schwarz]

If you do it with a "keyboard macro"...well, that depends how well they programmed Warden.

Out-of-WoW macros are perfectly fine, as long as they do only what can normally done with an in-game /macro.

See the "GM Conversations" in our wiki for quotes, or go to the customer service forums and check the general sticky for G15 macro questions.



Gota love Vyndree and her Blizzard blue post smack downs!

/flex ;)
I am still confused by this out of game macro stuff. If i use my n52 to send something like

"/assist shaone
/focus
"

is that ok? What I am physically doing is pressing 1 button and having alot of keystrokes sent. So how is this different than having the n52 sending 2 numeric characters every time I press one button? I have a feeling that it comes down to what happens in game (ie one press one action) but i am unsure on this stuff.

I was paranoid as hell when i was messing around with my n52 and was sending keystrokes like "ctrl+1" b/c I was too lazy to change my keybindings ingame. The only way I could figure this out was by recording a macro that ending up looking like

ctrl press down
pause xxx
1 press down
pause xxx
ctrl lifted up
pause xxx
1 lifted up

[Rin]

Oh man, if you have pauses in your macros - DONT POST ABOUT IT, for your characters sake. It's totally aganist Blizz's rules.

Think about it this way:

If I have a healer, and I create a macro that basically: /casts Circle of Healing (loop until I stop hitting the key)... that means I'm doing 1 key press for an infinite amount of actions. This goes aganist Blizzards TOS. I'm sure there are plenty of people here who have macros like that (above), but you're going to want to keep it under wraps if you're doing that.

[Svpernova09]

If you do it with a "keyboard macro"...well, that depends how well they programmed Warden.

Out-of-WoW macros are perfectly fine, as long as they do only what can normally done with an in-game /macro.

See the "GM Conversations" in our wiki for quotes, or go to the customer service forums and check the general sticky for G15 macro questions.



Gota love Vyndree and her Blizzard blue post smack downs!

/flex ;)
I am still confused by this out of game macro stuff. If i use my n52 to send something like

"/assist shaone
/focus
"

is that ok? What I am physically doing is pressing 1 button and having alot of keystrokes sent. So how is this different than having the n52 sending 2 numeric characters every time I press one button? I have a feeling that it comes down to what happens in game (ie one press one action) but i am unsure on this stuff.

I was paranoid as hell when i was messing around with my n52 and was sending keystrokes like "ctrl+1" b/c I was too lazy to change my keybindings ingame. The only way I could figure this out was by recording a macro that ending up looking like

ctrl press down
pause xxx
1 press down
pause xxx
ctrl lifted up
pause xxx
1 lifted upI use 2 nostromo n52s and yes, macroing in their software violates the WoW ToS because you're using 1 hardware key press to send multiple actions / characters. To stay in line with the ToS you can't use those features of the n52.

[Vyndree]

Think of it this way -- Your G15 and N52 are either extra keybindings, or extra macro space. You're perfectly fine making an macro just like you would in-game. And you're perfectly fine making a keypress just as you would in game.

However, anything regarding "pause", "delay", or advanced decisionmaking (that can't be done in an in-game /macro) is a no-no.

Schwarz -- your macro would be fine if you just removed the "pause" part. CTRL is a modifier key, and 1 is a keypress. So you should be hokie dokie as long as the "pause" bit goes away.

[Xar]

Back on my old computer and while playing SWG I had to have short pauses between modifiers and the actual keystroke. On my new system I never use them. I don't believe those short pauses between modifiers and actual hardware events are of concern, only pauses between an action and another action which would allow for botting and getting multiple actions in game per one hardware event. Those pauses in his macro would be normal pauses if you were humanly pressing them. When I played SWG I found 20ms was a good value between modifier and keystroke.

One thing though, should be ctrl down, 1 down, 1 up, ctrl up.

Edit: Of course if your ctrl key did something in-game by itself then yeah those pauses would not be ok.

[Schwarz]

It just seems strange to me that you are allowed to "instantly" push a couple keystrokes to the game with one physical push. Are these automation arguments simple black and white or are there shades of gray?

I would think that there would be a difference in enforcement.

When I press ctrl + 1 I refresh my watershields on my guys. (that is just the keystrokes the actionbar is bound too). When I lay my totems it is alt+1 (earth) alt+2(fire) alt+3(air) alt+4(water)

Using the n52/g15 to send these keystrokes be it with a pause or without I seems pretty harmless.

Now setting up something were you cast something pause until just under the gcd then cast again. Or setup a loop of somesort to always do something. This is what seems bad and no one should be doing.

Right now for me neither is an issue b/c I play with a keyboard and type everything by hand. But last week when i dusted off the n52 and tried it out I didn't want to redo my actionbar bindings. Maybe I just need to spend some time and map all of my 2 keypress bindings also to an unused 1 keypress binding so I work with the n52 without worrying about it.

[Vyndree]

Because CTRL is a modifier key it doesn't start a GCD. Therefore, it is ok, because when you press CTRL in game, it does nothing.

If you bound CTRL to a button (let's say Water Shield) and 1 to a button (let's say Lightning Bolt), then the macro would cast Water Shield and throw an error that your spell isn't ready yet (because you're still in the GCD). This is also OK -- WoW's mechanics still make it so only one spell gets cast per GCD.

If you bound CTRL to your trinket and 1 to a button (lightning bolt), then the macro would trinket and Lightning Bolt immediately. This is OK, because you can do that in a macro (i.e. /cast Trinket /cast Lightning Bolt). You are not getting around any GCD restrictions and your activities can be done using an in-game macro.

If you bound CTRL to a button (water shield) and 1 to a button (lightning bolt) and had a delay of 1.5 seconds (GCD), then this is not OK. Why? Because there is no way to get around a GCD using a in-game macro.



Make sense? It doesn't matter how many buttons your out-of-game macro is pressing, as long as the result is nothing that couldn't also be done by a single button-press in-game (i.e. via in-game /macros).



EDIT: Note that it's ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS best to get your "legal" advice directly from Blizzard. If at any time you're suspicious about the specifics of a ToU/Eula rule, you should always get your advice direct from the source. :) We try to be as accurate as we can, but in the end it's Blizzard who makes the rules. :)

[Ualaa]

Without a G11/G15/N52, you would be restricted to in-game macro's. These macro's can be put onto keybinds, so clicking the keybind activates the macro.

With one of the above devices, any macro that could be constructed in game, and activated via a keybind will be fine, even if the macro is stored on the device rather then in-game.
The key is, the macro would work fine if it were made in game, keybound and the device just did the keybind for you.