Anyone else think war is crud?

[Youngceo]

First the install doesnt want to give me a .exe, and the patcher doesnt want to load, so I go googlin for one that works. Finally get it patched so I run it, and it locks up about 5sec into the menus, try to get back in and it black screens me (this is on my fresh laptop aswell, not just 1 pc). After about half an hour I finally get in...

Sorry but I dont get whats so special about it, they've ripped most of it off wow (with new words yay) and the graphics look horrid. I was expecting something at least fun to look at but its just horrid and runs pretty average for what looks pretty poor.

So after about an hour of playing I go to use my hearthstone ripoff and the game just quits on me... didnt bother loading it back up after that. One of my mates hasnt bought it yet so hes buying my copy, Might try it in 6 months once things are working properly if it hasnt sunk already to the ocean floor next to Age of conan.

Queue the QQ of hyped up fanboys.... now :thumbsup:

[Alienenduro]

I tried the beta and wasnt really all that impressed but thats probably due to the fact that ive recently just started multiboxing and its made wow feel like its my first ever mmo (the one you really love.) I wont be leaving wow anytime soon.

I am a member of an online gaming community and the ones that have been playing since the first beta are getting tired of it already.

[Youngceo]

The only thing I see going for it at the moment is its something fresh, its nothing new though. From the hearthstones to the "wargroup aka raid" its just a bad rip of wow.

Once the novelty wears off its gonna be real hard for it to survive.

[NoobShammy]

First the install doesnt want to give me a .exe, and the patcher doesnt want to load, so I go googlin for one that works. Finally get it patched so I run it, and it locks up about 5sec into the menus, try to get back in and it black screens me (this is on my fresh laptop aswell, not just 1 pc). After about half an hour I finally get in...

Sorry but I dont get whats so special about it, they've ripped most of it off wow (with new words yay) and the graphics look horrid. I was expecting something at least fun to look at but its just horrid and runs pretty average for what looks pretty poor.

So after about an hour of playing I go to use my hearthstone ripoff and the game just quits on me... didnt bother loading it back up after that. One of my mates hasnt bought it yet so hes buying my copy, Might try it in 6 months once things are working properly if it hasnt sunk already to the ocean floor next to Age of conan.

Queue the QQ of hyped up fanboys.... now :thumbsup:

I think you are being a bit hash and that is me putting it nicely. Did you play wow on day 1? If so you know about teh 3 hour loot lag and the week or so of on agian off again down time. MMO's will all do this at launch its the nature of the beast. As for rip on wow, well im sure there are many aspects that have been ripped. Don think for a moment that wow has not ripped a number of ideas of war for wolk....think achievements.

[shockernub]

I really thought the install and start up of WAR was a lot better than WOW has been historically.

[Anastasiya]

Ok.. Having been on when WoW launched, and Lord of the Rings, and Age of Conan. WAR has by a HUGE margin a much better and smooth roll out then any of the other MMOs that have been released so far.

If you had problems installing the game and getting going, you can't blame that on the game it self, because well the game can't install and set up it's self. You only tried the game for an hour?

I personally am having alot of fun with the game. Just like WOW and all the other MMOs it takes a few hours to actually get in to the game, and get a feel for how it works and plays. Yes it's different then Warcraft, but then it's not WOW so don't expect it to be the same. Yes there is a lot of things that are taken from other games. Achievments which wasn't started with WOW... or even LOTR for that matter. There really isn't so much a new idea for MMOs as it is an old idea re worked in a new fashion.

Any how. WAR is a good game so far. This may change at level cap with a lack of things to do like AoC had, but that is yet to be seen. The PvP is ALOT better in WAR then in WOW tho, as it has been far more ballanced for PvP, Where WOW is ballanced around PvE with PvP as an afterthough.

Give the game a try, level to 10 then give your opinon of it before you trash it down before you even get in to playing it.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

I think you guys miss his entire point. If the game is that hard to get into and dumps on him regularly, why should he be generous? Also, graphics appearance is a subjective measure for most people, so his opinion is entirely valid. I haven't played it and have no intention of playing it so I have no vested interest either way. Just saying, after the whining I see about WoWs little glitches, this is fairly tame for someone that has this much trouble just getting the game to run stable.

[Sanctume]

First the install doesnt want to give me a .exe, and the patcher doesnt want to load, so I go googlin for one that works. Finally get it patched so I run it, and it locks up about 5sec into the menus, try to get back in and it black screens me (this is on my fresh laptop aswell, not just 1 pc). After about half an hour I finally get in...

If you have the retail CD, I don't see why the thousands of players have zero issues installing the game? Care to look at your flaws and a user before tossing blame?
If you're talking about the beta, it is no longer beta, maybe you should clarify your rant above.


Sorry but I dont get whats so special about it, they've ripped most of it off wow (with new words yay) and the graphics look horrid. I was expecting something at least fun to look at but its just horrid and runs pretty average for what looks pretty poor.

There's little originality in WoW. Most of the concepts are from what works from it's predessor. WoW is a huge improvement of EQ, not so original. You sound like a wow fanboi.
And why are you "sorry" for stating an opinion? You don't like the graphics, that's your opinion. Players have enjoyed online Pong and had fun despite the graphics.


So after about an hour of playing I go to use my hearthstone ripoff and the game just quits on me... didnt bother loading it back up after that. One of my mates hasnt bought it yet so hes buying my copy, Might try it in 6 months once things are working properly if it hasnt sunk already to the ocean floor next to Age of conan.

LOL Heartstone ripoff. There were recall scrolls back in UO, a game of 10+ years ago. There were also recall scrolls in MUD--Multi User Dungeons that was played over ftp. I think Dungeon & Dragons have gate spells too. I di dnot play Conan, so you're more informed on be about that. You sound very well informed for playing that game's heartstone in 1 hours time. Impressive.


Queue the QQ of hyped up fanboys.... now :thumbsup:

It's really great of you to pre-judge responses with the derogatory term "fanboys." and it should be "fanboi." Grats. GG.

[Sanctume]

I tried the beta and wasnt really all that impressed but thats probably due to the fact that ive recently just started multiboxing and its made wow feel like its my first ever mmo (the one you really love.) I wont be leaving wow anytime soon.

I am a member of an online gaming community and the ones that have been playing since the first beta are getting tired of it already.It's not made for multi-boxing. I'm 2-boxing now, and I'm used to 2-boxing games as playing 1 character is not enough. I doubt I'll go beyond 2.

WoW's multi-boxing is fun and was made easy with software solution rather than pure hardware. But I've played WoW for over 3 years, so new games that seems to survice more than it's first free month is good for "some" gamers. It's a different game.

Heck, I still play Dota when WoW got boring. I haven't played Dota since 1 week of Open Beta.

[Rigz]

I go to use my hearthstone ripoff
I wish you had made this the title of your thread so I could have chuckled and moved on, saving me thirty seconds of your stupidity.

[Sanctume]

I think you guys miss his entire point. If the game is that hard to get into and dumps on him regularly, why should he be generous? Also, graphics appearance is a subjective measure for most people, so his opinion is entirely valid. I haven't played it and have no intention of playing it so I have no vested interest either way. Just saying, after the whining I see about WoWs little glitches, this is fairly tame for someone that has this much trouble just getting the game to run stable.What? His point sounds like a rant from his failure to install and 1 hour of gaming with some more ill-conception that a heartstone is a WoW original.

I could have ranted when WoW's release was SHIT, but it was tolerable shit compared to Anarchy Online Release, or EQ 1 release.

WoW. Server: Archimonde. The server crashed several times during the day with wait queues. There were even 4 and 8 hours down times. Then after maybe 72 hours, they said Archimonde server will be down maybe 1 week--but that's after I had at least a level 20. Painful as it was, my guild decided to start over another PvP server, and we're behind the level curve.

WAR. Server: Skull Throne. There were some server crashes, but no down time. Wait queue was 20 minutes on prime time. Zero queue before prime time, and mayeb 5 minute queue after prime time. Skull Throne is also 1 of 4 server that was Full with many other server not having a wait queue. Mythic's solution is to clone the entire server in the morning of Release giving guilds a choice to play in the wait queue or move on to a new server without level disruption.

It is not a matter of how good WoW is or if WAR is a WoW killer. They are 2 different games with being of the same MMO genre. What I see is the evolution of "good for the gamers" coming out from the mistakes previous MMOs experienced.

Mythic got some good experience from DAoC. Blizzard has some from Battle.Net, but WoW was their first MMO. Either way, I as a gamer benefit from how well these company handle issues. I can tell you that Sony EQ sucked at the time, but it was also one of the first massive MMO released. Blizzard and Mythic learned from Sony/Verant's mistakes.

[Korruptor]

I could have ranted when WoW's release was SHIT, but it was tolerable shit compared to Anarchy Online Release, or EQ 1 release.

He speaks truth. This was one of the best launches I've ever seen if not the best launch.

His (Youngceo) complaining is on par with someone accusing Keyclone of stealing his account password when he had a Trojan on his PC. If you're having problems installing a freaking game when most people aren't look at your setup first before talking crap.

[TheBigBB]

It's not fair to compare the launch of games that came out 4+ years ago to a game coming out now. WoW's launch wasn't amazing in terms of the stability, but that was a very long time ago now. WAR is competing with WoW *now*. Anyway, unless stability remains a problem, it shouldn't matter in the long term. I haven't played WAR so I can't comment. I just wanted to see some opinions on the game itself. I think they're making a big mistake to not try to compete with WoW on all fronts, though. They're marketing the PVP aspects up, but since I'm mostly a PVE player they're basically not even trying to get my business that way. There's no reason that a game as huge as a MMO can't have it all in one game. I want to see if this is all just bad marketing or if it's really just all about the PVP.

EDIT: It sounds like WAR is fairly stable anyhow.

[Naysayer]

I think you guys miss his entire point. If the game is that hard to get into and dumps on him regularly, why should he be generous? Also, graphics appearance is a subjective measure for most people, so his opinion is entirely valid. I haven't played it and have no intention of playing it so I have no vested interest either way. Just saying, after the whining I see about WoWs little glitches, this is fairly tame for someone that has this much trouble just getting the game to run stable.It's about as hard to get into as a child proof bottle of aspirin. You can figure out what that means.

[Naysayer]

Yes, warhammer is very fun.

WoW is much more polished, but WoW has had several years to polish itself up. The PVP is very balanced, only a couple classes out of 20 or so that are kind of weak at the moment. It's a very smooth release compared to typical mmo releases. There's no way it could flop now. It's going to be extremely sucessful. Will it kill WoW? Not yet at least, but maybe eventually if WoW doesn't get on it's game. Forums and community in WAR are much different than WoW. WoW is full of crying, while WAR has very little and mostly by people who don't know how to use a PC very well.

[Youngceo]

haha.. damn theres some angry little kids in here.If your wondering what im talking about with the install probs, ALL of the australian released dvd's are bogus my mates that bought the shit had the same problem. After install it doesnt even leave a .exe and the warpatcher doesnt even load, so you gotta go googling the problem till you find a fix to download just to get it started. Then once you done that the war.exe game wont even load it still, just blackscreens, on both my machines and all my friends, you have to run the patcher just to get into it. Apparently im asking too much for a game to just be able to install, patch and run these days.

I just feel more sorry for the millions of parents of kids like Sanctume who will bring the game home and not even be able to get it started.
Forums and community in WAR are much different than WoW Theres not even any 'official' forums on their site so you can read about people not happy with the game, AOC did the same thing, you couldnt read the forums until you bought an account. Then the forums I managed to find linked to are plastered with ads, very professional :thumbsup:. Community didnt seem much different either, first battleground "sorry scenario:whistling:" I go into the chat is filled with "just let them win" hahaLooks to me like the only people seriously into the game are the one addicted to wow and hoping it will be the "wow killer" its hyped upto be to hopefully cure their addiction, doesnt matter how shit the game is there will still be the likes of Sanctume here praising how godlike it is and noone should think any different

Sanctume you sound like a angry little mmo addict, sorry for knocking your little game. good luck with life :thumbsup:

[Sanctume]

haha.. damn theres some angry little kids in here.If your wondering what im talking about with the install probs, ALL of the australian released dvd's are bogus my mates that bought the shit had the same problem. After install it doesnt even leave a .exe and the warpatcher doesnt even load, so you gotta go googling the problem till you find a fix to download just to get it started. Then once you done that the war.exe game wont even load it still, just blackscreens, on both my machines and all my friends, you have to run the patcher just to get into it. Apparently im asking too much for a game to just be able to install, patch and run these days.

I just feel more sorry for the millions of parents of kids like Sanctume who will bring the game home and not even be able to get it started.

Forums and community in WAR are much different than WoW Theres not even any 'official' forums on their site so you can read about people not happy with the game, AOC did the same thing, you couldnt read the forums until you bought an account. Then the forums I managed to find linked to are plastered with ads, very professional :thumbsup:. Community didnt seem much different either, first battleground "sorry scenario:whistling:" I go into the chat is filled with "just let them win" hahaLooks to me like the only people seriously into the game are the one addicted to wow and hoping it will be the "wow killer" its hyped upto be to hopefully cure their addiction, doesnt matter how shit the game is there will still be the likes of Sanctume here praising how godlike it is and noone should think any different

Sanctume you sound like a angry little mmo addict, sorry for knocking your little game. good luck with life :thumbsup:LOL U. Sorry you like downunder.

[Rigz]

How did I wind up in the wow general board.

*Looks around confused*

[Shades]

haha.. damn theres some angry little kids in here.If your wondering what im talking about with the install probs, ALL of the australian released dvd's are bogus my mates that bought the shit had the same problem. After install it doesnt even leave a .exe and the warpatcher doesnt even load, so you gotta go googling the problem till you find a fix to download just to get it started. Then once you done that the war.exe game wont even load it still, just blackscreens, on both my machines and all my friends, you have to run the patcher just to get into it. Apparently im asking too much for a game to just be able to install, patch and run these days.

I just feel more sorry for the millions of parents of kids like Sanctume who will bring the game home and not even be able to get it started.
Forums and community in WAR are much different than WoW Theres not even any 'official' forums on their site so you can read about people not happy with the game, AOC did the same thing, you couldnt read the forums until you bought an account. Then the forums I managed to find linked to are plastered with ads, very professional :thumbsup:. Community didnt seem much different either, first battleground "sorry scenario:whistling:" I go into the chat is filled with "just let them win" hahaLooks to me like the only people seriously into the game are the one addicted to wow and hoping it will be the "wow killer" its hyped upto be to hopefully cure their addiction, doesnt matter how shit the game is there will still be the likes of Sanctume here praising how godlike it is and noone should think any different

Sanctume you sound like a angry little mmo addict, sorry for knocking your little game. good luck with life :thumbsup:
I'm new around here... mostly lurking, but I have been playing in the WAR headstart so I thought I'd chime in.

The game works fine for people in Australia... once you overcome the problems. From what I read there was some kind of problem with the manufacturing of the disks in Australia (like a bad duplicator or something), so a lot of the disks were corrupted all in the same way. To fix it you had to download the patcher executable (which you could get from the support web site) and then run it to download the missing files. You also needed to patch again with full file scan to repair the corrupted files otherwise you get the black screens and such. Once you do all that, the game works great and most of the problems you are mentioning go away. It has been really stable for me, I have only ever crashed once in several days of play. It sucks that those disks are messed up but at least they are trying to fix the problem. The fact that WAR actually has servers in Australia is a first to begin with, nobody else has even bothered to put servers there.

Its not the ideal game for everyone but if you enjoy PvP then WAR is where you want to play. DAOC (Mythic's older MMO - back from the EQ1 days) used to be the only decent PvP focused game on the block, but Mythic learned a lot from that game, and WAR has now blown DAOC away there. I'm sure it will become more polished as they get more time to work on that stuff... MMO's are never done when they launch, it takes 6+ months post launch before they really start to shine.

You can't really accuse WAR of stealing ideas from WoW, they didn't really invent any of that stuff... Blizzard lifted a lot of its ideas from DAOC and EQ, and just added some polish. If anything WAR is really an evolved DAOC... most of the core mechanics are very similar, and they have all those same features in that game.

[Naysayer]

First the install doesnt want to give me a .exe, and the patcher doesnt want to load, so I go googlin for one that works. Finally get it patched so I run it, and it locks up about 5sec into the menus, try to get back in and it black screens me (this is on my fresh laptop aswell, not just 1 pc). After about half an hour I finally get in...

Sorry but I dont get whats so special about it, they've ripped most of it off wow (with new words yay) and the graphics look horrid. I was expecting something at least fun to look at but its just horrid and runs pretty average for what looks pretty poor.

So after about an hour of playing I go to use my hearthstone ripoff and the game just quits on me... didnt bother loading it back up after that. One of my mates hasnt bought it yet so hes buying my copy, Might try it in 6 months once things are working properly if it hasnt sunk already to the ocean floor next to Age of conan.

Queue the QQ of hyped up fanboys.... now :thumbsup:When I installed I noticed it didn't place an exe on my desktop as well, so I did what any average joe computer user would do and went through C:/programfiles/EA/Warhammer Online folder and created the shortcut myself with the exe. file inside that folder.

The graphics suck, if your computer sucks. Plain and simple, I'll post some in game screenies when I get home and everyone can see what the game really looks like instead of what it looks like on a 1995 macintosh.

Yes, It does borrow ideas from World of WarUltimaEverquestCamelotCraft Online.

I find it hilarious how the only people crying about the release are people who didn't update their directx recently, don't know what directx is, can't find an exe file after downloading it into a folder named warhammer, and say the graphics are bad because they have a 4 year old PC.

It's a great game. WoW's a great game. I'm glad they're both great games.

[Naysayer]

Leveling a new Squig Herder at the greenskin starting zone.

Starting camp ('http://img186.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war1qq8.jpg')

Stunty area ('http://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war2dm3.jpg') - look at the fire and the detail on the orcs. Bad graphics? ROFLMAO! More like bad computer specs.

Killing me a stunty in the stunty camp ('http://img355.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war3dr4.jpg')

Down the road towards the next greenskin camp ('http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war4pn4.jpg')

Jumped on the way and this orc tank helping me out with some shield to the face. ('http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war5si0.jpg')

War Maker camp. That giant sawblade actually goes up and down the tower cutting wood. ('http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=war6ki1.jpg')

Graphics are pretty sweet. I'll grab some Realm vs Realm pics sometime later today if I have time.

[Rigz]

The default graphics were underwhelming for sure, but once you do some reading and make some tweaks, the game is clearly on another level than wow for visuals. Now art style and direction are another topic, personally I still don't care much for them, but that is subjective. One big problem I have is that some races seem to be shoddier in design graphics wise.

I started as a high elf, and thought the game models looked like shit and assumed all the races had crap design and animation. I was wrong though, check out the runepriest, the first offensive spell is actually real cool looking and has more animation in execution than wow spells.

The big change from looking average to looking awesome came from forcing the AA and AF (not supported by the game as options) through the nvidia control panel. Was like night and day.

Now I don't count that as a plus, in my opinion, a modern computer game should support options like that as a default, but my point is it is possible to make the game look real purddy.

Ohh well back to healin stunties.

[Korruptor]

Shot of my Zealot
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3931/marxm011cn9.th.jpg ('http://img146.imageshack.us/my.php?image=marxm011cn9.jpg')http://img146.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif ('http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php')
(Very creepy, the kind of creepy I think the Forsaken should have been)

[Naysayer]

Damn zealots! So tough to kill. You guys are as hard as druids to take down :(.

[simpletom]

I brought the game yesterday, and my first impressions is just incredable, i dont really enjoy the style of the game too much, im far more parcial to the cartoony style of warcraft.

But theres alot of things that this game does bring in that set it aside from wow, public quests for example are just great, i had alot of fun doing the same one over and over just meeting new people and getting some really great loot drops from doing it.

The biggest difference i knowticed right away is how much more this game wants you to interact with other players, you can queue for a senario (which is basically a battleground) right from level 1, and no being level one or rank 1 as its called in war will not see you pwned at ever corner by people 9 ranks higher than you, your boosted up to rank 8, and all your spells upgrade with each level.

Battlegrounds will seem abit unbalanced, right away you know that balance isnt really going to be with this game there are some 20 different classes and each faction has their own unique 10. But saying that this game is balanced becuase its more about team work, they havent worried too much about one class has it all and can tackle everything, it depends alot more on tactics and teamwork than warcraft probably ever will.

I was very sceptical about this game and i really didnt want to like it, i hate the realistic looks in games like this, and how sluggish movements feel becuase of the realism, but it is fun to play.

Its never going to be the death of warcraft, but im hopeing that Blizzard will take alot of inspiration from WAR and impliment alot of the great ideas into the next expansion.

If your bored of the warcraft grind try this as theres nothing in it that feels like grinding, you can join battlegrounds right from level 1 when they are over you are put back right where you joined them to carry on questing, the game has its own quest helper style addon, where it will show you the areas where you will be able to complete the quest.

good game all in all

[Korruptor]

Damn zealots! So tough to kill. You guys are as hard as druids to take down :(.

Don't hate us just because we can run and insta-cast heal & HoT ourselves ;)

Rune priests are the same if i'm not mistaken (mirror class).

[DrZ]

So far I'm running through Volkmar with a rank 16 chosen. Loving the game so far.

The PvP is whats selling it for me. It's a slower pace than WoW, but it's immediatly accessible and rewarding at all levels. I like the visual impact gear has on your character, and that you can color it whatever scheme you want. Also, they made (or remade?) tanking a viable option in PvP. There are several scenarios that require someone to be a flag/artifact carrier, and that means he needs to be protected. With the ability to split 50% of incoming damage on the runner to yourself (but not vice versa), collision detection, high HP/armor/toughness for survivability, snares/knockbacks, and not insignifigant DPS, I found my sweet spot. People chasing the flag carrier/runner/whatever has to deal with me when I turn around to stall them, even if it's laying down some CC.

Technicly, graphics are not to bad in my opinion, but what I don't like is that it throttles my machine even when I far exceed the recomended specs. This is regardles of visual setting. I also get the occasion CTD but it's not common and actually decreasing in frequency. Relitively smooth launch all around.

The balance of 20 classes isn't really an issue imo, as it's really 2 of each class, just with minor tweaks.

[Naysayer]

So far the crafting sucks pretty bad imo. Tried to go Talisman and scavenger, but talisman mats are way too hard to come by. You'd have to have a guild dropping loot for you in the vault in order to level this up. Anyone else have any decent luck with it or other crafting professions?

[oxxo]

So far the crafting sucks pretty bad imo. Tried to go Talisman and scavenger, but talisman mats are way too hard to come by. You'd have to have a guild dropping loot for you in the vault in order to level this up. Anyone else have any decent luck with it or other crafting professions?

Well the only other one is apothecary... :)
And it's supposed to be alot better.

Talisman making was only very recently added and will probably be tweaked.

[oxxo]

First the install doesnt want to give me a .exe, and the patcher doesnt want to load, so I go googlin for one that works. Finally get it patched so I run it, and it locks up about 5sec into the menus, try to get back in and it black screens me (this is on my fresh laptop aswell, not just 1 pc). After about half an hour I finally get in...

Sorry but I dont get whats so special about it, they've ripped most of it off wow (with new words yay) and the graphics look horrid. I was expecting something at least fun to look at but its just horrid and runs pretty average for what looks pretty poor.

So after about an hour of playing I go to use my hearthstone ripoff and the game just quits on me... didnt bother loading it back up after that. One of my mates hasnt bought it yet so hes buying my copy, Might try it in 6 months once things are working properly if it hasnt sunk already to the ocean floor next to Age of conan.

Queue the QQ of hyped up fanboys.... now :thumbsup:

Maybe use different language so you are taken more seriously??

WoW = PvE
WAR = PvP and very good at what wants to do.

(And WoW "stole" plenty of ideas from other games)

[kazxex]

WAR is very good, much more of a PVP oriented game.

I've played mmos since uo and feel that WAR is a step forward in mmo evolution personally. It also feels like it has richer character development than wow. I think war will appeal more to the hardcore mmo/rpg and pvp fans who want richer gameplay. PQ's, Scenarios, Tatics, Renown Training, Mastery Trees, all variations on things that have been done before but are tons of fun and done right in WAR.

Not sure why these conversations always devolve into people getting defensive about wow but every new mmo that succeeds pushs the genre forward and that is a good thing for those who love mmos.

[NoobShammy]

WAR = PVP
WOW = PVE

That being said the "grind" isnt as big a factor in WAR as it is in WOW. I cant belive how much wow sucks you in and makes you grind factions be it bg's/arena/npc faction/raid faction in order to get loot. IN WAR there are 3 griding and that pretty much it your;

RANK - think of this as your level in wow
Renown (PVP)- think of this as honor but in a level system. the higher the rating the better gear you have access to buy with gold
Influence (PVE) - this can be considered faction griding but takes far less time and there is one ONE for each tier/chapter. husteling hard in PQ's can net a full bar after 3-4 PQ's. This in turn gets you 3 different items to pick on 3 different tiers.

So there you have it 3 levels or ranking to work on and lots of enemies to kill :)

[Gorthu]

I think you guys miss his entire point. If the game is that hard to get into and dumps on him regularly, why should he be generous? Also, graphics appearance is a subjective measure for most people, so his opinion is entirely valid. I haven't played it and have no intention of playing it so I have no vested interest either way. Just saying, after the whining I see about WoWs little glitches, this is fairly tame for someone that has this much trouble just getting the game to run stable.We get his point, I just don't buy it. I have been playing since launch day and have had NONE of those problems. Maybe he has a crappy computer. In which case it's not the game. Maybe he's in an area where the ISP is having trouble. I have a friend playing from Houston, and even with all the problems from the hurricane, he doesn't experience those problems either. So, I don't think it's the game.

[Sanctume]

There's a memory leak somewhere because without a fail, after 2 to 4 hours, one of my machines will crash to desktop.
This happens also with other guidies, and we have varying setups from cpu to vid cards.

The main issue for me is the wait queue for being in Skull Throne, one of the most populated server.

There's the wait queue, and then there's the click-click to get in the wait queue--it's stupid and a waste of time.

[Tehtsuo]

I have also noticed that my performance degrades over time. I've started running a /reload every half hour to try to mitigate it. The lag is pretty debilitating, and while I appreciate the quality of the graphics, I prefer WoW's smooth performance to WAR's graphics. That's not to say I won't play WAR, I'm enjoying my goblin Shaman quite a bit so far, and really seem to do well in RvR. I simply have been convinced that WAR is not the "WoW-killer" it was touted to be by so many.

I've mentioned this in-game and in several forums, and I usually get the same answer. "WoW has been out for 3 years, give WAR that long and it'll be just as good." That's fine, and I'll play the game and see where it goes. I'll probably even pay the monthly fee. However, I'm not going to stop playing WoW, and I'm not going to become a "WAR Fanboi." I was willing to give WAR a good chance, and I was very excited about it from all the hype, but I was a bit disappointed with what came out. I think a large part of that could be blamed on EA, who seems to have a track record of ruining potentially good games. I think if they had their way Mythic would not have released for some time to come, which I would have preferred.

I understand most fan's knee-jerk impulse to give WAR the benefit of the doubt because WoW has had more time to iron out all the bugs, but I'm a consumer at heart. I want something better than WoW, not comparable. If it ends up being better in 3 years, yeah I'll play it, and may not play WoW anymore. However, for now, I still end up logging into WoW to enjoy the lag-free gameplay, smooth animations, and responsive casting times. I'm sorry if it seems unfair to Mythic that I expect their game to be better than WoW at release and refuse to give them the time Blizzard had, but as I said - I'm a consumer. Please me, or be prepared for my lukewarm review.

Besides, it's the same 5-year-olds inhabiting chat in both games. 8)

[pukerua]

For complete back history and emersion, WAR will win over WoW drawing from 25 years of quality literature to call upon - If you read any Black Library publications, the theme is heating up again......$ always adds to their incentives.

On the issues of post beta/gold releases - name an international product release that has not had a bump or two - since we all use different equipment with very diverse settings, we should expect minor or painful experiences.

In comparasion to the release of Everquest in 1999 - WAR works from day one with very limited delays/downtime with loading-login or server avaiability issues. The constant patching will and needs to happen to tweek the gaming environment and improve the gameplay.

Get very scared when these stop - first indication of financial issues and staff departures.

Yes the visual quality of the toons from level one leave a lot to be desired so there is an incentive to improve the levelling to get the bling bling items - the animation is not fluid and the rapidity of hitting the same buttons is brain killing so hopfully that improves as more viable skills become available to characters as they grow.

The quests require a great deal of reading but long term offer the theme of the game - I do enjoy the book to view what you have done and or need to do - is WoW not doing something similar with the release of Wolk with awards?

Give the game a few good months to become embedded with players - those that will stay and those that will leave to other adventures.

Performance wise I am personally finding the game painful with only the comparasion of EQ and WoW but love the graphic terran of the world setting and potential WaR could offer for the future. Being a graphical hog on resources is limiting my future endevours to stay, so unless within the next 12 months the game becomes more boxer friendly, the game could become obsolite for my multi account purposes

and turn into something I have not played since 1999 - single player (yes I will rince my mouth out with soap)

Kia ora from Aotearoa

[FtGeno]

War is very similar to WoW in so many areas for good reason, that is what works. There is something to learn from a would be competitor with over ten million subcribers and Warhammer's developers were keen to recognize that. Leveling is not a chore (except perhaps 60 - 70), quests are relatively easy and the pvp is fun, and playing the game does not tax your system, so why change a proven formula when it would be far more easy and (hopefully) profitable to simply tweak it?

Will War dethrone WoW? I doubt it, WoW has the money to keep pace with EA and a four year headstart that translates into an extremely well polished product while War still has to experience 'teething'. Does anyone remember WoW's graphics when it first released? Not much better than Warhammer imo. That the War crew created a 'clone' server for people to play in the event of server queues says that these guys are serious about keeping their customers happy. It will be sort of hit and miss for a bit while the dev team gets a grip on what people want and need; they will lose a few to lack of refinement (Mostly spoiled WoWers) and pick up disgruntled players from other games (WoW will lose its share of players come WotLK). The hard part is yet to come; finding/creating and establishing their niche. I think War will be fine.

[thinus]

Does anyone remember WoW's graphics when it first released? Not much better than Warhammer imo.

What is the problem with Warhammer graphics? It looks great to me.

[Flight]

Its a good game with good graphics for team or guild PvP. Its a poor gaming for boxing in, whether its PvE or PvP. Firstly, most of the boxing tools don't work and its very frustrating trying them out and not being able to get them working. Quite apart from the game content, your chars constantly get stuck in the terrain.


If anyone is going to play I'd suggest not boxing.

[Tehtsuo]

Its a good game with good graphics for team or guild PvP. Its a poor gaming for boxing in, whether its PvE or PvP. Firstly, most of the boxing tools don't work and its very frustrating trying them out and not being able to get them working. Quite apart from the game content, your chars constantly get stuck in the terrain.


If anyone is going to play I'd suggest not boxing.

I think the terrain will improve, because it's frustrating even without boxing. I seem to get stuck quite a bit.

[FtGeno]

Its a good game with good graphics for team or guild PvP. Its a poor gaming for boxing in, whether its PvE or PvP. Firstly, most of the boxing tools don't work and its very frustrating trying them out and not being able to get them working. Quite apart from the game content, your chars constantly get stuck in the terrain.


If anyone is going to play I'd suggest not boxing.

I think the terrain will improve, because it's frustrating even without boxing. I seem to get stuck quite a bit.This is what I meant with my graphics comment, I really should rephrase it. I got stuck on rocks, pebbles and blades of grass all the time in beta. However I will say that I'm not a big fan of current character models and that they can stand some improvement.

[thinus]

Its a good game with good graphics for team or guild PvP. Its a poor gaming for boxing in, whether its PvE or PvP. Firstly, most of the boxing tools don't work and its very frustrating trying them out and not being able to get them working. Quite apart from the game content, your chars constantly get stuck in the terrain.


If anyone is going to play I'd suggest not boxing.

I think the terrain will improve, because it's frustrating even without boxing. I seem to get stuck quite a bit.This is what I meant with my graphics comment, I really should rephrase it. I got stuck on rocks, pebbles and blades of grass all the time in beta. However I will say that I'm not a big fan of current character models and that they can stand some improvement.

Well, I was a little disappointed at first. I saw art of The Chosen and then I created one in game and he was this tiny guy with a crappy breastplate. But now...at level 13/14 it looks like a tank. Still doesn't have a helmet but good looking breastplate, boots, shoulders and gloves makes a huge difference.

[Bradster]

I tried it this weekend.

The character models, the land scape and fighting animations really didn’t appeal to me. I gave AOC 2 weeks before I gave up on it, this I lasted a day, which to be fair is not enough experience to say it sucks. But it was enough for me realize this may not be the one for me. I would like to revisit it in a year after some polish and see where it goes.

[Tehtsuo]

I've finally come to a conclusive decision on what about the game bugs me. The problem is, it looks like the casting animation has a set speed, and there's no animation for spell knockback. Hence, when I cast "Brain Blaster" on my shaman, the spell animation completes, and the little green spitball flies at the enemy, but you still have to wait for your casting bar to complete or the damage isn't done. That's a major flaw imo, even though it's mostly cosmetic.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

I've finally come to a conclusive decision on what about the game bugs me. The problem is, it looks like the casting animation has a set speed, and there's no animation for spell knockback. Hence, when I cast "Brain Blaster" on my shaman, the spell animation completes, and the little green spitball flies at the enemy, but you still have to wait for your casting bar to complete or the damage isn't done. That's a major flaw imo, even though it's mostly cosmetic. DAoC had the same problem. It was like the animation was one script. WoW has two scripts for their casting animations: phase 1 which is the looping short continuous animation, and then phase 2 which is the short one-shot animation that fires as soon as the spell fires. Which sychronizes well and improves the suspension of disbelief.

Interesting that they still have those sorts of problems, though, as I thought WAR was an entirely new game engine and everything.

[genocyde]

WOW, and no not the game.... this thread... I about choked on the first page. Lots of biased opinions and mean sounding retorts. Very fitting considering the title of the thread. That said my opinions are:

I've been playing wow since close to release, and I was in the WotLK beta. I didn't get to struggle through the original release of WoW so I won't compare the games there. I played WAR however through a good portion of the beta and into release.

Graphics, gameplay: I think the graphics are far superiour in detail even though they are not the same style. The fact that there are large enemies right off the bat was a nice touch to keep the attention of seasoned MMO veterans that didn't want to kill 100 boars per quest for the first 10 levels. The game idea of WAR is well done and competes with WoW on several levels.

PvE: There is junk for a point to endgame PvE in WAR. You might as well do PvP scenario's from rank 1 on. As you progress through there is plenty of questing to break up the leveling process. The dungeons have some cool ideas but the gear is no better than what you get from simply standing in equivalent rank PvP for a bit. The best of the best gear will be gotten from PvP.

PvP: Supremely disappointing in the low levels depending on your class. The point of the entire game. Honestly I don't think they did a better job on balancing then WoW. Healing is win. My zealot can solo heal a tank through the entire other teams assault. I realise your supposed to just blow the healer up but on more than one occasions a few melee and tanks were able to wall off a hallway or staircase and nobody could get to me anyway. Even then, my zealot can live through a hell of an assault and with self rezzing for my entire party it will make for wicked fights. The PvP is very good and different. I like WoW's PvP better because of the horrid smoothness of actions in WAR.

Playability: The complete lack of smoothness in WAR is AWFUL! I cannot get an instant cast spell off sometimes because of the sluggish response of the characters in WAR. Several of my friends quit WoW to play WAR and this is their only complaint as well. It seems like playing with lag and I can promise you thats not the case as WAR's servers seem very strong to me. I get great latency and yet it's STILL sluggish and packed with smoothness=fail. Walking seems bad. I have troubles casting instant spells behind me with the jump turn method I got so used to in WoW. Not a huge deal you learn the timing and keep in your head that War != Wow. The lack of smoothness has driven me away from WAR and the only thing that could bring me back is better PvP balance. (you heard me I think the PvP balance in WAR BLOWS especially in low levels.) Which I believe WAR will be the best PvP balanced game we've ever seen after a few months or years of progression and polishing. I'd like them to add an arena system cause thats my favorite thing in WoW but meh it's not really in the style of WAR.

I am keeping my WAR subscription but have all but quit it to go back to WoW. I still am leveling my zealot on off hours and intend to stick it out til the polished years or death of WAR. I will be playing WotLK on release though as I believe it to be a far superiour game for replayability and WAR will get boring and old very quick with the same town/keep/castle seiges and the complete lack of a point to doing anything else in the game but PvP.

Edited for spelling etc.

[thinus]

Some things that made me go WOW in Warhammer:

Public Quests

I think the Public Quest concept is a great innovation and a step in the right direction. For those who don't know:

Public quests are open world quests that anyone can participate in. Participation nets you contribution points which are used to decide looting rights and loot quality if the quest is completed successfully. PQs I have encountered so far basically consists of three stages. Stage 1 is an untimed stage and has a fairly straight forward objective that can usually be worked on solo as it does not include any champions or heroes (similiar to wow elites and bosses).

Once the first stage is completed the second stage starts with a timed objective. The second stage sometimes includes champions so these objectives can usually not be achieved solo unless you outrank the PQs quite a bit. Even if champions are not present during this stage the objectives are usually not achievable solo within the time limit.

Once the second stage is completed the third stage starts. The third stage is usually a hero and it can be quite a difficult fight for a group of characters the same level as the hero depending on class balance.

Once the quest is completed successfully every participant recieves a contribution bonus. The top contributor will get a 500 bonus, 2nd 350, 4th 300, etc. Next a loot roll from 1-1000 is made and your contribution bonus is added to the roll. A chest spawns and all the loot winners are able to loot different quality loot bags. The loot in the bag is specific to your own class.

And then the event resets within minutes.

In addition you also earn influence for participation in PQs. Warhammer PvE progression is broken up into chapters. Influence is gained per chapter and participation in a PQ in a specific chapter will increase your influence in that chapter. Influence is broken up into 3 milestones. Gaining enough influence will unlock a reward after each milestone with rewards being progressively more valuable. Gear rewards are all specific to your class.

Open Party

There is a little button underneath the character portrait that brings up the open party interface. You can check a box to indicate that you are interested in forming an open party. You will also see a list of existing open parties. You can select one of the open parties and click a join button and you are immediately added to the group. But here is the great part: it also gives you an indication of how far away the party is in time, 10s, 1min, 7min, etc. And another great thing is that it shows you what type of area the party currently finds itself in, for instance general PvE, Public Quest or RvR (world pvp areas).

The whole Public Quest and Open Party system really synergizes very well.

[Jezebel]

personally, i find those two aspects annoying as hell.

1: why should some douchebag be able to come along half way through my completing a quest, whack a few mobs and then be able to roll on loot that ive suffered through 30 minutes of PvE drudgery to acquire?
2: if i want to invite someone to my party (rare, considering most MMO players are 12 year old morons) ill invite them. i box my own group largely because i dont want to have to put up with the flood of WoW kids in group chat. the first thing i do whenever i login and group my characters is untick open party.

WAR is better than WoW for one reason. PvP. WoW is and always will be a PvE game. the only PvP content they add will be spoon-fed arena bollocks, still loot-focused and still bland and "organised". even though (unfortunately) WAR has scenarios, im hopeful that sieging and world PvP will offer something with more meat for players that dont pay $15 a month to kill that 908013201th big purple dragon so they can have some slightly glowier pixels to dance in.

its not shadowbane and its not UO.. but im starting to regretfully accept that nothing ever will be again :(

[TheBigBB]

im hopeful that sieging and world PvP will offer something with more meat for players that dont pay $15 a month to kill that 908013201th big purple dragon so they can have some slightly glowier pixels to dance in.I love well-designed PVE, and it's not because I got glowy pixels :thumbdown:

EDIT: I should elaborate on this post. If I hadn't said it before in this thread, I'll say it again. It bothers me that WAR right now is basically not even trying to court me over. Everyone right down the designers is talking about the amazingness of RVR or whatever, this PVP stuff, but after watching a long interview with one of the lead designers I got absolutely no excitement about what the PVE is going to offer in this game. WoW may have huge problems in its PVP, mainly for me it's the lack of new battleground maps, but at least it's trying to have both and isn't leaving you out. Bliz wants to have the best PVP and PVE and try to make it all good, and always have wanted to. The Competition from WAR will make them more likely to add more things to please people. However, WAR hasn't said a damn thing about what's to come in the PVE endgame, like "Oh wait until you see the great new raiding we got planned!", none of that. So they're basically not even paying attention to a huge part of the WoW playerbase right now, which is a huge mistake. You don't fully compete with one product by only offering a possible improvement to one area of the game. Maybe this game will be fully competitive in a couple of years.

[Rudi89]

I play the tabletop miniatures game so I pre-ordered a WAR collector's edition (woot! orc warboss!). I didn't really get into it though. It just seemed to be a darker, more detailed WoW. Like, I was constantly thinking 'Oh, that's the quest guy, where's my backpack? ah there it is, do this quest', everything was in the context of me playing WoW.

I blame the fact that I'm old with a kiddo; I just can't spend 6 hours getting immersed in a video game to see if I like it. If I can't get hooked right off the bat I just can't bother.

[Sanctume]

WoW is NOT WAR.

WAR is not WoW.

They are 2 different games with some MMO similarities.

WAR is enjoyable since I like to PvP. I do PvE as a means to its end.

You level. You get gear. You PvP.

Anyone can do that in WoW, but is it really fun to PvP at level 1? Not in WoW.
Even at level 61 WoW, is it fun to play in AV with a bunch of 70s?
And in WoW, at level 61 in AV -- what is your reward for playing in a 15 minute AV? An AV token, or maybe 3--and some honor of about 1k? which is 1/18 of an S4 gear.

In WAR terms, a level 1 can join a Tier 1 (level 1 to 10) scenario (or Battleground in WoW terms), and be able to queue to join that scenario as soon as that player logs in.
And within 15 minutes max of finishing that scenario, that player is probably level 2, and have enough silver to buy some Rank Renown gear that is decent.

Surely, it can get boring doing the same scenario over and over again. There are 3 different type of scenario in Tier 1.
Nordland is a 3 Flag Arathi Basin type. First 500 points win. Whichever has the most points in 15 minutes wins.
Erkund is another3 Flag Arathi Basin type, but different map/layout, a 2 level Fortress with a collapsed middle.
Khaine is a 2 Flag type map. Of one side caps both flags and hold them for 10 seconds, they get point. The flag area then has a countdown to an explosion that kills everyone near the flag. Fun stuff.

If a player wants some PvE mixed in their levelling, there are "Chapters" for each Race/Area. The Chapters for example are 1 to 19, and the gear rewards Chapter x 2 in level. So, Chapter 1 gives Rank 2 gear, Chapter 2 gives 4, etc.

The zone map and quests leads to a linear progression. Each Chapter have 2 or more Public Quests. Each chapter also have "Influence" reward similar to WoW faction where you get "useful" gear for your level of faction.

The Open Party is an option. I 2-box and I can create an Open Party is I want people to be able to join my group. I can also choose to not make my party Open, and it requires me inviting people in.

There are some "useful" Party / Social implementation. Suppose I have 2 "closed: party, but then decided I need to "merge" my party with an existing party. I can simply invite one of the members of another party, and the leader of that party can choose to join mine and automatically merge.

A party has 6 maximum players. I can also change my party into a Warbard (or Raid in WoW terms), and I can easily merge parties into my warband by inviting any other gorup or warband.

As for "loot rolls" in PQ--it's a good implementation. And sure it is not perfect. The PQ allows casual players to participate in quests they can't solo. But saying someone can just walk up and do 1 damage can earn that player a roll on loot is false. The amount of contribution a player puts toward a PQ is part of the determination if they are allowed to roll.

The low level PQs probably makes contributing to PQs easy by killing 1 of 20 needed mobs. The later levels, some PQ needs 100 mobs kills during stage 1. And killing "packs" of 3 mobs pulls at 2nd stage. A solo guy walking up to damage 1 mob wont have enough contribution.

The random mechanics seems unfair, but most of the time when I do PQ, it is for the Influence reward and not the loot bag. I usually "grind" the PQ 3 or 4 times to get my Influence--and I usually win at least a loot bag from those times.

Anyway, WAR seems to be here and now with some healthy population of players. If some player says it sucks, obviously it is their opinion and a game not for them.

All I have to say that WAR is enough to entertain me now since WoW is stale and I am waiting for what WotLK has to offer.

Now, WotLK is not here. And WAR is, and I'm enjoying my time 2-boxing it. I still have some gripe over the game. WAR is not as polished as WoW. But that polishness does not detract too much from the fun I enjoy in PvP.

[Jezebel]

I love well-designed PVE, and it's not because I got glowy pixels :thumbdown:

EDIT: I should elaborate on this post. If I hadn't said it before in this thread, I'll say it again. It bothers me that WAR right now is basically not even trying to court me over. Everyone right down the designers is talking about the amazingness of RVR or whatever, this PVP stuff, but after watching a long interview with one of the lead designers I got absolutely no excitement about what the PVE is going to offer in this game. WoW may have huge problems in its PVP, mainly for me it's the lack of new battleground maps, but at least it's trying to have both and isn't leaving you out. Bliz wants to have the best PVP and PVE and try to make it all good, and always have wanted to. The Competition from WAR will make them more likely to add more things to please people. However, WAR hasn't said a damn thing about what's to come in the PVE endgame, like "Oh wait until you see the great new raiding we got planned!", none of that. So they're basically not even paying attention to a huge part of the WoW playerbase right now, which is a huge mistake. You don't fully compete with one product by only offering a possible improvement to one area of the game. Maybe this game will be fully competitive in a couple of years.i disagree entirely with your post. i, for one, am quite thankful that mythic is making no effort to 'win over' PvE players from WoW (or WoW players in general). i dont say that to be offensive, but ive seen the result of a PvP game that gets flooded with PvE players. 1: whining about PvP, especially on FFA servers.. and 2: trying to subvert the focus of the dev team by spamming the forums with loot-centric PvE rubbish. WAR is not trying to compete with WoW. WAR is trying to offer its subscribers a game focused on what mythic does best: realm Vs. realm combat. mythic and their devs have already stated that its inevitable when you have a freak occurance such as WoW in the market that there will be comparisons. there is no way mythic or even EA has the funds to compete with WoW's production team. what they can do, however, is focus on what they do best and provide a superior product for their niche market.

for once i hope a company sticks to its guns and doesnt cave in to the flood of ex-wow kids that, at heart, only want to reproduce the same handicapped PvP environment theyre comfortable with (see: AoC). its frustrating that literally the day after any promising PvP game gets released the WoWers are spamming the forums with "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie". if you want to play WoW then play WoW X(

forgive me if i get a bit worked up over this subject. ive seen so many PvP games die from exactly this. they hype up the PvP experience, a bunch of carebears join and start forum-warring and the next thing you know there are PvP jails and ressurection immunity and safe zones and whatever the hell other ways a company can cave in and backflip on its pre-launch promises to the people that actually stuck around since before it even hit beta. two months later.. guess what? all the WoW players are back at WoW yet again and the company is stuck with a product nobody wants and an ex-fanbase that wants nothing to do with them.

[Tehtsuo]

I love well-designed PVE, and it's not because I got glowy pixels :thumbdown:

EDIT: I should elaborate on this post. If I hadn't said it before in this thread, I'll say it again. It bothers me that WAR right now is basically not even trying to court me over. Everyone right down the designers is talking about the amazingness of RVR or whatever, this PVP stuff, but after watching a long interview with one of the lead designers I got absolutely no excitement about what the PVE is going to offer in this game. WoW may have huge problems in its PVP, mainly for me it's the lack of new battleground maps, but at least it's trying to have both and isn't leaving you out. Bliz wants to have the best PVP and PVE and try to make it all good, and always have wanted to. The Competition from WAR will make them more likely to add more things to please people. However, WAR hasn't said a damn thing about what's to come in the PVE endgame, like "Oh wait until you see the great new raiding we got planned!", none of that. So they're basically not even paying attention to a huge part of the WoW playerbase right now, which is a huge mistake. You don't fully compete with one product by only offering a possible improvement to one area of the game. Maybe this game will be fully competitive in a couple of years.i disagree entirely with your post. i, for one, am quite thankful that mythic is making no effort to 'win over' PvE players from WoW (or WoW players in general). i dont say that to be offensive, but ive seen the result of a PvP game that gets flooded with PvE players. 1: whining about PvP, especially on FFA servers.. and 2: trying to subvert the focus of the dev team by spamming the forums with loot-centric PvE rubbish. WAR is not trying to compete with WoW. WAR is trying to offer its subscribers a game focused on what mythic does best: realm Vs. realm combat. mythic and their devs have already stated that its inevitable when you have a freak occurance such as WoW in the market that there will be comparisons. there is no way mythic or even EA has the funds to compete with WoW's production team. what they can do, however, is focus on what they do best and provide a superior product for their niche market.

for once i hope a company sticks to its guns and doesnt cave in to the flood of ex-wow kids that, at heart, only want to reproduce the same handicapped PvP environment theyre comfortable with (see: AoC). its frustrating that literally the day after any promising PvP game gets released the WoWers are spamming the forums with "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie". if you want to play WoW then play WoW X(

i get really worked up over this subject because ive seen so many PvP games die from exactly this. they hype up the PvP experience, a bunch of carebears join and start forum-warring and the next thing you know there are PvP jails and ressurection immunity and safe zones and whatever the hell other ways a company can cave in and backflip on its pre-launch promises to the people that actually stuck around since before it even hit beta.

I can see things from your perspective, but for some reason all my mind's ear hears when reading your post is an angry Halo 3 player complaining that there's no "teabag" key. Please remember that the majority of PVE-centric individuals aren't the kind that say "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie" There are some rotten apples, but please be civil...

I for one am mostly a PVE-oriented player, but I am interested to see if Warhammer will be able to make the game succeed in a manner fitting a true PVP-oriented MMO. I'm unsure of how they can pull it off, seeing as one of the basic themes of MMOs, gear progression, usually doesn't play nicely with PVP. Right now, I can't get a clear idea on that, because until there's a larger population with a broader spread of progression I can't really say for sure.

[Jezebel]

I can see things from your perspective, but for some reason all my mind's ear hears when reading your post is an angry Halo 3 player complaining that there's no "teabag" key. Please remember that the majority of PVE-centric individuals aren't the kind that say "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie" There are some rotten apples, but please be civil...i thought that was quite civil. and i disagree. those are exactly the kinds of posts the vast majority of PvE players and MMO players in general make, if you cut out the fat. PvE is predictable and provides tangible rewards. PvP is not and does not. when 1 plus 2 doesnt equal 3 they get upset and go on a forum crusade to change the game to suit themselves. the comment i replied to is a perfect (if mild) example of this.

[Tehtsuo]

I can see things from your perspective, but for some reason all my mind's ear hears when reading your post is an angry Halo 3 player complaining that there's no "teabag" key. Please remember that the majority of PVE-centric individuals aren't the kind that say "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie" There are some rotten apples, but please be civil...i thought that was quite civil. and i disagree. those are exactly the kinds of posts the vast majority of PvE players and MMO players in general make, if you cut out the fat. PvE is predictable and provides tangible rewards. PvP is not and does not. when 1 plus 2 doesnt equal 3 they get upset and go on a forum crusade to change the game to suit themselves. the comment i replied to is a perfect (if mild) example of this.

That sounds like a baseless generalization to me, please provide supporting evidence. I'm not talking about quoting a post or two, because you're not saying "Some PVE'ers launch forum crusades to change the game to suit themselves," you're saying "vast majority of PvE players and MMO players" do. Please try not to generalize, that's all I'm saying. And what fat are you talking about cutting out, all the people who don't fit your generalization?

I myself have already said some words to combat the kind of forum crusade you referred to. A member of my warhammer guild was complaining about Bright Wizard damage, and urged the guild to file suggestions to Mythic to nerf them. I replied that Bright Wizards are dps classes, and they don't usually kill me as a healer, so I didn't see the urgency. His response was they kill him (A sorcerer) a lot, so I got a good chuckle about it. If someone kills you in pvp, learn from it and adjust your strategy, don't run off on a crusade to get other classes nerfed.

[Jezebel]

That sounds like a baseless generalization to me, please provide supporting evidence. I'm not talking about quoting a post or two, because you're not saying "Some PVE'ers launch forum crusades to change the game to suit themselves," you're saying "vast majority of PvE players and MMO players" do. Please try not to generalize, that's all I'm saying. And what fat are you talking about cutting out, all the people who don't fit your generalization?

I myself have already said some words to combat the kind of forum crusade you referred to. A member of my warhammer guild was complaining about Bright Wizard damage, and urged the guild to file suggestions to Mythic to nerf them. I replied that Bright Wizards are dps classes, and they don't usually kill me as a healer, so I didn't see the urgency. His response was they kill him (A sorcerer) a lot, so I got a good chuckle about it. If someone kills you in pvp, learn from it and adjust your strategy, don't run off on a crusade to get other classes nerfed.it may be baseless or it may not. slightly more challenging than your suggestion, find a PvE/WoW player that has commented in a positive way anywhere in any game forum on real PvP. if it exists, i think youll be searching a while.

opinions are based on experience. im not talking about balance or class issues. im talking about buying one game and then wanting it to be something else. WAR is not WoW. buying or wanting to buy WAR and then complaining for lack of PvE content or excessive focus on RvR is just plain stupid. if i want a pair of shoes i go to a shoe store and buy a pair of shoes. i dont go to an internet cafe and complain at the clerk because he cant give me what i want.

[Tehtsuo]

it may be baseless or it may not. slightly more challenging than your suggestion, find a PvE/WoW player that has commented in a positive way anywhere in any game forum on real PvP. if it exists, i think youll be searching a while.

I concede your point with the understanding that you are not offering more than an opinion, which I would in no way wish to prevent you from offering.


opinions are based on experience. im not talking about balance or class issues. im talking about buying one game and then wanting it to be something else. WAR is not WoW. buying or wanting to buy WAR and then complaining for lack of PvE content or excessive focus on RvR is just plain stupid. if i want a pair of shoes i go to a shoe store and buy a pair of shoes. i dont go to an internet cafe and complain at the clerk because he cant give me what i want.

I have to agree with this, your logic here is sound. WAR is definately not WoW, and I agree that it's not logical to expect it to be. I'm looking for different, not more of the same.

[TheBigBB]

I can see things from your perspective, but for some reason all my mind's ear hears when reading your post is an angry Halo 3 player complaining that there's no "teabag" key. Please remember that the majority of PVE-centric individuals aren't the kind that say "omg i got killed nerf PvP", "omg theres not enough shiny epics", "omg why bother playing at all if i dont get a cookie" There are some rotten apples, but please be civil...i thought that was quite civil. and i disagree. those are exactly the kinds of posts the vast majority of PvE players and MMO players in general make, if you cut out the fat. PvE is predictable and provides tangible rewards. PvP is not and does not. when 1 plus 2 doesnt equal 3 they get upset and go on a forum crusade to change the game to suit themselves. the comment i replied to is a perfect (if mild) example of this.PVP is not predictable? When you PVP you face a group of people who have a set of skills they can use, and they may do nothing else but use those skills in some combination. Successful PVP teams don't just make things up as they go along. They identify another team's strategy and counter it using predictable game mechanics. The fun derived from either PVE or PVP or ANY game is when you are against something which is difficult to counter and have to play well to get past it, regardless of knowing the script.

This is like when I sit down to play Rock Band. No amount of knowing the notes will guarantee that I'll actually be able to hit them. Being predictable hardly detracts from the experience of playing a drum, or something. It's the challenge of playing it right that keeps people entertained.

I am not on a crusade to make WAR into a PVE game, but I think it's a poor decision for them to give up on making a meaningful endgame PVE experience if they want to compete. I believe all MMORPGs should have a well developed PVE and PVP experience, and WoW has been successful because it tries to do that. Blizzard wants to make their PVP and PVE the best it can be, but Mythic doesn't seem to. Imagine the situation if someone actually made a MMORPG that was good on the PVE and PVP front? It would be a great day to see that. Competition fuels progress. In that regard, I hope to see Blizzard improve their PVP now that they have someone competing for their PVP players.

[magwo]

My views:

I've tried several of the classes in WAR now.. to level 6-8.. and not a single one felt fun to play. I just feel weak and useless with all the classes. Healers heal too little, dps:ers are hard to make work, tanks die quite easily and have no real dps whatsoever. Everything about WAR just feels lackluster and uninspiring to me. I never get "F*** yeah I'm the win" feeling that is common in WoW, even when single boxing.

As it looks now, I will stop playing WAR entirely. The game just doesn't appeal to me. It feels sluggish and boring.

[Kopitar]

My views:

I've tried several of the classes in WAR now.. to level 6-8.. and not a single one felt fun to play. I just feel weak and useless with all the classes. Healers heal too little, dps:ers are hard to make work, tanks die quite easily and have no real dps whatsoever. Everything about WAR just feels lackluster and uninspiring to me. I never get "F*** yeah I'm the win" feeling that is common in WoW, even when single boxing.

As it looks now, I will stop playing WAR entirely. The game just doesn't appeal to me. It feels sluggish and boring.

Tanks get much tougher after the first few levels and can do same insane damage.

[thinus]

My views:

I've tried several of the classes in WAR now.. to level 6-8.. and not a single one felt fun to play. I just feel weak and useless with all the classes. Healers heal too little, dps:ers are hard to make work, tanks die quite easily and have no real dps whatsoever. Everything about WAR just feels lackluster and uninspiring to me. I never get "F*** yeah I'm the win" feeling that is common in WoW, even when single boxing.

As it looks now, I will stop playing WAR entirely. The game just doesn't appeal to me. It feels sluggish and boring.

Which means you were maximum level 8 in a scenario. Each level makes a huge difference. We had a lvl 11 that dinged lvl 12 inside a scenario and absolutely tore everyone up. Doing the T1 scenarios at lvl 11 means you get to pwn all the low levels. Which healer did you play? Healing is tricky at those low levels. I played a DoK and an Archmage, getting used to healing with them is tricky, it is not as simple as in WoW. With the DoK you need to be out there swinging your sword to keep building the points you need to cast your heals. It is also important to pick who you are healing. Any tank can probably take a lot of punishment if they have a shield on. Casters are usually going to go down quick unless you pick the high level ones. With the Archmage I just keep dumping HoTs on everyone as it costs me a bit of action points but they regen quickly. The Archmage gets a proper heal only at about lvl 8 or 9 I think but it has a long cast time unless you are able to build magic focus by doing dmg which is really difficult to manage. You won't be casting that heal on anyone getting focus fired except a good tank. My usual tactic would be to cast my morale heal followed by the long cast heal while my 2 HoTs are ticking.

[Barman]

My views:

I've tried several of the classes in WAR now.. to level 6-8.. and not a single one felt fun to play. I just feel weak and useless with all the classes. Healers heal too little, dps:ers are hard to make work, tanks die quite easily and have no real dps whatsoever. Everything about WAR just feels lackluster and uninspiring to me. I never get "F*** yeah I'm the win" feeling that is common in WoW, even when single boxing.

As it looks now, I will stop playing WAR entirely. The game just doesn't appeal to me. It feels sluggish and boring.I had the same view on those levels. My chosen is now level 25. With sorc buff and his career tactis he is now building enough hate to aoe tank. DPS with the sorc is great and a zealot can heal me quite easily even if three of us fighting a hero on our level.

[Sanctume]

My views:

I've tried several of the classes in WAR now.. to level 6-8.. and not a single one felt fun to play. I just feel weak and useless with all the classes. Healers heal too little, dps:ers are hard to make work, tanks die quite easily and have no real dps whatsoever. Everything about WAR just feels lackluster and uninspiring to me. I never get "F*** yeah I'm the win" feeling that is common in WoW, even when single boxing.

As it looks now, I will stop playing WAR entirely. The game just doesn't appeal to me. It feels sluggish and boring.What class in WoW at level 6 or 8 made your say "F yeah, I'm the win?"

Maybe there are a few: Twinked Hunters, Rogues, Mages and Warrior. No way a priest, druid, shaman.

Rune Priest can actually laugh at a same level melee tank at Rank 11, 1v1. A Rune Priest has instant HoT and Heals and bubble. Dot and a Rune Nuke.

[Prepared]

Yes, I agree with this subject header. War Hammer Online sucks. The installation doesn't even work.

[Kopitar]

Installation works fine....

[Prepared]

Installation works fine....

Not on Windows Vista it doesn't. It doesn't create an icon to start the game from on the Desktop or in All programs. The icon is buried in the Games folder. The installation of the EA Download Manager is not needed and the instructions are very vague about the use of it.

[kadaan]

My opinions, based on leveling a 29 DoK, 17 Sorc, 11 WE, and 10 Zealot.

Pros:
Leveling in PvP. Gaining experience in pvp, along with a separate pvp level is a great idea. Class/Race restricted gear. There's not much fighting over loot, as in general only one class can use a particular drop. I've yet to see a boss drop loot that nobody can use (14 classes per side, 6 people in a group, and I've done Gunbad a half dozen times and the drops have always been for one of the 6 people present.) Public Quests. Great way to do group-based PvE that doesn't require as much of a time investment as an instance run. They're also great scripted events that are quite fun. Class variety. Even though there are only 4 archetypes (Tank, Healer, Melee, Ranged), no two races share the same class. Interface customization. The in-game Layout Editor is the best thing to come to a game's UI. 50/50 server pop caps. Each faction has a separate concurrency cap. If there are 1500 destruction and 500 order online, a destruction player may have to wait in a queue while the order player can log straight in. The Tome of Knowledge. WoW achievements, but 10x better. Healing is FUN. With lots of instant heals, HoTs, and AE heals, there's no healer shortage (6/14 people in my guild over 30 are healers.)

Cons:
Poor graphic performance. I get 120 FPS in WoW on max settings. I get ~30-40FPS in WAR on max settings (hard to tell, since they don't have a way to show it, but it's mostly smooth with frequent stutters.) It runs about the same as AoC did on my machine (C2Quad, 8800GT 512, XP, 4G RAM.) On max settings it looks about the same as WoW, and definitely worse than AoC. Mail lag. Oh. My. God. There is NO REASON why it needs to take 5-10s to open a mail, 5-10s to get the item out of it, and 5-10s to delete it. And that's during off-hours, during peak it can take over a minute. Too many Public Quests. There are generally 2-3 per zone, which is a level range of maybe 2 levels. People tend to grind on the first to max out their chapter influence then skip the rest, which means nobody really does them. They should have stuck to one PQ per chapter. On my DoK I haven't been able to complete a PQ since around level 12 (so no PQ for 17 levels.) Too many snares, roots, knockbacks. Seems like every class has them, and some get more than others (Ironbreakers... grrrrr...) Melee range 100 yard AE knockback? In a scenario with lava? Bad idea. There's a reason why I refuse to queue for Tor Anroc anymore. Ability latency. Not so noticable for melee, but for casters it's really annoying. You hit the ability, you pray it goes off. Sometimes I'll spam the hotkey 4-5 times before it finally casts. This is even worse with Morale abilities, where sometimes I'll sit there spamming it 10-20 times before it actually goes off. The best part is that the animation displays every time, even if it didn't actually go off. Crafting. Sucks. Badly. 5 gathering 2 production? And the 2 production ones are basically WoW's Jewelcrafting (gems only) and Alchemy (elixirs/pots only.) Chat system sucks. They're still working on it, but it's horrid. No official forums. People praise WAR for how there's no 'WoW General Forum' in WAR. Well that's because WAR DOESNT EVEN HAVE OFFICIAL FORUMS. Their devs wander around the fansite forums, but all the moderation is done by the fansites themselves (good in that they can be more ban-happy, bad in that there's no one-spot to go for information.) At the very least they should have made an official tech support forum. "Lets make grey items that hide on a quest tab in your inventory you have to right-click on to complete a quest, but we won't stick a USE: text on it or anything!" = bad idea You have to accept EULA EVERY SINGLE TIME you run the game Travel is tedious. I realize I'm just spoiled from WoW, but there are far too few flight paths in WAR for my liking. Auto bag size increase. You start with 2 'bags' and get an additional one every 10 levels. It's kinda nice, but it's very frustrating making an alt and having to play the first 10 levels with little to no inventory space. Leveling speed is horrible. 1-10 is fast, then suddenly 10-20 is slow. 20-30 has been horrible, and after about 5h playtime to get halfway through 29 on my DoK, I can't bring myself to play it anymore. With 80 RvR levels, you'd think they'd make it fast to hit the normal level cap, and long to hit the RvR cap.TL;DR version: WAR has some great ideas and I've definitely gotten my $50 worth, but it's just not fun enough to keep me away from WoW after my free month is over.

[Prepared]

My opinions, based on leveling a 29 DoK, 17 Sorc, 11 WE, and 10 Zealot.

Pros:
Leveling in PvP. Gaining experience in pvp, along with a separate pvp level is a great idea. Class/Race restricted gear. There's not much fighting over loot, as in general only one class can use a particular drop. I've yet to see a boss drop loot that nobody can use (14 classes per side, 6 people in a group, and I've done Gunbad a half dozen times and the drops have always been for one of the 6 people present.) Public Quests. Great way to do group-based PvE that doesn't require as much of a time investment as an instance run. They're also great scripted events that are quite fun. Class variety. Even though there are only 4 archetypes (Tank, Healer, Melee, Ranged), no two races share the same class. Interface customization. The in-game Layout Editor is the best thing to come to a game's UI. 50/50 server pop caps. Each faction has a separate concurrency cap. If there are 1500 destruction and 500 order online, a destruction player may have to wait in a queue while the order player can log straight in. The Tome of Knowledge. WoW achievements, but 10x better. Healing is FUN. With lots of instant heals, HoTs, and AE heals, there's no healer shortage (6/14 people in my guild over 30 are healers.)

Cons:
Poor graphic performance. I get 120 FPS in WoW on max settings. I get ~30-40FPS in WAR on max settings (hard to tell, since they don't have a way to show it, but it's mostly smooth with frequent stutters.) It runs about the same as AoC did on my machine (C2Quad, 8800GT 512, XP, 4G RAM.) On max settings it looks about the same as WoW, and definitely worse than AoC. Mail lag. Oh. My. God. There is NO REASON why it needs to take 5-10s to open a mail, 5-10s to get the item out of it, and 5-10s to delete it. And that's during off-hours, during peak it can take over a minute. Too many Public Quests. There are generally 2-3 per zone, which is a level range of maybe 2 levels. People tend to grind on the first to max out their chapter influence then skip the rest, which means nobody really does them. They should have stuck to one PQ per chapter. On my DoK I haven't been able to complete a PQ since around level 12 (so no PQ for 17 levels.) Too many snares, roots, knockbacks. Seems like every class has them, and some get more than others (Ironbreakers... grrrrr...) Melee range 100 yard AE knockback? In a scenario with lava? Bad idea. There's a reason why I refuse to queue for Tor Anroc anymore. Ability latency. Not so noticable for melee, but for casters it's really annoying. You hit the ability, you pray it goes off. Sometimes I'll spam the hotkey 4-5 times before it finally casts. This is even worse with Morale abilities, where sometimes I'll sit there spamming it 10-20 times before it actually goes off. The best part is that the animation displays every time, even if it didn't actually go off. Crafting. Sucks. Badly. 5 gathering 2 production? And the 2 production ones are basically WoW's Jewelcrafting (gems only) and Alchemy (elixirs/pots only.) Chat system sucks. They're still working on it, but it's horrid. No official forums. People praise WAR for how there's no 'WoW General Forum' in WAR. Well that's because WAR DOESNT EVEN HAVE OFFICIAL FORUMS. Their devs wander around the fansite forums, but all the moderation is done by the fansites themselves (good in that they can be more ban-happy, bad in that there's no one-spot to go for information.) At the very least they should have made an official tech support forum. "Lets make grey items that hide on a quest tab in your inventory you have to right-click on to complete a quest, but we won't stick a USE: text on it or anything!" = bad idea You have to accept EULA EVERY SINGLE TIME you run the game Travel is tedious. I realize I'm just spoiled from WoW, but there are far too few flight paths in WAR for my liking. Auto bag size increase. You start with 2 'bags' and get an additional one every 10 levels. It's kinda nice, but it's very frustrating making an alt and having to play the first 10 levels with little to no inventory space. Leveling speed is horrible. 1-10 is fast, then suddenly 10-20 is slow. 20-30 has been horrible, and after about 5h playtime to get halfway through 29 on my DoK, I can't bring myself to play it anymore. With 80 RvR levels, you'd think they'd make it fast to hit the normal level cap, and long to hit the RvR cap.TL;DR version: WAR has some great ideas and I've definitely gotten my $50 worth, but it's just not fun enough to keep me away from WoW after my free month is over.

Extremely nicely writen with just the right amount of detail. After playing it for about 2 hours, I think I'm done. They can have my $100 for the two accounts I created on there. I thought it was something in my setup where it kept asking for the acceptance of the EULA. Thanks for confirming that along with some other things that I had wondered about... Back to work on my WoW alts...

[Sanctume]

WAR is PVP and I enjoy pvp more than pve.
WoW is PVE, I don't like investing a whole lot of real life time sink doing raids.

I won't know 100% sure if I'm going to stick around for WAR's RvR end game. I've rolled 4 sets of 2-boxed toons to Rank 20 already, and I do feel burnt out doing the low levels--luckily, my guild moved to a nice server where the T1 and T2 scenarios pops faily fast (less than 5 minutes) that I hardly did pve/quests to reach Rank 20 this time around.

Speaking of levelling grind, I'm not sure how I feel when WotLK comes out to grind 10 more levels to 80 and do the whole gearing up via honor/arena bullcrap.

[Kopitar]

Hmm i have Vista 64, and it installed fine for me, you forgot where you installed the game to and couldn't find the exe?

[oxxo]

WAR is a good PvP game.

I think it's really silly to be bashing WAR for not being as polished as WoW.

Anyone who played at release knows what a mess WoW was back then.

[Raskaz]

Ofc Warhammer is far more PvP based then WoW but that doesn't mean you can draw some comparison between both games since it all comes down how much fun a game is.

I played a black Orc to Lvl22 and have to admit I was really impressed. There is really a lot of nice stuff in there and you can see how much time and effort these guys at Mystic have put into the game during its development.

The thing I really like it the guild progression where certain features such as standards, special tactics and much more become available after a certain progression threshold has been passed.

I think Kadaan brought up some serious good points about the pros and cons about this game.

The thing which finally got me back to WoW is the lack of variety.

Right now you have RvR, PvE via quests and Scenarios.

On my server (due to population imbalance like on most) the queue times are a nightmare. I haven't been able to get into a single scenario since I hit lvl20.

So I did some RvR which is fun but due to the lack of flightmasters it really takes a while to get there and quite often by the time you finally arrive the there isn't much to defend or attack since you're just too late.

PvE is actually what really really put me off, which might be due to the fact I leveled so many toons ins WoW so the whole process of getting into the endgame content feels more lilke a chore instead of fun to me.

The mobs have some insane respawn times (makes sense with PQ though), combine that with their follow-range and most of them having some sort of range attack, makes questing just a real pain.

On my Orc I can easily put up a fight with 4+ mobs unless you mix some hero into it but the fights are just dragging on forever. I basically facepalming my keyboard like in WoW, hiting the same buttons all over again just for much longer.

I am still postively impressed by the release. It is quite stable, a lot of work have been put into it but it still needs a lot of polish.

Wotlk will most likely be the same WoW grind we all now and maybe by the time people have gone through it for the most part, Warhammer might have improved and will offer a really good alternative for people who just stay with WoW due to the lack of options gaming wise.