Blizzard responds to Nostalrius discussion

[valkry]

I've been saying that for years @EaTCarbS.

They've essentially shot themselves in the foot with all conveniences thrown into the game. There are basic psychological principles in gaming and sport and then a few more for MMOs.

1. Challenge - doesn't really matter what the reward is here. It just has to be locked behind some effort.
2. Anonymity kills community. LFR and LFD killed community. That is indisputable.
3. Risk - nothing in this game is a gamble. Even time. You die you're right back in where you were before you died almost instantaneously. The rez timer is a joke.

There was an interview someone posted on the WoW general forum a while back that Watcher had. About combat pacing. This interview told me all I need to know that their focus is entirely on the wrong thing. When asked about combat pacing in questing he commented that they felt the battles ended too early. That they should be a few seconds longer. Well, that's the problem right there. That line of thinking.

Look at how popular Dark Souls is and ask yourself about pacing in that game. If you've mastered the game then nothing takes a great deal of time. The game can be done in an hour. But if you don't know the game it can take you weeks.

That is what is missing in WoW. The gap between novice and master is so blurred right now that nothing feels like a challenge nor something to get better at. It just feels like a waste of time.

This is so true, the same is kinda the same with Monster Hunter, at first it takes ages, then as you get better you can smash it out. But it takes a long grind to be able to get that skill, it isn't gifted in the form of powerful stats.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

2. Anonymity kills community. LFR and LFD killed community. That is indisputable.

Fair enough, though some balance between that and the RAID OR DIE design decisions has to be maintained; I suspect LFR was the only way forward if raiding was the only way to succeed at the new challenge/mythic dungeon models.

[Bigfish]

I don't think LFG/LFR really killed the community. I'd blame shrinking/mismanaged server populations causing a feed back loop of the community getting worse so people quit so the community gets worse. LFG/LFR is a good tool, but it needs to facilitate guild recruitment and friending other players. I've met some great people in LFG, and the sad thing was I couldn't get to their server or play with them again because it costs money. Right now battle groups and cross realm zones are a confusing cluster. Assuming the structure hasn't changed from how I think it is. Not playing for years puts you out of touch with how things work.

All that and content droughts. It's real easy to come back, gear up, and clear everything, and quit again. No real reason to stick around, especially if your server sucks. I think that's a big part of the appeal of vanilla/ progress servers. You have people running content instead of having everyone at max level running 1 raid that means anything.

[Fat Tire]

Fair enough, though some balance between that and the RAID OR DIE design decisions has to be maintained; I suspect LFR was the only way forward if raiding was the only way to succeed at the new challenge/mythic dungeon models.

Yup. Without lfr/lfd my wife and I would have quit in cata. Neither of us have any desire to return to raid or die or any facsimile of it ever again after vanilla, bc and wotlk.

[MadMilitia]

Fair enough, though some balance between that and the RAID OR DIE design decisions has to be maintained; I suspect LFR was the only way forward if raiding was the only way to succeed at the new challenge/mythic dungeon models.

The balance is to just stop the raid or die nonsense. Clearly it isn't working even with LFR in the game.

It isn't unreasonable that a player should be able to get end game gear without raiding. Make difficult 5 man content already. This is usually where the peanut gallery says ho, ho, they can't do that!

Sure they can.

In fact they can make end game content for solo scenarios, 5s, 10s and 20s. Then counterbalance it with loot table drop percentages. So that solo play can reward the same end game gear but does so at a much slower rate than 20s. That fixes the problem with raid or die. LFR isn't needed.

[Ughmahedhurtz]

The balance is to just stop the raid or die nonsense. Clearly it isn't working even with LFR in the game.

It isn't unreasonable that a player should be able to get end game gear without raiding. Make difficult 5 man content already. This is usually where the peanut gallery says ho, ho, they can't do that!

Sure they can.

In fact they can make end game content for solo scenarios, 5s, 10s and 20s. Then counterbalance it with loot table drop percentages. So that solo play can reward the same end game gear but does so at a much slower rate than 20s. That fixes the problem with raid or die. LFR isn't needed.

I don't disagree, but that discussion always goes in predictable ways when the WoW devs get involved.

[EaTCarbS]

I don't disagree, but that discussion always goes in predictable ways when the WoW devs get involved.

"You think you do, but you don't"

[MadMilitia]

Yeah I've never actually talked to a dev on WoW regarding the raid or die ideology. Though I would love to.

Anyway I'd like to think those psychology credits in college could pay off at some point

[Kruschpakx4]

after that discussion I had to dig out an ancient hard drive and actually found a screenshot of (probably) my very first oneshot lol, it was sitting (drinking) druid and back in the days the first hit on a sitting target was a guaranteed critical strike, so stormstrike+auto hit+windfury did all crit . Damn it now I really want to play that shit again lol



fyi: waffe des windzorns: windfury

And of course, not a single keybind haha

[ebony]

dam look at all them spells!!!!